Mike Smith Cosmos

I want to prove it first by observation . , then make an argument around the results. Which could contradict my inclination of course. ,! Although I doubt it , otherwise I would not be setting out to try to prove it. Unfortunately entropy is a negative concept, concentrating on what is unusable, wasted, chaotic, spread out. It is a pity there is not a word for the positive version of entropy. Eg useful energy, ordered, pattern, brought together to achieve etc the nearest I have got is " Innate progressive change ". And " clever " , there must be a better word to express ' innate progressive change ' ? Thesaurus for useful= advantageous!effective!fruitful!helpful!practical! valuable !worthwhile , Order= pattern! arrangement !plan, symmetry !align, catalogue! manage! marshal!systemise! tabulate. How about :- { patterns of systemised, practical, effectiveness } Or { systemised increase in effective order } As the opposite of entropy ? Then if I can prove a bell curve either symmetrical or slewed to the left { systemised increase in effective order} we can argue the case! Yes ? Mike Yes but that is if you take the thermodynamics route of entropy. I wish to take the formal definition of entropy as being :- a decrease in entropy , providing useful order as opposed to useless disorder . Mike I am trying to make a THEORY. that :- Rather than concentrating on the thermodynamics aspect of entropy , with its concentration on useless energy distribution, I wish to concentrate on the opposite concept of usefull, patterns of effective and practical systems of order that [i believe ] are being generated in the universe in equal quantities as the usefull energy is being lost by entropy. I believe we may have on our hands a universe which is in fact a balanced system between on the one hand movement to order and on the other hand movement to disorder .. In equal measure and therefore balance. " How clever is that ? " if proved ? Not me clever but the system clever. MIKE

. EVERYTHING SEEMS TO RESPOND TO FIELDS to FOLLOW THE MOULD . On reflecting on two issues brought up fairly often in this thread that should be considered. There are although unseen, myriads of FIELDS of various types crossing the entire universe. ( gravitational, electric, magnetic, Higgs, quantum , strong force fields, weak force fields , radio active fields and no doubt many more besides. ) among other things we or particles respond, react , move with, move against, like to be at right angles to FIELDS of one sort or another. If we could see them, we would think we were being buried alive by them. However if we could see them , we could have a field day. (Oops! Pun) To set the scene. We think the air we move about in, the space we see up in the sky, the space between the stars, ALL looks empty. I am sure a gold fish in a tank ,thinks the tank is nearly empty and he/she moves about freely , miraculously , drifting by a miracle about its space, If you have ever stuck your head out of a train or car window going 100 mph air feels like a pressing rubber sheet. My eldest daughter , jumped out of an aircraft in free fall.. She could not close her mouth for a while, I bungee jumped off a crane 150 ft up ,out into ablivion afew years ago. I thought I was going to die ! The atmosphere is not empty, neither is outer space. . It might seem there is nothing there , but there is. There are particles and fields everywhere, maybe not as densely packed as you are used to, that is why meteors streak white across the sky, heat shields burn on incoming space craft. Aurora glow, comets push there tails away from the sun. All this in what looks like empty space. If we could see , what would we see. Well I do not actually know , but I can imagine. I went swimming , as I do with a snorkel for hours at a time in the gentle warm seas ,hither and hither. Because you can breath under the water yet be made buoyant by the water near to the surface, feel the warmth of the sun on your back and with flippers drift gently through a wonderland..nothing new in that for those who have done it. But one day, down at one of the Canary Islands, I have never forgotten was where for the first time , I actually saw the currents. Normally water is water and you see nothing , only the objects in the water, like fish, stones , weed . But this day I suddenly SAW and FELT a very cold water current. I had not realised what I was doing , I had been swimming gently for an hour or two only 30-50 meters from the shore , but I did not realise I had strayed into the mouth of a fresh water river as it entered the sea. You could see several feet under the surface, shimmering convection- like yet vertical rounded .patterns, while at the same time I felt these surfaces as I was ,swimming through the interfaces of the mixture of fresh water and salt water. The cold was intense and I could feel every ripple. It was actually quite frightening , like I was wrestling with an invisible/ partial visible giant. Once I got used to it I could ride the current, under water as long as I allowed it to take me where it would. This got hairy at times, exciting, but it was like riding a giant, just under water at the mouth of a large river. I have never seen or experienced such phenomenon since. I think it was the cold warm interface, the salt/ fresh water interface. The reason for this lengthy description, is that I think the field lines of all sorts and flavours that permeate all of space , whether near the earth, on the earth , in space or wherever , are not the same, but similar in that things, whether particles or whatever can ride the currents to their advantage. The patterns , contours, lines, straights, curves make up a moving mould that offers opportunities for Efficient movement, structure, flow, energy , conservation , etc but most of the time we are floundering around unaware of many of , or all ,the opportunities present. Mike

Answering your points one by one , which I am happy to do but would sooner discuss the depths of the project subject matter itself. However:- A ) renaming was caused by some of the replies ( including your good self ) to not liking " clever" as a descriptor , as it immediately infers intelligence , which was not my immediate motive.( see starting health warning ) (See also (d) ) as an engineer I have often said , when seeing some mechanism " that's clever " . I feel that all the time I see things in nature. However , for the very sensitive I am using " innate move to order " , as it picks up a little of the entropy idea without launching full throttle into thermo dynamics, Carnot and closed and open systems etc. KISS I was told ' keep it simple stupid ' . B) defined scale. I thought I had covered this. One of the replies, in an encouragement to scientise the project suggested < this figure so and so > this other figure different so and so , on a scale 0 to 10 . So that is what I have done . One end of the scale 0 = complete order 10 = complete disorder ( in keeping with upside down style of entropy.) clearly. 5 is neither order nor disorder ,neutral. To move in one direction or the other 5 to 4, 5 to 3, 5 to 2 5 to 1 give four options at a grade like , very.... ,much....., some ...., little ... Similarly 5 to the higher figures ( eg. a little move to disorder 5 to 6 ) C) I was not saying you should not attempt to falsify the theory, I merely said it was premature, as we had hardly laid out the project , as I am still doing in this post. I had previously stated it was falsifiable. D) I have been very sensitive to every bodies soft spot on " what or who is behind this ? " In the case of this project , any discussion about how well designed, or functional or clever something appears , invariably raises questions as to its origin. I was rather hoping people could make up their own minds , on that. I have never hidden that I think something rather super human ( above human capability ) , more than nothing and ordinary-ness, is behind the origin of the whole shebang. But I have listed the choices on many occasions, including nothing is behind it. It is every bodies free choice. Mike

I have been thinking about what you have said. and I tried to think of it in context about what I have just been thinking about with regard to my lump of Basalt Rock . It has made me think about how time has a major role in all this. My Basalt and your 20 sided Dice resting on the table or in the ground are in a static equilibrium state. However they have come from somewhere in a different state, and are likely going somewhere in a different state. ( Time Wise & State wise ) . Yours [ the dice ] will be random ( 1-20) in both directions of time , one assumes. My [ Basalt ] will be max disordered back in time ( value of disorder max 10 ) , static peek order now , as Basalt ( Value 0 ) going onwards into the future when the sun blows up into a red giant and earth gets vapourised. My rock of basalt will be back in Disorder floating around in bits in outer space with ( value of disorder max 10 ). Both of these oscillate about the present. Depending on the results will give an interpretation as to whether or not there is some innate propendancy for ORDER or DISORDER . Without making judgements too hastily, I would suspect my Basalt has an innate drive to order, whereas the Dice have a lack of such Drive and so will tend to disorder at all places in the cycle.( if indeed there is a central point at all. ) Thus the difference . mike [ PS] I suspect this will arise on many of the 100 samples on my survey. Which in itself is a very interesting phenomenon .Things oscillating about a mean or central point of stability and order . Which already infers an innate quality of ORDER .This alone is quite a , 'dare I say it at this early juncture ' , interesting principle . [ an Intrinsic mechanism towards order out of chaos. a strange attractor again, Complexity theory ]

No at this juncture I have not defined " clever" I have said that I would use "innate progress toward order " and " innate progress toward disorder" as the two options. With degrees (5 to 0 ) in the case of order , or (5 to 10) in the case of disorder. So far I have two results : What it all means is for later. You cannot falsify anything at this stage, that is very very premature! Result. 1 was a movement toward ORDER ( 5 to 4) = 4 Result. 2. Was a state of. STATIC. Equilibrium ____= 5 + or - 0.5 OR in view of a conversation with Ringer over the next 2 posts Result. 2. Was a state of. STATIC. Equilibrium ____= 0 to + or - 10 [ large future or large past ] Mike The whole point of this thread is in fact . Is nature, "which IS doing what nature does", just on automatic wind down, which although releasing or redistributing energy in a disordering process, is nonetheless blind, yet works . Or is there in addition an ordering system ,that is coming up with some/many solutions that have an elevated character and beg an explanation . . It is the purpose of this thread ,is to find out the character of this innate capability. mike

Yes well you probably have read this quote below : I am not sure there is anything definite YET . However it is as well it happened or we would be being flattened by various massive beasts or running away from T Rex , rather than just Crocodiles and Box Jelly Fish , which are bad enough. Deccan Traps Main article: Deccan Traps Before 2000, arguments that the Deccan Traps flood basalts caused the extinction were usually linked to the view that the extinction was gradual, as the flood basalt events were thought to have started around 68 million years ago and lasted for over 2 million years. However, there is evidence that two thirds of the Deccan Traps were created in only 1 million years about 66 million years ago, and so these eruptions would have caused a fairly rapid extinction, possibly over a period of thousands of years, but still longer than would be expected from a single impact event.[1 mike

Certainly it is science . It is possibly the biggest scientific challenge you are likely to face in your lifetime What are you going to do if/when you find that 50 % of the scientific universe is marching to a different tune, than you imagined , than you thought ! mike As with Comment to Swansont. I have spent the last page or two of posts adapting to the current language of science , in order to reason things out in a current scientific technique. Carry out Tests Produce 30 -100 measurements . Plot, look for peaks, slews and deviations. Make conclusions , discuss with scientific colleagues and publicise. If you say this is not science then this is more like a bit of a hasty decision on your part . Now , To the Science in progress:- Observation 2. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Courtesy of Geology.com Link http://geology.com/ What Is Basalt, How Does It Form and How Is It Used? Basalt is a dark-colored, fine-grained, igneous rock composed mainly of plagioclase and pyroxene minerals. It most commonly forms as an extrusive rock, such as a lava flow, but can also form in small intrusive bodies, such as an igneous dike or a thin sill. It has a composition similar to gabbro. The difference between basalt and gabbro is that basalt is a fine-grained rock while gabbro is a coarse-grained rock. Earth's Most Abundant Bedrock Basalt underlies more of Earth's surface than any other rock type. Most areas within Earth's ocean basins are underlain by basalt. Although basalt is much less common on continents, lava flows and flood basalts underlie several percent of Earth's land surface. Basalt is a very important rock. Consists mainly of Plagioclase Feldspar and Pyroxine minerals. Basalt-Forming Environments: This map shows the location of oceanic divergent boundaries and hotspots. These are locations were large volumes of basalt have been formed. Map copyright by Geology.com and MapResources. Locations generalized after United States Geological Survey, Geologic Investigations Map I-2800: This Dynamic Planet. Most of the basalt found on Earth was produced in just three rock-forming environments: 1) oceanic divergent boundaries, 2) oceanic hotspots, and 3) mantle plumes and hotspots beneath continents. Columbia River Flood Basalts: The Columbia River Flood Basalts are an extensive sequence of stacked lava flows that reach a cumulative thickness of up to 6000 feet. The outcrops in the foreground and in the distance of this photo all are made up of layered basalt flows. Although basalt is typically a dark black rock it often weathers to a yellow-brown color similar to the rocks shown here. Public domain image by Williamborg. Uses of Basalt Basalt is used for a wide variety of purposes. It is most commonly crushed for use as an aggregate in construction projects. Crushed basalt is used for road base, concrete aggregate, asphalt pavement aggregate, railroad ballast, filter stone in drain fields and may other purposes. Basalt is also cut into dimension stone. Thin slabs of basalt are cut and sometimes polished for use as floor tiles, building veneer, monuments and other stone objects. Contributor: Hobart King Taking just one of the main ingredients of Basalt namely Plagioclase feldspar . Its chemical content is Chemical Composition NaAlSi3O8 CaAl2Si2O8 which means there is sodium, aluminium, silicon, oxygen calcium as its elements constituents . Gabbro and Basalt are Related Gabbros are equivalent in composition to basalts. The difference between the two rock types is their grain size. Basalts are extrusive igneous rocks that cool quickly and have fine-grained crystals. Gabbros are intrusive igneous rocks that cool slowly and have coarse-grained crystals. Gabbro is composed mainly of calcium-rich plagioclase feldspar (usually labradorite or bytownite) and clinopyroxene (augite). Minor amounts of olivine and orthopyroxene might also be present in the rock. Then there is the Pyroxine mineral content. Olivine, Amphibole, Garnet One can imagine the tracing of all the distributed, elements, molecules and fragmented minerals that came together out of the dust clouds of the infant solar system , Then the Heaving furnace of the original molten Earth. Finally the crystalisation of the above mentioned minerals, under the heat and pressure of the earths mantle . All this to show itself ultimately as a Basalt Flow or Basalt Pillars . Can we say this is movement to innate order or is movement to innate disorder ? I reason at the moment , that although it has had an ordering period from dust in outer space to basalt . As well as a little to and fro with plate tectonics , volcanism , and uplift. My sample is fairly static at the moment so this result is STATIC EQUILIBRIUM =. 5 + or - 0.5 2. Is. STATIC equilibrium = 5 + or - 0.5 Mike

Yes well I am sure that is the Deccan Traps that you are speaking about . The Green Bits The Deccan basalts may have played a role in the extinction of the dinosaurs. Most of the basalt was erupted between 65 and 60 million years ago. Gases released by the eruption may have changed the global climate and lead to the demise of the dinosaurs 65 million years ago. This photo shows the Deccan Tarps between Mambai and Mahabaleshwar. Photograph by Lazlo Keszthelyi, January 27, 1996. Vocanologists are also trying to understand how such great volumes of lava are erupted. Early models proposed that lava flooded across large areas at extremely rapid rates. Recently proposed models suggested that at least some of the flows are emplaced at gradual rates, lasting months to years. This photo shows the Ajunta Caves, temples carved into the basalts. Note the school group for scale. Photograph by Lazlo Keszthelyi, January 31, 1996. More information on the Deccan Mike

Yes well Deccan traps were pouring out bassalt by the gigga ton at this time .

I have a few supportive Pictures of the iridium layer as found by Alveres the Italian. It is just down from my house, behind Gubbio Italy . Took these Pictures last year. This is the valley This is the K-T boundry where the iridium was/is found . I have a bit at home somewhere . This says its the place This describes the K-T boundry speaks of 65 million years This points to which is K and which is T Tersery T at Top K cretateous at Bottom This mentions Alveres and 65 million years Mike

Yes, well I agreed to use a moderated expression for "clever " Post #90. http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/81894-is-there-evidence-of-cleverness-in-nature-and-its-processes/page-5#entry793840 The relevant piece being " Quote . .Mike -------------------- ---------------- --------------- --------------------/// A definition of "cleverness" to make measurements. : . Now . " INNATE PROGRESSIVE CHANGE" A discrete system will be referred to as :- . Clever ( INNATE PROGRESSIVE CHANGE) if it has reducing entropy . Moving from a state of disorder to a state of more order. 5 To. 0 A discrete system will be referred to as :- without Cleverness ( without INNATE PROGRESSIVE CHANGE) , if it has static or increasing entropy. Moving from a state of order to a state of more disorder. 5 To. 10 ------------ -------------- ------------------ ----------------- ------------------/// Unquote " Thus not pre supposing a result , for the time being just testing for :- What proportion , or distribution of moving to 0 entropy. Order . Or Moving to max entropy . Disorder Do we actually have across the universe ( across space and time ) ? Once having got a reasonable feeling for the distribution of each , we can then begin to discuss any possible implications ! Clearly Wikipedia quotes " In the recent 2003 book SYNC the Emerging Science of Spontaneous Order by Steven Strogatz, for example, we find Scientists have often been baffled by the existence of spontaneous order in the universe. The laws of thermodynamics seem to dictate the opposite, that nature should inexorably degenerate toward a state of greater disorder, greater entropy. Yet all around us we see magnificent structuresgalaxies, cells, ecosystems, human beingsthat have all somehow managed to assemble themselves. [14] " Similarly , based on any reasoning , we are still free to make our own choice, as to the implications. But that should possibly come after the survey which I proposed , above . Looking across space and time with a simplified view of entropy , for. ' innate progressive order ' and/or / both 'innate move to disorder '. Mike As reasoned above . And reply to unity+ below . Mike Hey I have done it ! Finally uploaded the trees I saw immediately after receiving your lovely post yesterday , while walking my friend , the dog ! Mike I am , like with swansont 's comment . Not trying to evade the remarks about cleverness, but postpone the meaning until later , after we / I have , established better the proportions and slew or no slew , in the relative Order to disorder ratio. Then based on the ratio we might better be poised to discuss the implications of the results, meanings of words like clever, and choices of acceptance or otherwise. If that makes any sense. . .? Ps. Thinking about what you said ... And my redefinition previously ... It could be called defined as INNATE CHANGE TOWARDS ORDER for less entropy INNATE CHANGE TOWARDS DISORDER For more entropy Then whether we think , what about either or both is later something for discussion . Eg Towards order MAKES the universe what it is or becomes Towards disorder is the ENERGY by which the universe makes things happen Mike

I need to clear up what could be interpreted as a wrong proposal. I was not suggesting that the iridium was in itself responsible for any mass extermination. I should have made clear the iridium was merely a marker. It was a world wide marker. Hence whatever happened was a world wide event. We know it was the asteroid that was involved , as the type of iridium ( particular isotope ) , that appears worldwide is the type of the asteroid , not the naturally occurring earth bound iridium ( different isotope of iridium ) . Also it was not the dust that killed directly, it is likely the cutting out of the light of the sun that stunted photosynthesis in edible vegetation that caused the extermination. Much of this dust could have been by much increased volcanic activity at the time. Mike

The definitions of entropy are many and varied depending on their specific use : however an ever growing popularity is that of Entropy being a measure of DISORDER as opposed to ORDER . LINK. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entropy_(order_and_disorder) follow index to ENTROPY ( order and disorder ) then to THE ENTROPY OF THE UNIVERSE TENDS TO A MAXIMUM. A particular part of this Wikipedia discussion says concerning the general run down of the universe to disorder and the apparent ordering by natural selection :- Quote " THE ENTROPY OF THE UNIVERSE TENDS TO A MAXIMUM. Thus, if entropy is associated with disorder and if the entropy of the universe is headed towards maximal entropy, then many are often puzzled as to the nature of the "ordering" process and operation of evolution in relation to Clausius' most famous version of the second law, which states that the universe is headed towards maximal disorder. In the recent 2003 book SYNC the Emerging Science of Spontaneous Order by Steven Strogatz, for example, we find Scientists have often been baffled by the existence of spontaneous order in the universe. The laws of thermodynamics seem to dictate the opposite, that nature should inexorably degenerate toward a state of greater disorder, greater entropy. Yet all around us we see magnificent structuresgalaxies, cells, ecosystems, human beingsthat have all somehow managed to assemble themselves. [14] The common argument used to explain this is that, locally, entropy can be lowered by external action, e.g. solar heating action, and that this applies to machines, such as a refrigerator, where the entropy in the cold chamber is being reduced, to growing crystals, and to living organisms.[2] This local increase in order is, however, only possible at the expense of an entropy increase in the surroundings; here more disorder must be created.[2][15] The conditioner of this statement suffices that living systems are open systems in which both heat, mass, and or work may transfer into or out of the system. Unlike temperature, the putative entropy of a living system would drastically change if the organism were thermodynamically isolated. If an organism was in this type of isolated situation, its entropy would increase markedly as the once-living components of the organism decayed to an unrecognizable mass.[11] ". Unquote Clearly from these last two paragraphs , the discussion goes on. But to allow for the project to hand to be conducted we could define simply Things moving toward a state of disorder as having an increase in Entropy. And Things moving toward a state of order as having a decrease in Entropy. If we then establish a bell curve or a slewed bell curve , we can debate the significance of this particular definition and it's indications or implications. Mike Ps as regards your comments in your introductory box. The first half is repeated in the Wikipedia paragraph quoted , where confusion exists to many scientists. The second half I believe ( whether accidental) or is Sounding the wrong way round . However this is all ' jumping the gun '

well yes, iridium was/is radio active , which is why is works. It all started from the same time,[the impact] same source for all places where it fell. Not sure if that applied to Permian extinction event. I suppose it could for the same reason. I will need to look that up . mike

Oh dear, I have not done that bit yet . Sounds quite dramatic though. Cornwall I mean ! Eek ! I think the last time I looked up what your name meant ,it sounded appropriate. ( crusty chunk of land or something , hard and knurled ! . .? ) Will re google it Ah yes I remember " a piece of ocean crust that has been uplifted to be exposed. " do you feel exposed" ?http://en.wikipehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gros_Morne_moho.jpgdia.org/wiki/Ophiolite So how does that figure with Cornwall . Was it squished and it uplifted and stuck on at the Lizard ? Mike

I had to leave the cafe with the dog to where trees grow prolifically .......I had not read your post until I was in the park . It moved me to take this picture of. ..treeness.... ..my ability to upload pictures seems to have come to an abrupt halt. Reported to Dave ..May be server . Such a good post tar. I am rather thrown . I will re-group . Try and sort this matter , and take it up again soon. Mike

A whole series of coincidental events have made this current stage of events very enlightening. My recent learning in Geology , has led me to understand that ,things were not always this way in Devon/Somerset/Dorset ( the Jurasic Coast ) . In the days of the first super continents Gwanda and Laurasia before they ended up as Pangea . This coastal remnant was deep within a vast continent , where rivers, the size of the Mediterranean and English Channel . Rock would break off and roll down thousands of miles of river bed leaving the pebble beds and eroded sand of inland desserts . Shallow warm seas would deposit there own load of eroded red sand .clay and critter derived chalk in addition to the pebbles . The ammonites, Dinosaurs lived their lives on these lands now only a fossil remains. The mighty meteor crashing into the Yucatan left its radioactive iridium to spread worldwide , only to be discovered first by the Italian Alverese who made his descovery not 5 miles from where I spend the Mediterranean part of my life, out in Italy . While researching the cosmos I find the latitude to see clearly the constellation of Saggitarius Is 40 degrees north. Which goes strait through where I live in ITALY. Which when seen has the configuration of THE TEAPOT . Following up the spout and just beyond can be found saggitarius a* which is the centre of our galaxy . All this is a set of happy coincidents , but many fortuitous co incidents which is ........Serendipity. Or so the story goes. Mike

Now I get it! But I am still down in a cavern well underground and rising . Soon to be , measuring worms, slime, basalt, and roots. I will have to see which side of the pond I surface and see what the locals are feasting on ? If it's peanut butter mixed with chocolate all rolling around in ecstasy , I will know I am in the U.S of A . Mike

Brilliant! Sounds highly calorific ! Anyway you are supposed to be talking " ENTROPY " at me , with me, or against me ! Not the 3 rd joy after ... Whatever ! Mike

Tar, I really would like your deep thoughts on all this,[ your above comments !] as I am Using Entropy now as the TESTING DEVICE in an extensive probe of the whole shaboodle-boodle to see how it is performing .? Quantitatively and Objectively .! As I have been urged., so to do. I personally think there might be something quite profound to be had, here ! I have a fairly good 'nose' for these sort of things. It is a bit like dogs sniffing out drugs. mike.

Naming the 100 entities and making tests :- As an initial example :- 1. Finding oneself in a cavern some distance underground . Stalactites dripping , dark, water at my feet , cold . What can I observe. Possibly the process of mineral deposition in the stalactite production. Some bacteria in the water and on the rock, eeking out a living . The rocks surrounding me , doing whatever rocks do in these cicumstances. The air is dank ? Humm! O.k. So my observation no 1 is :- That there is here a little mini environment . What is the state of entropy here? There is change afoot, is it deteriorating , less order , more entropy , static, or more order lower entropy? Individually there are changes going on. Chemicals are being deposited, biological digestion is no doubt occurring , rocks are under pressure and compressing . As a whole though I think if I returned , there would be a change to more order , all-be-it fairly slowly . Entropy is decreasing . Moving toward order. 1 . entropy = 4 ( where entropy , 5 = static , 0 = perfectly ordered , 10 = absolutely disordered Mike

An Objective test. 100 individual aspects of the Universe across Space and Time From below the surface of the EARTH to: The Largest Structure in the Observable Universe ( Space ) and The Big Bang ( Time ) . TESTING FOR THE DIRECTION OF ENTROPY ( INCREASE , STATIC , DECREASE ) with Values . mike

The Permian Mass Extinction event was likely a phased set of events. Starting with the Sea . The land animal extinction was likely to include an asteroid/ comet ,/ meteor / event , as part of the extinction process. link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permian%E2%80%93Triassic_extinction_event Lystrosaurus was by far the most abundant early Triassic land vertebrate Artist's impression of a major impact event: A collision between Earth and an asteroid a few kilometres in diameter would release as much energy as several million nuclear weapons detonating. Approx 250 million Years ago The end of the Dinosaurs( K-T Boundary [ Cretaceous-Tertiary Periods] boundary ) is equally likely to have an asteroid as a trigger to that extinction . link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_the_dinosaurs#Extinction_of_major_groups Approx 65 million years ago The small Dinosaur was heard to say to the big Dinosaur " Can ' you,' get the next one ? " Mike [Comment Courtesy Arc] WHY Serendipity ?

The Three Princes of Serendip and their gift of making fortunate discoveries! I was brought up in Devon . England . I could never understand as a boy , why the countryside around Torquay, Dawlish, Totnes, and the Coast to Budleigh Salterton, and beyond was so red, when I was taught as a child in school ,to draw the soil as brown. . Now I know. ,! I was seeing and standing in and on some of the land between the two greatest mass extinction events of all time ! The great Permian Extinction event, several hundred million years ago before the rise of the Dinosaurs, and much later in time , some 65 million years ago , the mass extinction event, to end of the age of the Dinosaurs . It is no wonder that bones of dinosaurs , wash out of the cliffs along the Jurassic Coast , after the horrific battering seas of recent weeks ! It is as if the film 'Jurassic Park' is being re-enacted Wow!

Thank you for constructive comments. i am going to take a re-cap to see where I am at the moment with this thread ! mainly with a new descriptor : INNATE PROGRESSIVE CHANGE instead of CLEVER A means of objective observation with numbers : : . [A] if it has reducing entropy .Moving from a state of disorder to a state of more order. 5 To. 0 . , if it has static or increasing entropy. Moving from a state of order to a state of more disorder. 5 To. 10 mike I appreciate the examples ,that I have used , may need adding to. This , in order to get the true spit of this investigation and analysis . However I believe I now have a reasonable basis to have what I think is : A means to look at and obtain objective ,numerical proportions of INNATE CHANGE and see whether there is in fact INNATE PROGRESSIVE CHANGE by reducing entropy, as well as INNATE normal increasing entropy , as a proportion. mike