Scotty99

Its really a large combination of factors, the two main scientific observances for me are the cosmic microwave background readings and the fact the earth just so happens to occupy a region that is the largest void in the entire observable universe. https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/06/home-sweet-void/529623/ Relativity in itself is also a big one for me, at its core all relativity is is the penultimate example of occams razor. That is really just the tip of the iceberg for the how and why ive gotten to this point, but again i made the thread more as a curiosity as to why i seem to be nearly alone on this one. I think the scientific observations are growing to a point where the copernican principle is going to have to be looked at in a real way sometime soon but i just dont get why its not talked about more.

If i can deduce the earth is in a special spot in the cosmos surely some of you that post here regularly have as well. I do feel i am a pretty bright guy but honestly this was not that hard for me, nor should it be for anyone else with an inquisitive mind. What id like to know is how haven't more people come to the same conclusions i have? Like i stated above i do think i am bright but surely there are lots of people as smart or smarter than me who easily disregard the notion we are cosmically significant. I think most of it is people taking for granted long held beliefs and not bothering to do the research for themselves on the what and the why's that got a person like myself to this spot. Second could be they just dont want to admit their thoughts on a public forum, at least not on an avatar that is associated with them. Lastly i guess would be the people who just read forums such as this and never bother to post, maybe there are a good number of them who think like i do but would rather keep to themselves. I just feel so strongly about this one and its curious to me how science hasnt put the copernican principle through more scrutiny and even revist ideas that could possibly be better alternatives with what we know now. If people were simply able to remove biblical coincidences from scientific observance i think a real breakthrough could be made.

How are you sure?

https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2018-04/ras-pop040318.php Only the second study so far, but interesting nonetheless. I used to be one of those guys who thought it inevitable there was life out there somewhere, longer im alive the more i think it the other way round.

Oh im sure i sound like a fruit loop to you guys but thats fine im just spitballing. I noticed one thing interesting tho, the real hardcore science only guys never seem to post their ideas about a creator, even when you know they at least have an opinion.. The method prevents you from talking about it because there isnt observable evidence, does that not bother some of you a bit? Im 36. Never been good with people and decided if im not going to succeed in a normal life im gonna dedicate my time to something different, you know be the best you can be and all.

Because simply the knowledge of a creator would change everything, not sure how you can even ask that question. I also have employed occam's razor in getting to where im at now funny enough. As to the creator question ive never given a creator much thought beyond it wouldnt be one that writes a guide on how to live, i think that is taken care of automatically with natural selection. Edit, natural selection may be the wrong wording. I think in all honesty it was a set it and forget it type situation, the seed was planted and then everything else happened as it did. Probably the best way i could explain that.

No idea what a creative force even means. My best guess is nothing changes from how it is now, we are simply missing the knowledge of a creator. The universe is there to make us wonder and be inquisitive, simply knowing we have a creator does not change that. A lot of religions today can stimey that wonder, thats a big part of why i cant buy into any of them. The reason for the title is this, i feel that eventually science is going to have to reconcile we have a creator (again my opinion) but to get to THAT point people are going to need to seperate religious teachings from a creator. If we have a creator none of our religions have it right, people need to accept this first before they can accept a creator. A big ask but i feel its the truth and the only way we are going to move forward.

Again with the selective quoting strange, my goodness ive never seen such a pro troll lol. You need to be commended simply on your forum quoting skills. I already recommended the documentary the principle, while not exactly in line with my thoughts on the matter they get a LOT right. That is far easier to simply show people what kind of viewpoint i have here than listing 500 things in bulletpoint form.

Im not sure you realize how deep the rabbit hole goes. You cant just casually have a conversation that upends the foundations of cosmology, it takes time to not only process the information but to decipher it.

Why the hostility tho? I did in fact link a harvard study that suggests we need a whole new approach to inflation, this is where cosmology is at today......the big bang or CP has to go.

Oh im sure it will get closed, people round these parts will not hear that the precious CP is in jeopardy. Whats funny about this whole deal is that what im telling you guys is actually whats happening in the elite discussions of science today, you should be thanking me....

You are definitely worked up, you post instantly to my comments in a rather brash manner, while also ignoring the relevant parts of my posts. Maybe you should change your avatar to "selective quoter".

I realize you are just trying to get the thread locked at this point (even tho why i explained why i wasnt going into specifics in this thread) and thats fine, but what is it about my way of thinking that has you so worked up? I mean there really isnt a mystery on the specifics of what im talking about here, all you would need to do is search my past threads ive only made a few. Not sure if you are actually paying attention but most of the evidence that lead me to this conclusion is based on what we see in the sky, where exactly am i using faith based arguments?

If you are genuinely curious just go watch the documentary "the principle". Now dont get me wrong the producers of that film definitely have alterior motives, but i believe a lot of what is put forth is actually worth looking into.

Thats fine, as long as the thread exists my work is done. To be clear its not as if i didnt present evidence in my other threads, you just chose to disagree with the points that were brought up. The whole idea here is to make people aware of the problems in cosmology today, and its my belief that eventually science is going to have to revist the copernican principle if they want to move forward.

Spot on, people disagree and the thread gets no where. Im not looking to avoid "controversy" as you put it, i just know where that road leads and people are unwilling or rather unable to look at these problems in a fresh manner as someone new to all of this did 2 years ago.

Again ive made that thread here before, it devolves into nonsense because people agree to disagree on what the history ACTUALLY says. This isnt a black and white issue as it takes TIME to sort these things out when researching such difficult topics. If people are genuinely curious and have no idea what im talking about you would need to go back to galileo as a starting point of where i feel the discourse began. Again, i feel the evidence is there. Whoever's quote that is assumes a creator and evolution are incompatible, i dont see it that way at all......never have actually.

But im using science and cosmology as the basis of my evidence? If it wasnt for the things ive found in the past two years about the universe i likely would continue to be a nonbeliever as i once was, just like you.

That is simply a failure of the education system, as you have not been taught the true history cosmology far enough to understand what i am talking about. You took everything that was told to you for face value, i went the other direction and found some very interesting problems.

Again, i feel science took a wrong turn at the CP.......what more else do i have to say besides that? Surely you guys are bright enough to deduce some of the bullet points that would be inferred here. Edit: Here is the problem with scientific thinking minds, and why we could never see eye to eye. You dont care if you are right, as that isnt the goal of science. I put a challenge to myself two years ago to see how close to right i could get, and this is my best guess.

I already explained why i am not going to post all the specifics in this thread, its too big for that. It took me 2+ years to come to the conclusion i have.

To me the evidence is already there to be honest. But first science would rather chop at the big bang and what kind of variations they can come up with before messing with the CP, which is a mistake imo. You keep thinking i am some sort of religous person, i came to this conclusion based on what we see in the sky and earths bewildering history. Not one ounce of "evidence" from the bible or other religious text has me convinced we were created. You are like, the troll of the century actually.

Ahem: https://www.cfa.harvard.edu/~loeb/sciam3.pdf Its already starting strange... CP is one of those things that is so sacred its not even on the table to be looked at, even if that is the place science took a wrong turn (which is my opinion).

I think the debate would look something like this: "well crap space is definitely not as homogenous as first expected" "what do we do bob" "well we cant go back on the copernican principle thats for sure" "why not bob" "that would mean geocentrism could make a return to popularity" "why is that bad bob?" "because fred, if we arent random its possible were in a special place, and you know what that means" "oh i see, well cant we just get rid of the big bang bob"? "thats what were working on now fred" These are discussions that are happening today, bob and fred arent real people btw

What basic knowledge do you presume i lack? The only thing you know about me is that i disagree that the earth is in a random position in the universe. Actually disagree is probably the wrong wording, its not exactly at odds with our current understanding of the universe.