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FFS grow up and start to think for yourself. As they say "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter", I do get what you mean but the only moderate that's truly crushed is the one in a powerful but fearful nation.

Well, gosh. I sure do feel better now that I've heard your opinion on the matter, one that I even preemptively tried to address (bolded) when posting: " I’m reminded of slavery in the US. The slaves knew they’d be shot if they tried to escape the plantation, yet they still tried. Not a perfect comparison, but hopefully frames the logic you’re using in a light that makes it easier to recognize the flaw."

! Moderator Note We’re done here.

Then it's a good thing the Jewish people aren't trying to live in Egypt. Why does it matter if there is no evidence Jewish people were ever in Egypt? Palestinians, while having been in that territory for several hundreds of years, were not the first. But regardless, even then, the last is Israel's. They were given it. In fact, they were given it when they were "relocated there from parts of Europe". You know. After the Holocaust, and most of the world decided to let Jews have their own country to live in. Additionally, that country is not some massive piece of land. It's less than 70% the size of Maryland. As for the land Israel supposedly "conquered from the Palestinian", you're only told half the story. What they didn't tell you is that the Egyptians had more than 100,000 troops there and just under 1,000 tanks, and had just announced to the world they were going to invade Israel and exterminate the Jews. Israel promptly moved their forces against Egypt and inflicted heavy losses. Sure, you could say it was unprovoked, and then I can say you're blind. However, while Israel was busy fighting Egyptian forces, Syria and Jordan, two massive countries to the North and East of Israel, both simultaneously invaded as well. Jordan invaded the west bank, and Syria invaded Golan heights, both supported by the Soviet Union. Israel managed to respond to over them, and after repelling the more than 100,000 soldiers pouring into their country seized the west bank and East Jerusalem. All this, with less than 1,000 casualties on the Israeli side. Comparing it to slavery is a terrible comparison. The Palestinians who were shot are from outside of Israel. Nobody is forcing them to protest, nobody is holding them captive, nobody is forcing them to do anything. Israel made it very clear. Do not approach the fence, or we will shoot you. They used tear gas and rubber bullets to keep them away from the fence for weeks. Yet they still pushed towards the fence, hurled rocks and whatever else they could find at the Isralies, and called for the death of Israel. Peaceful. When they swarmed the fence, the Israelis opened fire. This isn't covered by fact. Let's look at all the times they were offered their own state and land. Even Jerusalem. In 1937, the Peel Commission proposed the partition of Palestine and the creation of an Arab state. In 1939, the British White Paper proposed the creation of a unitary Arab state. In 1947, the UN would have created an even larger Arab state as part of its partition plan. The 1979 Egypt-Israel peace negotiations offered the Palestinians autonomy, which would almost certainly have led to full independence. The Oslo agreements of the 1990s laid out a path for Palestinian independence, but the process was derailed by terrorism. In 2000, Prime Minister Ehud Barak offered to create a Palestinian state in all of Gaza and 97 percent of the West Bank. In 2008, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert offered to withdraw from almost the entire West Bank and partition Jerusalem on a demographic basis. In addition from 1948 to 1967, Israel did not control the West Bank. The Palestinians could have demanded an independent state from the Jordanians. On the contrary whilst Jordan was in control Arafat said there was no longer a claim as it was no longer part of Palestine. Once it was back in Israeli hands it miraculously became disputed land again! This is one of many reasons Jews and Israelis are cynical. So you would propose they do what? Wait until the protesters were actively killing them before shooting? Yes. We're so cruel. Israel moved THEIR embassy, from inside THEIR country, to another place inside THEIR capital. Just terrible.

How would you suggest they deal with thousands of people, some with bombs strapped to them, all of them calling for blood and death to Israeli people, marching towards your fence without stopping when told to turn around. Let them through the fence where they can start their murder campaign? Just sit and see if the fence holds up to their wire cutters? Come on! I know it is a horrible state of affairs, but what do you do when 10K angry arabs are marching at you demanding your death and that your heart be ripped out? I do not think they had a choice. Kill or be killed in that situation. Saying this - I wasn't there so I only know what I heard on the Radio this morning and from reading about a bit.

It’s even worse when shown beside the selfie they decided to take today:

Firstly I believe in this day and age, the only defined singularity in a BH, is at the quantum/Planck level where our laws of physics and GR are not applicable. Certainly not due to infinite spacetime curvature and/or density. When we say one would be spaghetified, we are imagining falling in say feet first. The spacetime curvature differential from your head to your toes would be such that spaghetification would happen. Surviving inside a BH is a valid concept, if the BH was large enough and obviously the spacetime curvature less severe, with little tidal gravity affects. A SMBH similar to what exists at the core of most galaxies would be able to be entered without immediate fear of spaghetification. Spacetime

https://phys.org/news/2018-05-evidence-plumes-jupiter-moon-europa.html Old NASA spacecraft points to new evidence of watery plumes over Europa May 14, 2018: A fresh look at data from a 1997 flyby of Jupiter's moon, Europa, suggests that NASA's Galileo spacecraft flew directly through a watery plume, raising hopes of probing the jets for signs of life around the second planet from Earth. The revelations Monday came after scientists revisited a puzzling reading from an instrument aboard Galileo, which in 1995 became the first spacecraft to enter the orbit of a gas giant planet. What they found was the most direct evidence yet of plumes emerging from Europa's frozen surface, researchers reported in the scientific journal Nature Astronomy. Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2018-05-evidence-plumes-jupiter-moon-europa.html#jCp ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: the paper: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41550-018-0450-z Evidence of a plume on Europa from Galileo magnetic and plasma wave signatures: Abstract: The icy surface of Jupiter’s moon, Europa, is thought to lie on top of a global ocean1,2,3,4. Signatures in some Hubble Space Telescope images have been associated with putative water plumes rising above Europa’s surface5,6, providing support for the ocean theory. However, all telescopic detections reported were made at the limit of sensitivity of the data5,6,7, thereby calling for a search for plume signatures in in-situ measurements. Here, we report in-situ evidence of a plume on Europa from the magnetic field and plasma wave observations acquired on Galileo’s closest encounter with the moon. During this flyby, which dropped below 400 km altitude, the magnetometer8 recorded an approximately 1,000-kilometre-scale field rotation and a decrease of over 200 nT in field magnitude, and the Plasma Wave Spectrometer9 registered intense localized wave emissions indicative of a brief but substantial increase in plasma density. We show that the location, duration and variations of the magnetic field and plasma wave measurements are consistent with the interaction of Jupiter’s corotating plasma with Europa if a plume with characteristics inferred from Hubble images were erupting from the region of Europa’s thermal anomalies. These results provide strong independent evidence of the presence of plumes at Europa. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: I don't really believe there was really much doubt anyway re Europa having an Ocean of sorts underneath its icy surface, and evidenced by the noticable cracks and changes that appear on occasions.

You should read article about Jupiter moon, Io. In this body heating is much more impressive. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_heating_of_Io https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_heating

Surges when you first turn the supply on are common- it takes a finite time for the bits of metal to move and throttle the supply. In principle, you should always turn the regulator "off" before connecting the supply (I'm not sure anyone actually does this unless it's critical). Surges during the day for no reason seem to me to be saying it's time to replace the regulator. Adding some sort of buffer volume may reduce the magnitude of the surge, especially if it is preceded by a flow restriction of some sort.

Many people are incapable of reproduction yet they are undoubtedly aware.

Indeed but never an excuse. http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/u-s-blocks-investigation-60-gaza-protestors-killed-article-1.3990469

Being fair - answer the kid's question...... what options did they have really? Apart from rubber bullets and water cannons, what do you propose they do when 10 thousand people come marching at them? They knew that Hamas had called for blood in the streets of Israel and for the hearts of Israelis to be ripped out - How are they supposed to respond? I don't like it either - I think they are too heavy handed, but, they get the kind of results that end with minimum loss of Israeli life whilst sending the message that they won't be attacked without extreme retaliation. I still think that bulldozing mecca and the holy of holies is the answer - take that BS away from both sides - when that place is no more it kinda proves both of their books as works of fiction as they promise the area to both. It says their gods can't be defeated. Destroy that BS place and we are on the road to proving that their prophecies are BS. As I said - I'm pulling out of this if I can. I'll let you have the last word if you want it. I think it is Zumba or something like that. ;-) .... no - I looked it up - it is zythum!

It would take ages to dig up a hundred different ideas on what light actually is. So help if you can! Lets keep it to a very short paragraph of 2-4 sentences, assuming everyone knows everything about particle physics. Two word introductions! (I believe, Light is, We think, etc) I will start with my more recent conjecture. I believe light may be a string of sub-quark matter, created by high-energy quantum interactions and amplified by converging and colliding wavelengths. If a confinement medium is in place, they may become any number of known and unknown sub-particles, and interact henceforth. The center of the wavelength would be something similar to the higgs bosun.

I do read. That source makes an unsubstantiated claim. They are the ones who say that Israel is worried about racial purity. Not Israel. That's hardly proof. It'd be like me saying "The U.K. is only worried about racial purity" and then saying that's my source. If I have nothing to back it up, then what is the point?

I was hoping an adult would respond here. All I need is someone who can possibly help with my first question. Sorry they didnt speak perfect English for you to understand? Amazing you cant grasp that. Water lily you Che, the Water lily lord. For Ti SIHI We’re upright you NaH (Sodium hydride) for Heaven. To place in Heaven Czech (regret, contempt) divination Hybrid Tan ( Hide that has been treated with Uv) case you Thesis you chicken alloy You crushed binary analog. Yx the person Jola, of Africa (or Yola) Binary set fever for Mendel Binary yoc HAA for Mendel. Binary CIC population for Mendel ( gene Plays a role in brain development - Adversely ) Sikh the person Chewa - The Chewa are a Bantu people of central and southern Africa loline alkaloids to men Purgatory Beware Sikh the person was water lily you ch One binary you the chicken to Ay Bucky Hybrid - BUCKy is a C++ program that implements Bayesian concordance analysis. The method uses a non-parametric clustering of genes with compatible trees, and reconstructs the primary concordance tree from clades supported by the largest proportions of genes. Chac Mool water lily be there Ti plasmid binary brother (friars) to binary copy. You crushed binary analog. Yx the person Jola, of Africa. One binary disease Bull Akan One binary disease you pach - Mutant gene Ma water lily is science YX Titi Mine YX Titi permeant stain YX Titi - A New World monkey of the genus Callicebus, native to South America, Tech books Czech divination Hybrid You crushed binary set Analog IX Goddess O You Columbian cħ Augustine (Friar) now, you Columbian unremovable stain. You petro binary Ti Micheal ch ab Micheal were killed Micheal wall. You label binary Pach can shaman analog The person books beware Books you Essex The binary disease population. You effect binary analog IX make you hole when You are cħ Aryl Hydrocarbon Hydroxylase (AHH) you Columbian Analog so item regret/contempt yes Pulex (Flea) to you to make cħ aabe, you to make an unremovable stain Peak cħ in virgin Kaka You lucky OC to hole - The Congregation of the Oratory of Jesus and Mary Immaculate - Jesuits Control Ti for control Ti The Goat. Divination Hybrid basin, demon Hybrid basin. Czech control ti to, Czech control ti The Goat Blue coal cħ from cubic Thorns sing your highness Jackal false. Your highness sacral false. One binary disease boil like a branch Czech (regret, contempt) divination Hybrid Tons trample slaughter human bodies to, slaughter human body night. I can handle Amen Its actual run straight through Google translate kid. Balam church where the speaking cross was that the priests spoke oracles through Kiss my ass. No Christians that are going to freak out please. Im not here for that crap. From the enslaved populace, songs, chants and demands, while Princes and Lords are held captive in layers. These will in the future by headless adamants, be received as divine prayers - Nastradomous Ix Tab, Tabbay - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ixtab IX - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IX_monogram Tabbay - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Thomas's_Abbey,_Brno Another line. IX sacred shell science. and they did. Strange - “Facts don’t come naturally. Drama and opinions do. Factual knowledge has to be learned.” You keep your kid and sit back and learn something instead. You have zero to offer otherwise.

Yes. Three of the people who were killed were setting up explosives on the fence BTW and laying down mines. But sure. It's just an excuse to shoot them. Yes. Those little cunts. Shooting people who were just innocently laying down explosives. I'm sure they weren't going to do anything with them. https://www.timesofisrael.com/clashes-erupt-along-gaza-israel-border-ahead-of-us-embassy-inauguration/ "The army said three of those killed were trying to plant explosives at the border fence. In three separate incidents, Palestinian gunmen opened fire at Israeli troops, according to the IDF." But sure. It's just genocide and excuses right? You're insane if you believe that.

I'm done with this discussion. Nobody will answer any of the questions I have. All you guys will do is say how Israel is like Nazi's, how terrible they are, how they shouldn't be doing that(yet you refuse to give any examples of what else), and essentially make it clear how much you ignore history. You act like Israel is the aggressor here. They literally only moved their Embassy to Jerusalem. That's it. And suddenly, they're cruel people who are anti-semantics against the poor Palestinians. And the Palestinians, mind you, have sworn to exterminate the Jews. And you wonder why they don't want to let them in. Israel told them clearly, if they attempted to climb, breach, or cut the fence, they would be shot at. They did just that. And then when they got shot at, it's suddenly Israeli aggression. Get ahold of yourselves. This is ridiculous. Israeli Defense Forces. But if you think they're biased, let's go with the Hama's. The ones literally holding the protests: http://www.businessinsider.com/gaza-violence-hamas-role-israel-embassy-us-2018-5 "We are excited to storm and get inside ... whatever is possible, to kill"

Eise; We meet again. So you think that Feynman knew what he was talking about? Then why did he have such contempt for Philosophy? After I realized how brilliant he was,, I wondered about that until I read an article that explained that Feynman took a Philosophy class while at University and walked away thinking that it was the biggest bunch of nonsense that he had ever heard. Likewise -- we are all anonymous here. It is clear that you know a great deal about Science, but I have not seen evidence that you understand Philosophy. In my thread about truth, right, and wrong, I made a referral to your post in the thread that was a split from Sam Harris's thread. Your post in that thread had a down vote on it, which I did not give you, but I reversed because I do not believe in the down vote system. But to be perfectly honest, you earned that down vote because you side-stepped or did not answer any philosophical question that I asked you. You wanted to talk about Science, which is something that you know. I normally do not try to expose your ignorance of Philosophy because many here seem to think you a philosopher, but you are pushing me. Nonsense. If what you stated above were true, then how did the first philosophers become philosophers? Also consider that universities all over the country are removing Philosophy from their curriculum because they are starting to realize that what they are teaching is not working. Most are teaching a history of Philosophy going over the great philosophers' works and what has already been accomplished, along with a hefty dose of how to argue. Some don't even require a Logic or Critical Thinking class in order to get a degree. I tried a Philosophy class once and walked away thinking that it was the biggest bunch on nonsense that I had ever heard. The whole class was based on the Monism v Dualism debate, which I had already realized is nonsense, as it is not about consciousness; it is about power. Then you are wrong. In order to have ideological thinking, one has to have an ideal. In the study of consciousness, many believe that it is "God", or the brain, or the planet, or the Universe, or even illusion -- that is ideological thinking. Although I have considered each of these ideas, I am not ready to state that any are the answer because we still do not know WTF consciousness actually is or how it works. I follow whatever evidence that I can find, and I don't care if it is in a place that is popular or accepted, I just follow the evidence. No. If studying consciousness made one a philosopher, then the universities would be successful in their endeavors. It doesn't work that way. If you and iNow want me to be less snooty, then you might want to consider that this thread is called, "what is a god", not "What do we think of Gees". Apparently I am more interesting to discuss than "God", but it is not fair to the OP or the other members, who may want to discuss the topic. Maybe we could start a new topic in the Lounge and the Moderators could split off all the What About Gees posts. But that would be a lot of work for the Moderators just because a few members can not control themselves. Well you can right click your mouse and get a simplified definition of the word, consciousness, which is pretty accurate. If you want more, you can go to the SEP (the free on-line Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy) and read pages and pages of definition, or you can go with my simplified definition that consciousness is simply communication. I should probably elaborate before someone compares my answer to a radio. How that simple communication takes place and why it takes place and where it takes place and the parameters of consciousness are some of the questions that are so far unanswerable. I am aware of the theories of consciousness that state it is the Universe and of Panpsychism and of the Gaia hypothesis, so an argument can always be made that something is conscious. For this reason I focus the discussion that I am having about consciousness, because to do otherwise is insane and accomplishes nothing. In the post that Bender originally answered, I SPECIFICALLY stated that I was reserving these observations/ideas of consciousness to life forms -- that was the focus. Now, if Bender can not read, what is Bender doing in a forum? If Bender does not know what life forms are, then Bender should go to Biology to learn. If Bender simply does not care about what I stated and just wants to argue about consciousness, then what is Bender doing in this thread about "God", or are we supposed to believe that inanimate things worship a god? So no, I do not understand Bender's nonsense and suspect that he intended to take the subject off topic and to explain his ideas of AI and consciousness. No one can study everything. That is a silly observation. There are dozens of arguments against every view, which is why there is no comprehensive theory of consciousness. As I stated before universities teach wanna be philosophers how to argue, and sometimes teach them how to think. You seem to think that my thoughts were born the day before I joined this forum and I have not discussed them before. (chuckle) If you have a specific argument against one of my views, please do start a thread in the General Philosophy section stating your argument and be prepared to have evidence/logic supporting your argument. Psychology is a branch of the Discipline of Science. In this case the "we" is Religion. And what might that "something" be? Is it a secret? Or are you going to tell me? What I understand is that you routinely use the same words and don't seem to understand the idea in different words; like when you say "thinking about thinking" and I say "study of knowledge", you can not see the similarity. This makes me wonder if you understand the concept or if you are just parroting what you have been taught. This is interesting. Why is life not a closed system? Would an ecosystem be a closed system? What is a closed system? I know almost nothing about Science. Yes. If you read his Wiki page ten years ago, it was very interesting. Five years ago it was less so. Now they call him a crack-pot. Disappointing, but not really surprising as his ideas were not popular with Science and seriously disagreed with Christianity. Not long after he died, his ideas and worth started to lose momentum. They may even have taken down the site at the University because of peer pressure, but the evidence he gathered is still out there somewhere, so I will just have to find it. I know some was published. Everything is a misuse of the word "instinct". (chuckle) I worked a long thread in another Science forum years ago where we got seriously into the word, instinct, and a bigger mess I have never seen except possibly in the word, consciousness. I worked with a neurologist, an animal behaviorist, an archeologist, and a few other professionals and came away with the conclusion that it would take a brain like Einstein's that had been trained in consciousness, psychology, chemistry, animal behavior, and probably more, to straighten out that mess. This is the reason why I always refer to "survival instincts" as that seems to be the only area of "instincts" that has any validity. The rest of it is all a mishmash of nonsense. This is not true. All life is sentient -- that means it feels. Now we can satisfy our emotional needs by pretending it is otherwise and stating that all life "senses" or "perceives" or whatever, but this means that it feels. We can go the other way and say that some bacteria "knows" what it wants to absorb and what it wants to avoid, but that is going a bit too far because how could it possibly know anything without eyes, smell, ears, a brain, etc.? It senses and reacts without any decision as to what it should do, so it feels. This is the way that all survival instincts work, automatically without the necessity to think about it. A complex nervous system and brain are required to know that you are feeling or experiencing emotion. This is what philosophers used to call being aware that you are aware. A flower will turn to the sun, but does it know that this is the sun? Does it know that it needs the sun to survive? No. It just turns to the sun because it feels good and it wants that feeling. You mean like consciousness? Where everything only exists in our ideas? (chuckle) If you are going to push straight materialism, doesn't that mean that I get to go to the illusion theories? No Religion is not Science, on the other hand Science is not Religion. We have been through this before. Did you not understand or do you not believe me? A thousand years ago Religion thought it was the beginning and end of knowledge. Philosophy was acceptable if it supported Religion. Science was irrelevant because it studied things that were of no consequence, or it was dangerous. The result was the Dark Ages. Now Science is beginning to think it is the beginning and end of knowledge. Philosophy is acceptable if it supports Science. Religion is irrelevant because it studies things that are of no consequence, or it is dangerous. The result is the destruction of families, children raising themselves and shooting up schools, suicide, drug abuse, alcoholism, etc., or a breakdown in the social structure. To try to resolve this problem, we voted in Trump because everyone needs to feel safe and has a "daddy's lap" complex where we think his strength will make us safe. If you can not understand that we are physical, mental, and spiritual beings, and that these attributes need to be balanced -- or they will balance themselves -- then how can you call yourself a philosopher? What do you think evidence is? It is support. It is not proof. It is not a hypothesis. It is not a theory. It is just support that leads a person in a direction that can at some point possibly end in a hypothesis or theory. The problem with most of the theories of consciousness is that people did not gather enough evidence before deciding on their theories. I refuse to do that. Gee PS dimreepr: If you are still reading, you know this post is too long. It is not Eise's fault for writing a long post. It is, of course, my fault.

I can't believe this. There is a group of people. Who has sworn to exterminate the Jews. Who blame them for everything that's wrong with the world. A group of people whose main goal is to kill every man, woman, and child, who is a Jew in Israel. A group of people who are literally a terrorist organization. A group of people who have sent in suicide bombers and killed thousands around the world, and claim credit for doing so. And this same group, has organized a protest. A protest, where they scream for the blood of Jews. When interviewed, they promise that if they can get into the fence they'll rain bloodshed over all of Israel. They'll kill every man, woman, and child who is a Jew. They plant bombs. They throw grenades. They call for death. They shoot at the soldiers. They dig tunnels under the ground. If this was happening to any other country, that country would be actively invading them. And when Israel opens fire on them after warning them repeatedly, firing tear gas, smoke grenades, and rubber bullets, Israel is just a bunch of merciless pigs. And you guys cast your support behind them. You support the people screaming for the death of Jews. You support the mass extermination of Jews. You support the murder of millions of people. And yet, you guys call Israel the anti-semantics, the Nazis, and the aggressors. I'm done. I had so much respect for you guys. But you call for racial equality and tolerance and in the same breath support those who want another holocaust. It's just insane.

Well gee amazing how it incorrectly did it perfectly? Just go away already. Youre not here help. Youre a bored kid wanting argue and insult. We fucking shouldnt have missed this. They no longer can speak for themselves. If youre not help, then get the fuck out of my way because Im already pissed off. I sure dont have time for little ole you.