Mike Smith Cosmos

[ Tar said :- The current challenge is to describe the scientific measurement we can make to describe order and usefulness and entity "cleverness", in opposition to disorder, emptiness, and lack of structure, or pattern. Information has come to light : that three assumptions made with entropy , where :- 1 gravity is not included 2 life is not included 3 open systems are not included. As these then are free to be used in our new "generation " entity we have the makings of a phenomenon acting in opposition to entropy? Namely : -----------...-- Generation -- ... ----------can be viewed as a mechanism that : 1.Can act under the influence of gravity. 2. Act as an open system 3. Be supportive of an increase in order and complexity. 4. Work within an environment for the generation and development of life . 5. Put energy into a form that is useable. 6. Others These initial 5 or 6 pressures of GENERATION are sufficient to function within the universe to act in opposition to entropy . ENTROPY tends to work in the opposite direction. (Namely . Not work under the influence of gravity.: Acts within closed systems: increases in disorder . ; Does not involve life forms: Puts energy beyond use. Etc ) Gravity

O.K. Clearly a public apology is required from me. I had no idea He would cause such a reaction. Had I known that I would never have quoted him. I was attempting quite the opposite , Lighthearted humor. In England , his particular comments about "KNOWNS" and "UNKNOWNS " I quoted have been a source of much Pleasurable Humor , with no disrespect either to the man or the country that he represented at the time. He could have been anybody. It just sounded Funny ! Yet another Unreserved apology . Sorry ! By Mike . I think perhaps I should retire to oblivion and knit socks .

The above picture ! I undertook in a lesson in Woodland landscapes produced in pastels TODAY 2pm to 4 pm . 2nd April 2014 I asked the art teacher if I could do it with a ----" known, ----known- unknowns,-- ----unknown- unknowns - --- THEME. I explained it was a Rumsfeld theme to do with the science forum. He ( my Art instructor ) is an artist of great experience, also his career was in aircraft aerodynamic design ( age 93 years old ) . Engineer - Artist Hence is symbolic terms :- The near immediate trees represent known science( provable , evident, touchable, easily identified, precision drawn, predictable , most aspect of the tree is explained by main stream science/biology/physics. I would dare to say this is where you are mainly comfortable with / and at Swansont. The mid range trees are in the next layer back , hinted at by size and colour , but that is about all. This is the known unknown. Namely one is quite happy that they are there, but the detail is not known, yet one is fairly sure if you went into the forest and investigated you would be confident that one could make investigation, even if new species were discovered with strange characteristics one has a degree of confidence one could cope with what was there. I would dare to say that you, Swansont are ok with this as long as you have proof ,which at the moment is Not currently available . But of course is not certain as nobody has been there yet. Representing ongoing speculation and research. The blackness to the top and left side, and over the horizon , and beyond the sky lays the unknown -unknowns. There may or may not be anything there. What is there could be anything. This I believe possibly presumptuously you are not happy with, comfortable , with. Representing the areas such as far reaching 'blue Sky ' speculation , and some form of investigative debate and far stretching ideas. ART in SCIENCE I would say enters all three regions , because it can easily. Some dare to play in these regions, even scientists. Because the deep forest excites them, the mysteries beckon . As regards the darkness and beyond excite them beyond belief . Icarus of course tried and failed. NASA has tried and won some and loose some . Some scientists are reaching for the skies. Who knows at this stage whether they will win or fail. Only time will tell. ART HAS A PLACE TO PLAY IN ALL THESE AREAS OF INVESTIGATION ! ILLUSTRATING AS REQUIRED. Mike

. ". ENTER HERE . ONLY HE WHO IS A GEOMETER. " . ....THE GREAT LIBRARY OF ALEXANDRIA ..... The great library at Alexandria, - part of the Greek Empire - burned down and nearly all books lost to humanity. The library and it's stones lays beneath the sea off the Nile delta Egypt. All that learning lost until the great Renaissance in Europe . After the Dark Ages [ I hope I have got my History right, never good at it at school . More interested in Science . ] GOT it ( William Blake ) mike

Platonic shapes existing in a special realm ? Only the flickering shadows of reality seen on the walls of my cave Mike

I want to look at some sheep not maths ! Well I must say your pictures give me a comfortable feeling ! Complete neat satisfyingly symmetrical at least side to side . Mike . . . I know MATRICIES .? . ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ.

I need a clue , that is not so oblique as your previous clues. . .? Like . Is it animal, vegetable or mineral ? We need to move this subject on to pleasant pastures , or I am not going to sleep tonight with all these haunting faces ! Mike

I liked his comments about the picture top right, with the 'saw' . When he asked his doctor for a proper diagnosis, his doctor said he could only do that when he died. ---------- ---------- On a more pleasant note . The new science subject of symmetry , shows how even something as esoteric as beauty can have a scientific root . . - Notice the two differing emotional responses. With the poor gentleman with altsheimers a lack of symmetry in the faces have a slightly alienating feeling , whereas the lady's very symmetrical face has a comforting feeling ! Or at least to me as a retired gentleman ! Mike I am currently investigating the aspect of different feelings and emotions that can be engendered by different paintings . A fellow artist friend of mine , who paints beautiful watercolour paintings. When I asked him what he was trying to get across when he painted a country scene . He said , " I am trying , to stimulate the ' feeling '. I have when I look at that scene. Not what it looks like. What feeling I get , when I look at it. Note following picture To me , unlike the comfortable feeling of the previous symmetrical images. I get this feeling of isolation, a little scary , yet a feeling of adventure and new horizons. Not really comfortable but beckoning . Maybe ! Mike

This is the same as the previous but one ,one , is it not ? Mike

I have seen these pictures. I used to live up the road from Kew Gardens . At Ealing Common. They are phenomenol, copious, .in a building holding a life's work. I think I now know ,what I will do with the rest of my life . I will go to the regions of the " unknown unknowns " and the " known unknown 's " and the edge of the " knowns , where it interfaces with the unknown " as well as the " known ! And paint it ! .......... ........... ....... I am inspired ! Mike Ps good old Donald Rumsfeld...... ..[T]here are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns there are things we do not know we don't know. Donald Rumsfeld sagte am 12. Februar 2002 ( by the way he was minister of defence in USA , when the pentagon got collided with by a terrorist bombing attack 7/11 . For those who do not know who he was . )

Pictorial evidence of very early universe . As referred to post #64 ( two posts back ..BBC PROG ) Mike

What a happy band of ARTY people ! BBC. art to illustrate latest findings on period right back to next to Big Bang inflation . Publicised two weeks ago . New evidence . I think it was a new analysis of the microwave signature , hence the curly bits whirling out carrying information about those very early moments. They said it was definitive proof of something. I think it was inflation. So inflation was no longer a possible theory , but rather evidence was now in for the theory. Alan Guth will be pleased . Described here on BBC by David Shuckman Swirls described post #66 ( two forward ) Mike

Is it the grid structure of the Macator projection , used to make a world globe able to be represented on a flat sheet. or the equivalent for the starry Sky ? Mike

. O.K. Responding to reviewing Swansonts various comments:- I am trying to get my head around where you are and what you are saying . I think I am getting a clearer picture . B. I usually get a picture forming when thinking about issues, which I did in this case which I will come to further on. But almost immediately some words echoed : „[T]here are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – there are things we do not know we don't know.“ Donald Rumsfeld sagte am 12. Februar 2002 The Image is :- A. :- ....................... ........................... ............................... .... ................ ......................... ...................... ..... . . . . . to follow ......................... ........................ ................................ .................................. .......................... . .................. .mike

Arc these paintings of historic Animals, produced by such a venture [ Heinrich Harder (2 June 1858 Putzar – 5 February 1935 Berlin], are a non refutable example of how a very valuable interpretation has been communicated as pure science . When no first hand evidence other than fossils, which are an incomplete picture , are turned by brilliant ART into a valuable contribution to the body of Science . Mike

What are you saying ? Davidivad . ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~ Considering your points so far Swansont :- .Other Swansont comments :- O.K. I am trying to get my head around where you are and what you are saying . I think I am getting a clearer picture . If i have time to put my reply in here before the EDIT drops out . It is :- ..A.. If not at next available slot :- .B... mike .

ACME ASKED :- What scientific concept is it meant to portray? The magnetic field lines at the entrance to a worm hole ? Somehow quantised ? Do I get a prize ?

I have been giving this subject of perspective a lot of thought and investigation recently. I was taught perspective in principle at school years and years ago. but it was just ' put a couple of points either side of your picture . draw all the lines to these points and away you go' I have recently taken it all rather seriously and its quite spooky . eg If you go down to ground level. [ lay on the floor] the horizon that was miles away comes down with you. Grass is as high as a tall building . If you look down a long high street the vanishing point is half a mile away. everything goes to a point. If you go to the point and look back . WOW ! If you go up in a department store say 4 floors look at the buildings around you . the EYE LINE [ which used to be at ground level , has come up to the 4th floor with you. Conclusion . We are carrying our EYE LINE perception around with us like a jewel at our chest[eye] . see painting above link http://www.scienceforums.net/uploads/monthly_03_2014/post-33514-0-74952600-1396040492_thumb.jpg [ after view press back arrow top left ] strictly speaking it should be up at exactly 'eye level' What Einstein goes on to say , is that another 'point ' exists at the next position. and provided you are using Euclidian geometry . The line between will be the shortest and is ' a straight line ' and that if you have a straight pole at each point vertically , you will prescribe a ' plane' and so he builds up the perception of a cube of 'Space-Time'. Although to some extent , this sounds basic. It is the way he builds up on these [axioms] that enabled him to think through ...his Theory of 'Space -Time ' Mike

That sounds like a conversation between Godel and Einstein , to me . I better run for cover, I am trying to get my head round Einstein and his early Axioms, it is getting me into bother ! with my concepts of position as inspired by starting to read Einsteins Book 'Special and General Relativity ' . mike

Brilliant, ! A Leonardo da Vinci special, used by Nasa to allow communication with future 'possible' alien visitors to our environs. And of course Da Vinci was himself both scientist and artist. link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonardo_da_Vinci Of course I have to agree 'Words are absolutely essential ' I am an advocate of a " Lingual Theory of Everything " . You cant get much more important and meaningful than 'everything' I have to believe in words or I am a false to my thoughts and ideas Mike

I do understand what you are trying to say , but, its rather I believe to be semantics ! { Arguing over words } ART is ART even if its a sheep pickled in formaldehyde . [ does absolutely nothing for me, but was in the Art of .Damien Hirst .TATE .....gallery London . In past times men and women who scoured the world to explore new passages from lake victoria to the sea , down the Congo River painted illustrations which today would be considered works of Art. Today a computer operator could have the heart of 'Zero appreciation of Art' , yet pull and paste a few pre- prepared shapes and produce what could be considered a work of Art. The divisions between illustration and Art are very very blurred. As Acme says I think we need to think in this context on this forum Art and the Beauty of that Art is in the eye of the beholder. But Art as an informer is better understood . In addition to this We have a particular pressure on us as 'Scientists' ( if I am allowed to call myself one, as I do indeed consider myself one ) . That is , we , above all else need to communicate our understanding of what we do 'know', to the public arena. As artists, ( I only consider myself a recent participant in this arena as a scientist-painter in retirement, My skills through life previously were only through drawing which was my life skills as a son of an architect and a design engineer by profession and latterly teacher of physics, communicating to young minds the wonders of science. . Painting has been a recent addition. However I would like to think I have appreciated some Art throughout my life, as most people have.It is now that I personally need to use what artistic skills I do have , in communicating any aspects of science that I believe, I could better communicate, using 'ART'.in its wider meaning. Mike

Perhaps that is a bad example as its computer /imaginary number generated. However I am sure a few people have hung them on their wall as some images are really beautiful . Here are some quick , Non colourful illustrations From Brian Green re string theory . 'Elegant Universe' book and From Max Tegmark our 'Mathematical Universe' book both scientists in their own right illustrating their difficult ideas in picture ( all be it black and White ) Mike

Both and All. I have a few members on the forum here, who are already communicating with me via PM.'s about Art in Science , which I/we believe would interest others in open forum. The above example of my attempts to communicate ideas involved with the subject of Complexity where Symmetry breaking in principle takes a bit of explaining without pictures. Some of the original writers on Chaos and Complexity used many illustrations to get Ideas of [MandleBrote sets, Bifurcation, Strange attractors etc] , across The other example is more simple being an image of star formation in a dust cloud , which is more an appreciation rather than an explanation. mike

Some scientists have an interest in ART and the use of ART in conveying scientific ideas that are otherwise difficult to express in other ways . This thread is started to act as a vehicle for such participation. Comments by another Scientific Artist ( anonymous )