John316

The questions are not difficult to understand, how did the first living organism which they claim was a bacteria, form a membrane and organelle’s? These had to arise simultaneously to protect the DNA from being destroyed by the elements, also RNA had to exist for replication. Please read the facts below and respond as to why you believe that the first living bacteria did not have to follow these laws? how about we go light on the drama There are two different ways of grouping bacteria. They can be divided into three types based on their response to gaseous oxygen. Aerobic bacteria require oxygen for their health and existence and will die without it. Anerobic bacteria can't tolerate gaseous oxygen at all and die when exposed to it. Facultative aneraobes prefer oxygen, but can live without it. The second way of grouping them is by how they obtain their energy. Bacteria that have to consume and break down complex organic compounds are heterotrophs. This includes species that are found in decaying material as well as those that utilize fermentation or respiration. Bacteria that create their own energy, fueled by light or through chemical reactions, are autotrophs. • Capsule - Some species of bacteria have a third protective covering, a capsule made up of polysaccharides (complex carbohydrates). Capsules play a number of roles, but the most important are to keep the bacterium from drying out and to protect it from phagocytosis (engulfing) by larger microorganisms. The capsule is a major virulence factor in the major disease-causing bacteria, such as Escherichia coli and Streptococcus pneumoniae. Nonencapsulated mutants of these organisms are avirulent, i.e. they don't cause disease. • Cell Envelope - The cell envelope is made up of two to three layers: the interior cytoplasmic membrane, the cell wall, and -- in some species of bacteria -- an outer capsule. • Cell Wall - Each bacterium is enclosed by a rigid cell wall composed of peptidoglycan, a protein-sugar (polysaccharide) molecule. The wall gives the cell its shape and surrounds the cytoplasmic membrane, protecting it from the environment. It also helps to anchor appendages like the pili and flagella, which originate in the cytoplasm membrane and protrude through the wall to the outside. The strength of the wall is responsible for keeping the cell from bursting when there are large differences in osmotic pressure between the cytoplasm and the environment. Cell wall composition varies widely amongst bacteria and is one of the most important factors in bacterial species analysis and differentiation. For example, a relatively thick, meshlike structure that makes it possible to distinguish two basic types of bacteria. A technique devised by Danish physician Hans Christian Gram in 1884, uses a staining and washing technique to differentiate between the two forms. When exposed to a gram stain, gram-positive bacteria retain the purple color of the stain because the structure of their cell walls traps the dye. In gram-negative bacteria, the cell wall is thin and releases the dye readily when washed with an alcohol or acetone solution. • Cytoplasm - The cytoplasm, or protoplasm, of bacterial cells is where the functions for cell growth, metabolism, and replication are carried out. It is a gel-like matrix composed of water, enzymes, nutrients, wastes, and gases and contains cell structures such as ribosomes, a chromosome, and plasmids. The cell envelope encases the cytoplasm and all its components. Unlike the eukaryotic (true) cells, bacteria do not have a membrane enclosed nucleus. The chromosome, a single, continuous strand of DNA, is localized, but not contained, in a region of the cell called the nucleoid. All the other cellular components are scattered throughout the cytoplasm. • One of those components, plasmids, are small, extrachromosomal genetic structures carried by many strains of bacteria. Like the chromosome, plasmids are made of a circular piece of DNA. Unlike the chromosome, they are not involved in reproduction. Only the chromosome has the genetic instructions for initiating and carrying out cell division, or binary fission, the primary means of reproduction in bacteria. Plasmids replicate independently of the chromosome and, while not essential for survival, appear to give bacteria a selective advantage. Plasmids are passed on to other bacteria through two means. For most plasmid types, copies in the cytoplasm are passed on to daughter cells during binary fission. Other types of plasmids, however, form a tubelike structure at the surface called a pilus that passes copies of the plasmid to other bacteria during conjugation, a process by which bacteria exchange genetic information. Plasmids have been shown to be instrumental in the transmission of special properties, such as antibiotic drug resistance, resistance to heavy metals, and virulence factors necessary for infection of animal or plant hosts. The ability to insert specific genes into plasmids have made them extremely useful tools in the fields of molecular biology and genetics, specifically in the area of genetic engineering. • Cytoplasmic Membrane - A layer of phospholipids and proteins, called the cytoplasmic membrane, encloses the interior of the bacterium, regulating the flow of materials in and out of the cell. This is a structural trait bacteria share with all other living cells; a barrier that allows them to selectively interact with their environment. Membranes are highly organized and asymmetric having two sides, each side with a different surface and different functions. Membranes are also dynamic, constantly adapting to different conditions. • Flagella - Flagella (singular, flagellum) are hairlike structures that provide a means of locomotion for those bacteria that have them. They can be found at either or both ends of a bacterium or all over its surface. The flagella beat in a propeller-like motion to help the bacterium move toward nutrients; away from toxic chemicals; or, in the case of the photosynthetic cyanobacteria; toward the light. • Nucleoid - The nucleoid is a region of cytoplasm where the chromosomal DNA is located. It is not a membrane bound nucleus, but simply an area of the cytoplasm where the strands of DNA are found. Most bacteria have a single, circular chromosome that is responsible for replication, although a few species do have two or more. Smaller circular auxiliary DNA strands, called plasmids, are also found in the cytoplasm. • Pili - Many species of bacteria have pili (singular, pilus), small hairlike projections emerging from the outside cell surface. These outgrowths assist the bacteria in attaching to other cells and surfaces, such as teeth, intestines, and rocks. Without pili, many disease-causing bacteria lose their ability to infect because they're unable to attach to host tissue. Specialized pili are used for conjugation, during which two bacteria exchange fragments of plasmid DNA. • Ribosomes - Ribosomes are microscopic "factories" found in all cells, including bacteria. They translate the genetic code from the molecular language of nucleic acid to that of amino acids—the building blocks of proteins. Proteins are the molecules that perform all the functions of cells and living organisms. Bacterial ribosomes are similar to those of eukaryotes, but are smaller and have a slightly different composition and molecular structure. Bacterial ribosomes are never bound to other organelles as they sometimes are (bound to the endoplasmic reticulum) in eukaryotes, but are free-standing structures distributed throughout the cytoplasm. There are sufficient differences between bacterial ribosomes and eukaryotic ribosomes that some antibiotics will inhibit the functioning of bacterial ribosomes, but not a eukaryote's, thus killing bacteria but not the eukaryotic organisms they are infecting. http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/cells/bacteriacell.html

While irreducible complexity does not explicitly prove an intelligent Designer, and does not conclusively disprove evolution, it most definitely points to something outside of random processes in the origin and development of biological life. The origin of life might seem like the ultimate cold case: no one was there to observe it and much of the relevant evidence has been lost in the intervening 3.5 billion years or so. Nonetheless, many separate lines of evidence do shed light on this event, and as biologists continue to investigate these data, they are slowly piecing together a picture of how life originated. Major lines of evidence include DNA, biochemistry, and experiments. http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/side_0_0/origsoflife_05 DNA can be replicated but its origin is unknown. DNA will replicate its own arrangement of amino acids so evolution has decreased probability. Mutations do not explain evolution. Bacteria reproduce by binary fission. In this process the bacterium, which is a single cell, divides into two identical daughter cells. Binary fission begins when the DNA of the bacterium divides into two (replicates). The bacterial cell then elongates and splits into two daughter cells each with identical DNA to the parent cell. Each daughter cell is a clone of the parent cell. http://microbiologyonline.org.uk/about-microbiology/introducing-microbes/bacteria Bacterial transcription is the process in which messenger RNA transcripts of genetic material in bacteria are produced, to be translated for the production of proteins. Bacterial transcription occurs in the cytoplasm alongside translation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacterial_transcription RNA and Amino acids where they necessary to complete replication? did they spontaneously appear along with the the other organelle within the first cells on earth? Outer Membrane Protein Biosynthesis: Transport and Incorporation of OM Proteins (in)to the OM bilayer Kelly H. Kim, Suraaj Aulakh and Mark Paetzel The outer membrane is a unique structural feature of Gram-negative bacteria. Within the outer membrane reside β-barrel outer membrane proteins that serve many important functions, such as nutrient uptake, virulence and cell signaling. Proper folding and assembly of these proteins are therefore essential for cell viability. Gram-negative bacteria possess a specialized proteinaceous machine known as the BAM (β-barrel assembly machinery) complex that is responsible for the proper assembly of β-barrel proteins into the outer membrane. This chapter summarizes the current status of knowledge about outer membrane protein biosynthesis, and the significant progress that has been made towards understanding the structure and function of the bacterial BAM complex. http://www.horizonpress.com/membranes If enough amino acid were created by conditions of early Earth, to create a strand of DNA how did the organelles and the membrane form? Respiration was CO2 from what I’ve read Bacteria obtain energy by either ingesting other organisms and organic compounds or by producing their own food. The bacteria that produce their own food are called autotrophs. Bacteria that must consume other organic molecules for energy are called heterotrophs. There are chemotrophic autotrophs, which absorb inorganic molecules, such as sulfides, and convert them to energy, as well as phototrophic autotrophs that produce their own energy by absorbing sunlight. If the first living cells were bacteria it would be necessary to have developed a means of obtaining energy and reproduce, it would need organelles to achieve that ability, all seems a little to spontaneous. A cell must have captured a photosynthetic cyanobacterium and failed to digest it. The cyanobacterium thrived in the cell and eventually evolved into the first chloroplast. Other eukaryotic organelles may have also evolved through endosymbiosis; it has been proposed that cilia, flagella, centrioles, and microtubules may have originated from a symbiosis between a Spirochaete bacterium and an early eukaryotic cell, but this is not widely accepted among biologists. cilia, flagella, centrioles, and microtubules are organelles that have specific functions these are not explained by symbiosis these are eukaryotic organelles, and support Intelligent design.

Interesting argument, will need to do further study. I did not have an opportunity to actually make an argument for Irreducibly Complexity of the cell, but my question was never answered, and I will rephrase it, you have kidneys because Genes in the cells of that region were turned on to build that structure, do you agree with that statement? each cell has a full copy of 21 chromosomes, excluding red blood cells, the question is did the Gene for the kidneys “evolve” or mutate to create an organ such as the Kidney? or did the kidney evolve and was then added to the Gene pool, hence written into our DNA? either way it turned out to be very beneficial, being a vital organ. Can genes be turned on and off in cells? Each cell expresses, or turns on, only a fraction of its genes. The rest of the genes are repressed, or turned off. The process of turning genes on and off is known as gene regulation. Gene regulation is an important part of normal development. Genes are turned on and off in different patterns during development to make a brain cell look and act different from a liver cell or a muscle cell, for example. Gene regulation also allows cells to react quickly to changes in their environments. Although we know that the regulation of genes is critical for life, this complex process is not yet fully understood.

Can you give references to the "clear origins of Organs"? although that was not the crux of the question, if a species evolved into a more complex life form how was the information translated into adding Gene's or adding more Chromosomes to pass along to future generations? Do you see intelligence or at least some form of communication between the appendage and the code. My beliefs are a foundation that causes me to challenge evolution, and I do occasionally visit some Creation Web sites, But as I said before there are many Scientist who also believe in intelligent design.

The anatomy list was not given as an example of a irreducible complex system, but it does beg the question, is the heart created be cause of necessity, and how was it cataloged within the Genes, if complex systems arise from lower life forms, then when kidneys are needed to remove waste, what dictates its formation? not only do the kidneys need to form, but they need to be transcribed in the Genes, so future generations of the species will have these Genes. Its the chicken and the egg syndrome, are organs developed because of need? And if so then by what force. Or are Organs designed within the Genes to accommodate more complex life forms? The Cell is the best example of irreducibly complex. science can explain how it functions, but not why.

John316, on 22 Nov 2015 - 7:43 PM, said: If life can choose it must have intelligence, although you can image how life could have evolved, there is no conclusive evidence, Indoctrination can, and has infiltrated the sciences. Can I prove God exists, I believe if you search for Him you will find HIm. We will now consider the purportedly "positive argument" for design encompassed in the phrase used numerous times by Professors Behe and Minnich throughout their expert testimony, which is the "purposeful arrangement of parts." Professor Behe summarized the argument as follows: We infer design when we see parts that appear to be arranged for a purpose. The strength of the inference is quantitative; the more parts that are arranged, the more intricately they interact, the stronger is our confidence in design. The appearance of design in aspects of biology is overwhelming. Since nothing other than an intelligent cause has been demonstrated to be able to yield such a strong appearance of design, Darwinian claims notwithstanding, the conclusion that the design seen in life is real design is rationally justified. (18:90-91, 18:109-10 (Behe); 37:50 (Minnich)). As previously indicated, this argument is merely a restatement of the Reverend William Paley’s argument applied at the cell level. Minnich, Behe, and Paley reach the same conclusion, that complex organisms must have been designed using the same reasoning, except that Professors Behe and Minnich refuse to identify the designer, whereas Paley inferred from the presence of design that it was God. (1:6- 7 (Miller); 38:44, 57 (Minnich)). Expert testimony revealed that this inductive argument is not scientific and as admitted by Professor Behe, can never be ruled out. (2:40 (Miller); 22:101 (Behe); 3:99 (Miller))." (Pages 79–80https:// en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irreducible_complexity

The biological evidence that supports a Creator is the fact that there are you may find similar structures, to some of the structures found in the cell, but does not explain why they perform essential functions in the cell. The complexity of the system and the sum of its separate parts, is what makes it irreducibly complex, because they work in conjunction without reason.

There are many web sites and books written on the subject that uses scientific evidence to support the case of a creator. i.e.. “The Case For a Creator” Auth. Lee Strobel. The biological evidence that supports a Creator is the fact that there are tens of thousands of irreducibly complex systems on the cellular level. In our cells we have hundreds of processes occurring in harmony but no explanation why organelles without intelligence perform functions to sustain the cell. The eye is another irreducible complex system, parts that work together that can only be explained by design. Our bodies are made up of systems, working together and without them there would be no life, respiratory, circulatory, endocrine, Nervous, ect, made up of organs, to perform functions, the mystery of life remains a mystery and is only explained by a creator. SKELETAL SYSTEM Components: bones, cartilage, ligaments Function: supports and protects body; muscles attached to bones; provides calcium storage; site of blood cell formation Specific features: -Supports body via bony framework -Protects delicate vital organs (for their weight, bones are nearly as strong as steel) -Bones are levers that transmit muscular forces; muscles are attached to bones by bands of connective tissue called tendons. When muscles contract, they pull on bones. Bones are held together at the joints by bands of connective tissue called ligaments. -Marrow inside some bones produces blood cells (specifically inside flat bones: skull, ribs and breastbone) -Bones serve as banks for storage and release of minerals like calcium and phosphorus MUSCULAR SYSTEM Components: skeletal muscle, cardiac muscle, smooth muscle Function: moves parts of the skeleton, locomotion; pumps blood; aids movement of internal materials Specific features: -Muscle cells contract and become shorter and thicker; because muscle cells are long and narrow, they are called fibers -Skeletal muscles are attached to bones; they are voluntary muscles, which make our bodies move. They are striped or striated in appearance. -Cardiac muscle is found in the walls of the heart; it contacts involuntarily and is also striated. -Smooth muscle is found in the walls of the digestive tract, uterus, blood vessels and other internal organs. The fibers are not striated and they are involuntary. NERVOUS SYSTEM Components: nerves and sense organs, brain and spinal cord Function: receives stimuli from external and internal environments, conducts impulses and integrates activities of other systems Specific features: -Two divisions of the nervous system: central and peripheral -Central nervous system consists of the brain and spinal cord -Peripheral nervous system consists of the sense organs (eyes, ears, taste buds, olfactory receptors, touch receptors) and the nerves which connect the spinal cord with the rest of the body. These nerves are classified as either afferent (transmit information from the periphery to the spinal cord) or efferent (transmit information from the spinal cord to the periphery). -Peripheral nervous system is subdivided into two divisions: somatic division (consists of receptors and nerves concerned with changes in the outside environment; the sense organs and afferent nerves) and the autonomic division (regulates the internal environment; primarily the sympathetic and parasympathetic systems of the efferent system of nerves). ENDOCRINE SYSTEM Components: pituitary gland, adrenal gland, thyroid gland, hypothalamus gland, pineal gland, kidney, pancreas, ovaries, testes and other ductless glands (which are defined as tissues that secrete hormones that diffuse into the blood vessels) Function: regulates body chemistry and many body functions Specific features: -These glands are regulated by feedback control: information about hormone levels or their effect is fed back to the gland to regulate the hormone's release -Endocrine activity is controlled by the hypothalamus gland (which is located in the brain). This gland links the nervous and endocrine systems. As a result of nervous stimuli, it secretes several releasing and inhibiting hormones that affect the activity of the other glands. CIRCULATORY SYSTEM Components: heart, blood vessels, blood; lymph and lymph structures Function: transports materials from one part of the body to another; defends body against disease Specific features: -Consists of two subsystems: the cardiovascular system (includes the heart which pumps the blood through the blood vessels) and the lymphatic system (which helps to preserve fluid balance and protects the body against disease) -Transports nutrients from the digestive system to all parts of the body -Transports oxygen from the lungs to all the cells of the body -Transports carbon dioxide and other metabolic wastes from the cells to the excretory organs -Transports hormones from the endocrine glands to the target tissues -Helps maintain normal body temperature -Helps maintain fluid balance -Protects the body against disease-causing organisms. The lymphocytes, which are a type of white blood cell, are formed in the lymph tissue: lymph glands, spleen, thymus, tonsils and lymphoid tissue in the gut. There are two types of lymphocytes: T lymphocytes (the mediators of cellular immunity; these cells destroy the invader) and B lymphocytes (the antibody-producing cells; humoral immunity). RESPIRATORY SYSTEM Components: lungs and air passageways Function: exchanges gases between the blood and the external environment Specific features: -Respiration includes breathing, gas exchange between lungs and blood, transport of gases through the body by the blood, gas exchange between the blood and the cells and cellular respiration (the chemical reaction pathways by which chemical energy is obtained from food). DIGESTIVE SYSTEM Components: mouth, esophagus, stomach, intestines, liver, pancreas Function: ingests and digests foods, absorbs them into the blood Specific features: -Salivary glands, liver and pancreas are not part of the digestive system but secrete digestive juices into it -The digestive system involves four major processes: 1. Ingestion-taking food into the mouth, chewing and swallowing 2. Digestion-breakdown of food into smaller pieces (catalyzed by enzymes) 3. Absorption-transfer of digested food through the wall of the intestine and into the circulatory system 4. Elimination-removal of undigested and unabsorbed food from the body (in feces) URINARY SYSTEM Components: kidney, bladder and associated ducts Function: excretes metabolic wastes; removes substances present in excess from the blood Specific features: -Urine is made by the kidneys; it's transported from the kidneys to the bladder by the ureters; the bladder stores the urine then the urine leaves the bladder and exits the body via the urethra. -95% of urine is water. Also present is urea, which is produced in the liver (urea is the excretion form of nitrogen waste). REPRODUCTIVE SYSTEM Components: testes, ovaries and associated structures Function: reproduction, which provides for continuation of the species https://quizlet.com Our world is a system, our Solar system is a system, our Universe is a system, systems are designed, by a creator, but if you are searching for the Creator, he gave the formula: when you search for me with all of your heart, you will find me.

Science >> Darwin's Theory Of Evolution Darwin's Theory of Evolution - Slowly But Surely... Darwin's Theory of Evolution is a slow gradual process. Darwin wrote, "…Natural selection acts only by taking advantage of slight successive variations; she can never take a great and sudden leap, but must advance by short and sure, though slow steps." [1] Thus, Darwin conceded that, "If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed, which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down." [2] Such a complex organ would be known as an "irreducibly complex system". An irreducibly complex system is one composed of multiple parts, all of which are necessary for the system to function. If even one part is missing, the entire system will fail to function. Every individual part is integral. [3] Thus, such a system could not have evolved slowly, piece by piece. Darwin was more eloquent, but makes the point, each cell in your body is irreducibly complex.

My point is not that you don't have the right to study it, teach it or believe it, but don't teach it as fact, you are the rigid one.

Thankyou: theory of evolution.... I agree its a theory, no its still a theory, I will check out the web site, in the mean time answer this: what guides centrioles to align chromosomes and then separate the cell? one function of mechanics of the cell

Thank you: theory of evolution.... it has not been proven, I will bring evidence of the mechanics of the cell organelle which work in harmony but how or why is yet to be answered. example what guides centrioles to align Chromosomes and separate the cell?

so you have no defense, just quips, smug dude

I don't have a degree in Biology, I did take 3 college level biology courses, but that was over 35 years back, and I don't work in that field, but I am not completely ignorant of the subject, and my Prof believed in a creator. You believe that science has the answers to questions that are no more than theories, which makes it religion, In science you must be able to observe and or recreate the hypothesis to prove it, and science has not proven evolution. when you say how the eye was developed you are making a hypothesis founded on: no evidence. Moderator> This is on topic, can science explain everything without a creator.