Mike Smith Cosmos

The maths of change ......... fascinating ........ Pulls my brain apart but ............fascinating ................change and change upon change upon change maybe you think of it in another way ? ajb .

Interesting. Welcome to the Zoo . Mike

SamBridge, You clearly think like a mathematician. With your example here, of intigration and how you need to have a constant to lock into a spacific curve rather than any of an infinity of curves, demonstrates how your mind thinks ! Clearly a very useful brain if you want to solve problems mathematically. Clearly from other posts of yours you can and do visualise problems. Contrary wise , I have a visualisation brain. Always for understanding my brain searches, hunts, gropes and usually furnishes me with a visualisation. similarly , it is not that I cannot do maths ( with the rider that it usually hurts my brain), it is likely to be last in line. Visualisation First. Experiment Second. Language third . .......................Maths down here somewhere ........... I understand many scientific principles can have and do have maths as a core idea. However , because of who I am and What I am , I owe it to myself to try to use ( what IS ME ) to the best use. Hence I see it as there can not be any greater challenge ( for me) , than to understand " what the whole Shebang is about" . So to me ( and maybe me alone, I doubt it ) I need, and must have a Visualisation of the whole Shebang. Failing that, I must use the features of language to describe what I cannot visualise. Hence this thread that you say is going on... is studded from my direction with a LINGUAL theory of everything together with visualisations . The Experiments believe me have been done . You may wonder and to some extent be justified in saying " Why is he continuing to Bang On About This " I have a feeling that the current body of science has built up a very effective bastion built on principles, determinism, predictability, maths , formula and laws, which is demonstrated in our current industrialised world. Great. But its not all there is. Clearly observing the natural world , we are still poles apart from how nature runs the world, the stars, the galaxies , the structure of the astronomical universe , and whatever is beyond the visible. I think there is a Gap, a very large Gap ,maybe an uncrossible Gap , many many Gaps that can NOT be CROSSED by our current mathematical models. We need to fly a bit. So the thrust of a few of my threads is to examine possible ways that could unlock, or form a navigable channel to further understanding as to . " HOW THE UNIVERSE WORKS ". and I believe I am not alone. I think many scientists are beginning to probe these new frontiers . . .

This is keeping the accelerating as firstly by mathematical calculation of the movement towards the center . And Secondly by forces balanced surely. If there was no centrifugal force and you were free in an elevator but held above the earth you would feel the force of gravity pulling you into the floor of the elevator. If the elevator was now made to be circling the earth at approx 17,700mph the gravitational force would slowly be overcome by a force acting radially away from the center until the force of gravity was balanced. This would surely be described as centrifugal force, caused by the increase of orbital speed from 0 to 17,700 mph

I think the perception, often put forward, particularly in Physics ,is that Maths is precise . A formula can be derived and used to make an exact result. Thus can be used to make exact predictions. Probability is encompassed within maths , as statistics ,etc and might in the future encompass maths as yet unknown and unspecified, However its ability in this area does come up with unreliable prediction IF ACCURACY IS REQUIRED . Say Weather forecast., Yes but imprecise. Computer models yes. But Formula to predict NO. So by all means call it New Maths, using Genetic Algorithms, or other convergent techniques, or probable based paradigms. But I think this is pointing to the importance of OBSERVATION and HYPOTHESIS as being required to act as MAJOR DRIVERS in this Subject under discussion, namely a medium for exploring the frontiers of Science. Then using maths to assist , and come up with NEW MATHS to cope.

We live in Italy 1 hour up from Assisi where St Francis of Assisi did his (whatever he did with Animals) one of which was to Visit Gubbio Roman Town near to us. He came to speak to the Wolves in the hills that hunted in packs and were taking some of the Children. He was supposed to have spoken to the Wolves ( 100's years ago) They never took any more children. Nowerdays there are no longer packs just lone wolves . I believe I saw one cross our road. We still have many wild Bores ( Chingali ) outside our garden occasionally, as we are in a wood (Edge) The Pigrims from all different parts of the world come to Assisi, some stray past our house lost ( Pilgrims I mean).

The hounds are gathering! I ,m Off to Italy He----l--P !

humm! Need to think about that a bit . I am off to italy in a weeks time . June 1st Up a mountain. ( no internet ) Gone for a couple of weeks. Back Mid June 2013 Keep things intact till I return . The hounds are gathering at the door. . My threads may be torn to shreds while I am away ! Mike

Because maths tends to be closely linked with prediction and determinism , it could hold back , more probability based , emergent based theories/hypotheses .

Yes and I bet half the people on the " SPECULATIONS" section would give "their eye teeth" to be funded to do some genuine "blue sky" research on their pet theory. And I would suggest at least 6 or more would lead to some exciting and advantageous developments. The world needs that right now . What say you ?

Ok. Well I guess it must do this Centrifugal Force wins out ! At last !

. spin , angular momentum, magnetic moment, charge. I think all these things are here in principle. The maths may take a little longer. . ELECTRON

Something from nothing with a mold Something from nothing Without a mold With a complex developed mold With a Mold Without a Mold Without Consciousness With Consciousness

The attraction repulsion thread does cross the Macro-Micro boundary again at the Sub atomic - external to the individual atom region

I too think this is the one ! Deterministic ------- Probability ---------- deterministic

Today/Tomorrow 22nd May 2013 Prof Lee Smolin [From the out post of Princetown University] " The Perimeter Institute in Canada " releases his Book on TIME 00:00:00 Where he proposes the only REAL time is NOW .

Yes I was. Just a bit of fun comment !

In keeping with the principle of the tuning fork ( of opposite direction oscillating entities, being a self sustaining system ) . Perhaps we can look for a similar device within the electron to produce . spin , angular momentum, magnetic moment, charge. In my original mechanical model with the tuning fork There are ,( despite the crude looking diagram), and indeed in the actual device interesting Oscillating electrical, fields,Magnetic fields, antiphase and 90 degree phase shifts, as well as two mechanical movements of an oscillating nature in opposite directions. As this provides the ingredients ( at least ) for a micro device having . spin , angular momentum, magnetic moment, charge. All we need to look at is what goes where and how . We also have a possible picture above from Sweden What it looks like slowed down. . spin , angular momentum, magnetic moment, charge. . Looks a bit like the one from Sweden as well . Well sort of ELECTRON . We already have examples how the Electro- magnetic system works. To produce a Magnetic moment. Moving charge in the center of the earth ( outer molten core ) produces a magnetic moment North pole south pole. And so with the spinning electron charge To Produce a Charge. Michael Faraday's last experiment showed if you have a spinning disc in a magnetic field you will generate a continuous electrical potential from circumference to center point Angular momentum comes from the two opposing Spins generating a 720 degree total displacement by the Paul Dirac Dance http://unity1.wordpress.com/2012/08/27/diracs-visual-representation-of-electron-spin/

michel Arc is the one to answer this, but he's on the far side of the Globe, Think he gets up when we go to bed. you will have to wait until tonight for an answer. However i was led to believe , that the inner core was solid and outer core liquid., because of the extreme pressure. Mike

OR if you do NOT want to go the path of least resistance ( GREEN AREA ), you have to give extra input and not float but give the energy necessary to take you out of the path of least resistance along some alternative path ! ( MAUVE AREA )

What you call the 'conditions ' , I describe it as ' the mold' . At any one moment 'Now' the mold is in a certain condition , state, or configuration. and the 'thing' whatever it is ( say lotto ball ), left to its own devices will tumble its way down ' figuratively ' through the mold until it can go no further . . . I believe this MOLD exists all over the universe, as a complex, flexible set of fields. Some places fairly static, . Other places changing like a fluid all the time. The particular state of the mold, , at this particular location,at the particular time the lotto ball hits that 'EDGE' will depend on that particular part of the 'MOLD' or your ' CONDITIONS' at that moment in time. And thus so will the outcome be particular. And for Split ! ( unless of course there is another universe doing something marginally different ? ) oops!

But , maybe this business of electrons on their own is not a problem , but pivotal as Bonding is everything , whether Ionic or covalent the universe would not be here without it . I can not pretend to know fully what is going on , as I am not a Chemist. I wish I was , as it appears to be all about the building up of the materials of matter for all the important things of life. . But free electrons seems a very important requirement to facilitate matter . I do not mean electrons outside the atom , but inside. However I do accept your point about correct function of the model. Have to work on that . Let me deal with intrinsic spin of individual electrons in the context of the model I am putting forward. . Maybe the issue of single electrons will resolve itself . It is interesting a single electron has been filmed with a quantum strobascope link ..

But I do not believe you have responded to a previous comment of mine In other words, single electrons or holes in atomic shells , are mis-fits , jigsaws or uncomfortable on their own, and sort of 'seek' complimentary pieces to fit with, by reacting and making molecules .

Well it keeps buzzing around the shell or probability orbital in the way we currently understand it to do. I only ever happened on the single to dual tuning fork phenomenon when I was trying to create vibration with a single rod without a grounding base. So I tried the large hand built tuning fork working at 60-100 hz. It came to life like a beauty . This one NOT dependent on a ground or base. .as illustrated below. . When I moved to designing a possible system to work without the cross piece it reduced to :- Which gave me the possible thought, that could electrons possibly work in pairs within the energy bands. They appeared to prefer to work in opposing pairs ( different spin states Pauli exclusion ). Remember I wanted to do this out in the big wide world , in the atmosphere and in space . ( Still do ) However the numbers are quite quite large. but exciting none the less. THERE IS NO NEED TO MOVE AROUND IN ORBIT. Similarly with the electrons . ( Partial arc can be sufficient ) . Remember the toy . .

Well I wanted to get the principle of the model (TF) in place, so that a discussion could follow about : {Model (TF ) see below} ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ a) orbital Angular momentum of the electron b) characteristic or intrinsic spin as an extra angular momentum , and magnetic moment.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ As of yet I have not discussed the actual Spin of the electron in the model (TF) form . [ ( TF =Tuning Fork model)] Tuning fork is not to be taken literally . It represents two masses oscillating in anti-phase mode based on mutual ( attraction) and/or ( repulsion ) . TUNING FORK MODEL .. .