StringJunky

I do think Lia Thomas was being unrealistic, particularly when this subject is very much in flux in elite sports.. They transferred a clear advantage in their physical size when they transitioned. Transitioning doesn't reduce the stroke length that men that tall have.

One should always be working in the same 'units' to avoid screwing up.

So was homosexuality. Look where that is now. Any diagnostic manual on mental health can actually just reflect contemporary attitudes of the day and may simply be socially unacceptable, rather than genuinely pathological to the individual or people around them..

Mismatched gender identification is a dysphoria that can have pathological effects on the individual and their life if not addressed.

Of course, the biological systems don't change in themselves, but when you add or subtract categories, more or less things are observable, therefore, the observed, measured, system changes. There is a new reality because we've had to alter the classifications to accommodate the new data.

Is historicity important and should it never be changed? You seem to use that word a lot, as though it's immutable, like the now-antique US Constitution. People that are yet to be born won't care if something isn't useful to them anymore, or gets commandeered for other purposes. What happened to the original meaning of 'gay' and the associations regarding rainbows. They were just rainbows. That small subset of individuals will require categorizing and there will have to be a trinary, quaternary, whatever number of sets to include them, if they can't belong to the the binary set. Either way the binary system becomes a figment of history.

That's entirely up to him, society will just keep evolving, regardless. Newly emerging citizens will absorb and embody any new definitions without the baggage of soon-to-be archaic binary concepts.

Cheers for clarifying that. The problem at hand here is the use of 'normal' and the arbitrary application of limits... in my view. I would say older people become more intractable in their views. Some thing, as I enter my seventh decade, I'm self-aware of. Some subjects, like my taste in 70's blues/rock are intractable, but it doesn't matter in the wide scheme of things. Things like this subject will see one in the flow, following progress, or off it as an irrelevance. One becomes a static, living example of a certain period in time, just as my great grandad was an example of the Victorian age, and his kids Edwardian and Georgian. My grandad thought that fighting the second world war was a waste of time, with the way that English society had deteriorated since then. He died in 2005. And so it goes on.

I don't know. CharonY might.

These are all assumptions/obstacles you created in your head with no facts to support. Quite simply, you are expressing personal anxieties and projecting them onto female athletes.

Good examples, zap.

You are just making stuff up.

The opening first line from this Intercept article sums up Trump to a tee:

I'm not a politician looking for allies. How you play it is up to you. I'm on nobody's team. As you know, start talking feminism, I will appear to a do a 180, where I am more in concordance with him and MigL, and will be just same with you on that subject in opposition. For me, what's important is that I am internally consistent with my own thoughts and are steered towards nature. If peoples thoughts align with mine, great, but nature is the boss when the evidence says so.. He's a thoughtful person... and we all like arguing.

Stop using it to support your positions then. I would have to look back, but you have put up a statistic whereby there was a very distinct delineation, with a clear gap between men and women's testosterone... like they they were so far apart they would never connect. This is what originally prompted me to look up the data I posted.

Symptomatic of running out of ideas.

How did you work that out? You've got these archaic pigeon-holes that you keep clinging on to that are well passed their use-by date.... but science soldiers on. From: Testosterone Levels in Athletes Data Point Educator Caption: Blood testosterone levels for 676 Olympic-level elite athletes. Individual athletes, represented by blue dots, are grouped by their biological sex (“Men” or “Women”) and sport (1-Powerlifting, 2-Basketball, 3-Soccer, 4-Swimming, 5-Marathon, 6-Canoeing, 7-Rowing, 8-Cross-Country Skiing, 9-Alpine Skiing, 10-WeightLifting, 11-Judo, 12-Bandy, 13-Ice Hockey, 14-handball, and 15-Track and Field). Blood samples were collected on a voluntary basis within two hours after the athletes had competed in their events. Sports missing from the plots did not have enough volunteers to be included in the study. None of the athletes were known to be intersex or to have used performance-enhancing drugs. https://www.biointeractive.org/sites/default/files/TestosteroneAthletes-Educator-DP.pdf The 10nm/L limit for female athletes would allow a whole bunch of men to compete as women using that criterion. The assertion in posts that you have made, that there is a definitive chasm between male and female athletes clearly doesn't reflect reality. Part of the problem, I think, is comparing *gross average upper and lower ranges made by many subject-related articles and those don't reflect the true distribution, as more clearly described by these graphs. We need science to help the policy-makers determine the solutions. *Gross - adjective. lacking fine distinctions or detail · adjective. visible to the naked eye (especially of rocks and anatomical features) ·

Now we are being an A-Hole are we... what happened to 'transgender'? You username is very much an inaccurate misnomer. You are no more scientific than I am Taylor Swift.

About as accurate and detailed as Bohr's model of the atom. The Standard Model is now somewhat more complex..

Oh dear... time for me to get out the razor blade.

Ultimately, despite numerous failures historically, we have to continue to have faith, and support those who align, or seek to align, with our societal and geopolitical philosophies by whatever means necessary to achieve that... the victors write history. It's a Darwinian existential battle between radically-opposed geopolitical opponents.

Do you think the west would be supporting him with billions of dollars if he was that corrupt?

Where was the support for Yanokovych before the war started? Well, when this war's over, Zelensky can face his 'reckoning at the next election; history and the voters will judge him.

We wouldn't be allowed either. That's what happens in wars on your home territory.