StringJunky

In these sorts of discussions it's advisable to ask what our agendas are. For some reason, prior to my edit in my last post, I was reminded of an oft-spoken question by a social worker I was assigned to during my drug rehabilitation days in our many discussions on societal issues. She would ask "...and what personal agenda are you working from?". It makes a big difference what answers you come up with.

In what sense? It has just occurred to me that I have gone into this discussion under the context it was myself that helped create the pregnancy.; unwittingly or not. I want a say in the destiny of that pregnancy. If I'm not involved then I don't have the right to tell the woman what she must do.

OK. Women's rights on this matter are a negative for you then; you wish they didn't have them?

With that being revealed, your issue is really with the ethics of abortion itself...is that so?

So, women have the complete monopoly on discussion, development and future of young humans? I welcome the day that technology can emerge that will take that burden away from them and children may be conceived and gestated ex utero. Then we won't be having this conversation.

Super. I bet there's some serious number crunching going on there to make that.

Why can't you write like this all the time? I can't agree or disagree because my knowledge is not intimate enough but your assessment seems reasonable. I was not impressed with her handling of state emails; pretty bad really when you are aspiring to carry the nuclear briefcase.

The question begs to be discussed from as many perspectives as are available. Better to look around the whole subject rather than from a single perspective, even if, ultimately, the final decision is made from one single perspective.

I'm disappointed in you, harking from Canada: Plus Ca change...

i didn't mean her gender being a primary reason but maybe had a tangible effect on the result

We are not going to get a mature conversation with you are we?

I have expressed no misogyny. It dismays me the lack of acknowledgement or awareness that men have a stake in it as well. Pregnancy is nine months out of twenty years of invested time and effort by both parties. You should say what you believe but you should leave your emotions at home. We explore and challenge each others thoughts about different subjects and often we come out of these skirmishes a bit wiser and more complete as people. It is a bit of a shock to the system at first but you get used to it. First thing to learn is that it is ok to be wrong and corrected. Also, it is what you say that is being challenged not you as a person. We aim to attack ideas not people. It's OK to walk away from a conversation too when you feel you've said your piece.. It is not a competition with winners and losers.

5.8 mmol/l

That's what I mean. If it can't be measured or doesn't fit in with known physics it's not physical.

In the UK the NHS will support three terminations.... You were expressing your opinion and I contradicted it with mine. My interpretation of your comment I picked up on was that you have no deference for life even if at that stage it is just potential and that it is expendable on a whim. The more it's done the more likely it is to cause mental harm to those concerned. This is in Ethics so legality is not the whole story.

I find it rather difficult to visualise a woman becoming unlucky in getting pregnant five times unless she's not compus mentis or intellectually-challenged in some way. I'm expressing an opinion on the bounds that I set to me condoning it that many times without unusual extenuating circumstances. I think such a woman, without such extenuating issues, is setting themselves up for a massive guilt trip later.

How is that bad per se? Am I to take that you think it's flat out morally wrong based just on some personal principle?

I don't know much about it but thought that might put you in the right direction. A few people here are quite knowledgeable on software that can perhaps help you.

True, but that wasn't her stance.

Have you tried Sourceforge? https://sourceforge.net/directory/os:windows/?q=erp%20software

Perhaps not stupid but unwise, in retrospect. America had pushed the envelope with a black president and maybe wasn't ready to do it again with a woman at the helm at this stage in its history.

A fine example of a political chameleon if ever there was one.

Would it be equivalent to say "Physical is as pertains to physics?"

I find this deeply repugnant that you think an ethically diificult and emotionally fraught procedure is ok to be undertaken on the same individual five times?! Executing this procedure merely as means of routine post-coital contraception is not something I could consider in good conscience. Yes, I minused you. I don't think you thought that through and if you have then you are in need of acquiring some empathy.

Why do you think this is so? A detached, apolitical assessment would be good, if possible.