DrDNA

Religious right? I don't even know what that means any more. Just the thought of the use/misuse of this term makes me cringe as if someone scrapped their fingernails on a chalk board. Can you please define this term for me in your intended context? PS: I voted for Obama and about 90% sure I will again. I absolutely do advocate violence strongly, but only as a last resort. Feet, if a viable alternative to the situation at hand, are much more efficient and safer for all parties. Science is a beautiful language of God. Lies and closed mindedness are languages of the the devil. Colossians 1 New International Version (NIV)16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. No, but the furniture should be tagged as "unclean" and put into storage for 7 days, after which time the tag can be removed, the furniture cleaned with detergent and used again as normal. Seriously, what the....?? No more so than any other sinner. Including me.

Thanks for the clarification Mooeyoo!

This is an example the need to be careful how you interpret what you read, think, hear, say, etc. 1. a giant flood is lore in many cultlures 2. Was the whole earth flooded or some area flooded? a. Earth as in planet Earth = kadur ha'arets (כדור הארץ) earth as in soil = adamah (אדמה). For example the soil/earth from which Adam was made. earth as in land or territory = erets (ארץ) hebrew words for earth b. For example: -God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah and Lot's daughters said "there's not a man in the earth #776 Strong's Concordance (erets) to come in unto us" (Genesis 19:31) Not every man in the world was killed ... only those in the area of the destruction. -Exodus 9:33 "the rain was not poured upon the earth" #776 Strong's Concordance (erets)... Of course we understand it is just speaking about a certain area in Egypt. -Genesis 7, "Noah's flood": the flood covered "the earth", the Hebrew word used in the original writing by Moses was #776 Strong's Concordance "erets", meaning "the land" (see above). The flood cover a particular region, not the whole earth. This is a problem a BROKEN translation and our BROKEN interpretation of the translation. Not with the story itself.

You ever 'TRY' to shoot a target in the leg (relatively narrow, below the horizontal plane of the shooter's arm/pistol and for a real person often rapidly shifting position)? As opposed to the preferred, much more stable, large center of mass (ie, the chest). Besides, people with holes in their leg can still kill you. That always makes for interesting cinema and TV. No cop academy, no paramilitary, military or self defense class would EVER teach that. After demanding the offender to drop his weapon fails, you aim for center of mass and shoot to kill. That is assuming that you can't use your best defensive weapon, your feet. Maybe that's broken too, if so, broken is the way it is. Why can't we, don't we, do both? There is a risk that you're bordering on stereotyping. I'm not accusing, nor assuming you have crossed that line, but I do see the risk; perhaps because of my sensitivity to being stereotype myself.... Being both scientist and Christian, I get it from both side at least weekly depending on the present company. Chill. No deceit was intended in the edit.

Regarding the Quran,, perhaps this is what you may have been looking for (I know that I was after 9/11)? It definitely does state that Christians and Jews are to be greeted with peace. "Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabians -- whoever believes in God and the Last Day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord. And there will be no fear for them, nor shall they grieve" (2:62, 5:69). "...and nearest among them in love to the believers will you find those who say, 'We are Christians,' because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant" (5:82). "O you who believe! Be helpers of God -- as Jesus the son of Mary said to the Disciples, 'Who will be my helpers in (the work of) God?' Said the disciples, 'We are God's helpers!' (61:14). Also, regarding how Christians and Jews should treat Muslims and others... Leviticus 19:33-34: “When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.” Exodus 22:21: “You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt.” Deut 24:14 Do not take advantage of a hired worker who is poor and needy, whether that worker is a fellow Israelite or a foreigner residing in one of your towns. 15 Pay them their wages each day before sunset, because they are poor and are counting on it. Otherwise they may cry to the Lord against you, and you will be guilty of sin. 17 Do not deprive the foreigner or the fatherless of justice, or take the cloak of the widow as a pledge. 18 Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and the Lord your God redeemed you from there. That is why I command you to do this. 19 When you are harvesting in your field and you overlook a sheaf, do not go back to get it. Leave it for the foreigner, the fatherless and the widow, so that the Lord your God may bless you in all the work of your hands. 20 When you beat the olives from your trees, do not go over the branches a second time. Leave what remains for the foreigner, the fatherless and the widow. 21 When you harvest the grapes in your vineyard, do not go over the vines again. Leave what remains for the foreigner, the fatherless and the widow. 22 Remember that you were slaves in Egypt. That is why I command you to do this. Luke 6:27-31. Jesus says: “But I say to you who here, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you. To one who strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also, and from one who takes away your cloak do not withhold your tunic either. Give to everyone who begs from you, and from one who takes away your goods do not demand them back. And as you wish that others would do to you, do so to them.” It is so sad how this has been twisted and misinterpreted for selfish gain and hatred, and anger's sake. These words are NOT BROKEN

maybe I don't "have to", but if it came down to a decision between some really "broken" dude seriously harming any child, my wife or a loved one, or me shooting the "broken" dude in the face, I'm gonna shoot the broken dude in the face all day, every day. I take that back. I do "have to".

? The claim that "people that believe in God are broken"? Please clarify. He can't? Why can't he? Anyway, bullets do not have free will. I think that iNow was actually correct in his choice for terminology. I (perhaps incorrectly) see broken as a metaphor for fallen. There used to be a three legged cat that lived in our barn and ate mice. Nicest cat i ever saw. I don't where she came from. I think she just moved in. Having only 3 legs, she was definitely "broken". She couldn't get away from the 'unbroken' male cats and maybe she went in heat more than most cats. I don't know for sure but it sure seemed like she was always pregnant. And she had literally hundreds of descendants over the course of 5-6 years. My point is, as long as the right parts are working, I don't think that being broken impedes the ability to reproduce. And we have the Jerry Springer show.......

No one knows really. But I think that you just demonstrated that you are the type of person that needs to search for an answer to this and similar questions. How old are you by the way?

Would be nice if it was possible, but impractical. You would not take the life of an individual if it was the only means possible, God forbid, to protect a child (or loved one) from imminent death at the hands of said individual?

I don't believe that he made the Philistines that way. I think that they chose, through their own free will, to be that way.

The issue here, as I understand it, is about people who believe in God being broken. Not some delusional higher collective I disagree that only those who believe in God are broken. My stance is simply that we are ALL broken. Anything other than that, in my opinion, is arrogant, elitist and religion bashing. Which is rampant here. Interesting site. And no doubt God did kill a lot of people, but I don't necessarily see the sin in it. Did the allies sin when they killed a bunch of Nazis?

Many things seem odd at first. Like God telling the Hebrews to kill the Philistines in the land of Palestine after they left Egypt. This seems cruel. But if you read about the Philistines, they worshiped Baal. And part of the worship of Baal required sacrificing babies. God knew that this would infiltrate the Hebrews as they were an apparently wayward bunch. So he chose to have his chosen people not be influenced by this. This is the part, I believe, where parable and reality meet. The point actually is, Job did not waver and was rewarded at least 10x. In other words, you may suffer in the short term, but your reward awaits you in the end. He doesn't send anyone. It is all about freedom of choice and free will. By definition, WE believe that the God of the Hebrews is unable to "sin". What sin do you think that God committed?

But you admitted to baiting.

I'm familiar with it, of course. But it doesn't change anything. It is less elegant than saying 'my girlfriend is perfect for me, she must have been made just for me'. Either way, they are both irrelevant. The chances of the mud puddle even existing are off the charts. The chances of the girlfriend existing....for you....zero.

LOL. You are just going by the existing evidence. I mean by calculation?

I'm not a creationist and you got a problem with me. What's the problem. You bored stoning Christians? You want to stone some Mormons or some Hindus or some Buddhists? How about stoning some Muslims. That should be fun. About what exactly? Yep. He was for sure. He admitted to it. Just as I speculated a few days ago. And to flush the bird out of the bush ( and for entertainment), I sucked on that bait like a catfish sucking on stink bait on the bottom of the river.

OK. I'll bite. Do you how much time that would take?

The universe exits. It exists with billions of galaxies in it with billions of solar systems and untold number of planets. Stars had to go supernova billions of years ago for the elements that created you to exist. You just so happen to live on one planet that is perfectly tuned for life. And you are part of a species that has evolved to a level to put satellites into orbit and create satellite broadcasts. And you are looking for miracles? Note: credit tar for the idea LOL. OK.

I apologize. Then why do you punish yourself reading it over and over? I don't assume that at all. Thanks for thinking for me. And you are incorrect. Completely. As a matter of fact, it definitely is the Christians that are crucified on here. Every now and then a creationist comes on here spouting some nonsense and deserves to get stoned. But in most cases, all one has to do is affirm that they believe in God and they get stoned immediately. Read my post again more carefully. The way you read the Bible and you will see that I implied exactly the same thing. He's not such a prime example of a critical reader. See above. Just as I suspected and even stated earlier. This is your guilty plea that you are/were "baiting". See my post a couple of days ago. Now, who's ignorant?

So, what existed before the Big Bang? Just because I can't drive a Lamborghini 200 mph doesn't mean that the car is defective. Not everything in it makes sense. Yes. To us it doesn't right now. That doesn't mean that it is broken. More than likely, it means that we are broken. For example, to use the example above, the first pages of Genesis didn't make much sense until the Big Bang theory.

I understand. God's time vs our time, parable vs poetry vs exactly as it happened, etc is a toughie. That's why it is important to read the whole thing. Without skipping around at least one time. I know that it takes a LOT of time and effort, unless you are Phi for All . And if you are not a Christian, you're saying to yourself, why bother.

If you admittedly don't know it, then why do you keep trying to debate it? Wow. This is starting to look like the EXACT mirror image of one of those 6000 yr old creationists trying to debate cosmology...... Did I fall through a worm hole and end up on the other side?

Doesn't make a whole lot of sense read randomly. I used to do that. But reading it in such a manner makes it difficult, change that to impossible, to distinguish the parables from the poetry and stories that meant to be taken directly (perhaps what you call "rational"). It also makes it impossible to see, for example, how Genesis ties in with Exodus, Daniel and Isiah and the whole New Testament, etc. This is absolutely correct. But we have a mixture of both here and I didn't want to leave anyone out.

Be careful. We already tried that. They don't want to hear that here.....whoops, here comes a stone... "At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds."John 8:59 That's pretty much self explanatory then. What grade did you get in Physics and how long it take you to quote "read" the book?

Just read this completely and get back to me in a year or so. Holy Bible Then perhaps we can discuss your doubts intelligently. You can't poo poo it if you don't know it. It amazes me how scientists and pseudo-scientists love to argue about things they know nothing about, yet they immediately try to guard science from non-scientists and non-pseudo-scientists like it is the Holy Grail (pardon the pun...seriously not intended). This is very similar to that so-called Christian guy in Texas that runs a """museum"""" with a rock in it that he claims has footprints, one being from a "dinosaur" and the other from a "man" imprinted at the same time period. he doesn't have a clue what he is arguing about either. No. It is not similar. It is identical to the above. You seem to be implying that we were all made perfectly and that the world (our parents, teachers, siblings, relatives, neighbors, religion, governments, "the man"....etc...) messed us all up? What evidence do you have that this is true?