beecee

The above diagram comes from https://www.google.com/search?q=diagram+of+kerr+black+hole&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=4V9uShC-DtKQeM%3A%2Cbu-ap0qGAmS9qM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQgSMBliLO0AMivK3dyy8VV7CWSWg&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjTz56Rw7fiAhVQfisKHU9qCwkQ9QEwBHoECAkQDA#imgrc=4V9uShC-DtKQeM:

It's far more frightening how many Joe Blows can have the audacity to claim on a science forum, that he or she has somehow found the answer to a particular scenario, that the professionals have been researching for many years. As Ghideon has alluded to, first know what exactly is inside the box before trying to explore outside.

Granted, but I'm not sure that Eddington would have really did what you suggest. Still the many more accurate tests since, have verified his findings.

As an old bastard, and in my day I would have said, get him some appropriate books for his age, which generally tend to make it fun and interactive as you are doing. But in this day of the 21st century with the Internet and such, I'm sure there may be something more attuned to someone born in this age of the Internet.

The above is a diagram in line with the best knowledge we have, that may help. Also I believe you will obtain some good info here....https://jila.colorado.edu/~ajsh/

https://phys.org/news/2019-05-massive-martian-ice-discovery-window.html Massive Martian ice discovery opens a window into red planet's history: Newly discovered layers of ice buried a mile beneath Mars' north pole are the remnants of ancient polar ice sheets and could be one of the largest water reservoirs on the planet, according to scientists at The University of Texas at Austin and the University of Arizona. The team made the discovery using measurements gathered by the Shallow Radar (SHARAD) on NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter (MRO). SHARAD emits radar waves that can penetrate up to a mile and a half beneath the surface of Mars. The findings, published May 22 in Geophysical Research Letters, are important because the layers of ice are a record of past climate on Mars in much the same way that tree rings are a record of past climate on Earth. Studying the geometry and composition of these layers could tell scientists whether climate conditions were previously favorable for life, researchers said. The team found layers of sand and ice that were as much as 90% water in some places. If melted, the newly discovered polar ice would be equivalent to a global layer of water around Mars at least 1.5 meters (5 feet) deep. more at link.... the paper: https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1029/2019GL082114 Buried ice and sand caps at the north pole of Mars: revealing a record of climate change in the cavi unit with SHARAD: Abstract: The cavi unit at the north pole of Mars is a deposit of aeolian sand and water ice underlying the Late Amazonian north polar layered deposits (NPLD). Its strata of Middle to Late Amazonian age record wind patterns and past climate. The Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter Shallow Radar (SHARAD) reveals extensive internal and basal layering within the cavi unit, allowing us to determine its general structure and relative permittivity. Assuming a basalt composition for the sand (ε’=8.8), results indicate that cavi contains an average ice fraction between 62% in Olympia Planum and 88% in its northern reaches beneath the NPLD, and thus represents one of the largest water reservoirs on the planet. Internal reflectors indicate vertical variability in composition, likely in the form of alternating ice and sand layers. The ice layers may be remnants of former polar caps, and thus represent a unique record of climate cycles predating the NPLD. Plain language summary: The north polar region of Mars includes the so‐called cavi unit, a deposit of water ice and sand hundreds of million years old that lies beneath the current ice cap. The Shallow Radar on Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter can image through the cavi unit deposits, revealing their internal structure and composition. We find that these deposits are very rich in ice, which lies in horizontal slabs alternated with sand. The occurrence and volume of ice slabs increases towards the north pole. This ice may be the leftover of former ice caps that diminished during warm periods, and therefore represents an important record of past martian climate. The large volume of ice preserved within the cavi unit represents one of the largest water reservoirs on the planet.

https://phys.org/news/2019-05-scientists-mechanisms-formation-moon.html Scientists discover one of the mechanisms of water formation on the moon: The results of a recent study conducted by the NASA Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter, the agency's automatic interplanetary station, show the existence of 'permafrost' near the poles of the moon with a relatively high content of water ice (up to 5% by weight). It is believed that water ice could supply a life support system for the future Russian Lunar Station, and that it could also produce hydrogen-oxygen fuel for flights into deep space. Researchers from the Higher School of Economics and the Space Research Institute of the Russian Academy of Sciences have discovered one of the mechanisms for how water forms on the moon. Scientists have shown that silver hydroxide molecules are released from silicon dioxide in the lunar regolith (soil). These molecules react easily with hydrogen, leading to the formation of water and silver. This means that water molecules can be formed on the moon. These molecules will become part of the near-surface lunar soil. In some areas, the proportion of water formed by this mechanism in the lunar regolith may exceed 10-6 %. more at link.... the paper: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1134%2FS0010952519020047 Water Formation in the Lunar Regolith: Abstract This study shows that oxygen atoms can be released from a crystal lattice of silicon dioxide in the lunar regolith as parts of silver hydroxide molecules. In turn, silver hydroxide can relatively easily react with hydrogen to generate water and silver. This means that the formation of water molecules involved in near-surface lunar soil is possible. The presence of water molecules in lunar soil can affect the photoelectric properties of the lunar regolith and the parameters of the dusty plasma system over the Moon. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Another article.... https://phys.org/news/2019-05-formation-moon.html For the first time, a cross-disciplinary study has shown chemical, physical, and material evidence for water formation on the moon. Two teams from the University of Hawaiʻi at Mānoa collaborated on the project: physical chemists at the UH Mānoa Department of Chemistry's W.M. Keck Research Laboratory in Astrochemistry and planetary scientists at the Hawai'i Institute of Geophysics and Planetology (HIGP). Although recent discoveries by orbiting spacecraft such as the Lunar Prospector and the hard lander Lunar Crater Observation and Sensing Satellite suggest the existence of water ice at the poles the moon, the origin of this water has remained uncertain. Lunar water represents one of the key requirements for permanent colonization of the moon as a feedstock for fuel and energy generation (hydrogen, oxygen) and also as "drinking water." more at link.... the paper: https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2019/05/14/1819600116 Untangling the formation and liberation of water in the lunar regolith: Significance: Observational evidence collected over the past two decades supports the existence of water on the Moon. However, the sources and chemical and/or physical processes responsible for the production of the lunar water are still unknown. Here, we provide evidence via laboratory simulation experiments that water can be generated and liberated through thermal shocks induced by micrometeorite impacts on solar-wind proton-implanted anhydrous silicates. Our findings are of fundamental importance for explaining the origin of water on the Moon as well as on other airless bodies such as Ceres and for untangling the present distribution of water in our solar system. Abstract: The source of water (H2O) and hydroxyl radicals (OH), identified on the lunar surface, represents a fundamental, unsolved puzzle. The interaction of solar-wind protons with silicates and oxides has been proposed as a key mechanism, but laboratory experiments yield conflicting results that suggest that proton implantation alone is insufficient to generate and liberate water. Here, we demonstrate in laboratory simulation experiments combined with imaging studies that water can be efficiently generated and released through rapid energetic heating like micrometeorite impacts into anhydrous silicates implanted with solar-wind protons. These synergistic effects of solar-wind protons and micrometeorites liberate water at mineral temperatures from 10 to 300 K via vesicles, thus providing evidence of a key mechanism to synthesize water in silicates and advancing our understanding on the origin of water as detected on the Moon and other airless bodies in our solar system such as Mercury and asteroids.

Thanks Migl....particularly re your comment on spin and angular momentum, hence my "correction" comment. Your comment on "frame dragging" is valid I believe and relevant to what my thoughts are.

https://phys.org/news/2019-05-video-years-gravity.html One hundred years ago this month, observations performed during a total solar eclipse proved for the first time the gravitational bending of light predicted by Albert Einstein's new theory of gravity, general relativity. In this video, Günther Hasinger, ESA Director of Science, reflects on this historic measurement that inaugurated a century of exciting experiments, investigating gravity on Earth and in space and proving general relativity in ever greater detail. more at link.....

A BH can have three properties that we are aware of...mass, spin or angular momentum and charge. The charge would I 'm pretty sure, be rather quickly negated. Which leaves spin. Why couldn't spin [angular momentum] be either increased or slowed down? Ignoring the fact that a BH's spin rate does have limitations [naked singularities just do not and cannot exist] why couldn't say magnetic field lines, matter/energy falling in, colliding BH's or BH's colliding with Neutron stars not have the opposite effect of slowing it down? Sure, over a much much longer time frame. The other possibility that just came to mind is Hawking Radiation. correction: Doing a bit of research, I found that BH's do not really have any defined "spin velocity" but do have angular momentum.Perhaps a bit pedant but anyway.... https://www.google.com/search?q=can+black+holes+lose+angular+momentum%3F&oq=can+black+holes+lose+angular+momentum%3F&aqs=chrome..69 I also found this, which seems to support my contention.... https://academic.oup.com/mnras/article/305/3/654/983338 The evolution of black hole mass and angular momentum: Abstract: We show that neither accretion nor angular momentum extraction is likely to lead to significant changes in the mass M1 or angular momentum parameter a* of a black hole in a binary system with realistic parameters. Current values of M1 and a* therefore probably reflect those at formation. We show further that sufficiently energetic jet ejection powered by the rotational energy of a black hole can stabilize mass transfer in systems with large adverse mass ratios, and even reduce the mass transfer rate to the point where the binary becomes transient. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Summing up my thoughts re BH properties, I see charge as being negated over short time frames,and angular momentum negated over much much longer time frames approaching the lifetime of the universe, though still just short of BH evaporation via Hawking Radiation. Any thoughts, errors or corrections from those that know better?

When I mentioned gravitational waves being detected from the BB itself, I was not that certain that it was within the capabilities of aLIGO and Virgo, but probably more probable with LISA once it is launched and set up. If such waves were to be detected, I would imagine it would be analogous to when the Higg's particle was found and referred to as the "God Particle". The difficulty though in detecting such waves, even for LISA would be immense. On checking for some info on the subject I found a couple of interesting articles........ https://theconversation.com/how-giant-atoms-may-help-catch-gravitational-waves-from-the-big-bang-80430 extract: "But there are limits to what LIGO can do. While gravitational waves exist with a big variety of frequencies, LIGO can only detect those within a certain range. In particular, there’s no way of measuring the type of high frequency gravitational waves that were generated in the Big Bang itself." https://theconversation.com/gravitational-waves-offer-glimpse-into-the-past-but-will-we-ever-catch-ripples-from-the-big-bang-54855 extract: "To make such observations will require detectors with sizes far larger than the 4km arms of LIGO. The proposed eLISA experiment will put three satellites into orbit as an equilateral triangle with sides longer than the distance from the Earth to the moon." and the following by Lawrence Krauss: https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/space/these-waves-may-let-us-see-big-bang-s-earliest-n744851 Either way such detections are certainly a way off yet, if at all. But if one day instruments such as LISA do detect gravitational waves from the BB, obviously it will be a "eureka moment" and give us insight into the supposed Inflation event and the quantum foam from whence the BB speculatively evolved from.

https://phys.org/news/2019-05-nasa-unveils-artemis-moon-mission.html NASA on Thursday unveiled the calendar for the "Artemis" program that will return astronauts to the Moon for the first time in half a century, including eight scheduled launches and a mini-station in lunar orbit by 2024. The original lunar missions were named for Apollo—Artemis was his twin sister in Greek mythology, and the goddess of hunting, wilderness and the Moon. Administrator Jim Bridenstine confirmed that Artemis 1 will be an uncrewed mission around the Moon planned for 2020. Next will come Artemis 2, which will orbit Earth's satellite with a crew around 2022; followed finally by Artemis 3 that will put astronauts on lunar soil in 2024, including the first woman. The three will be launched into space by the biggest rocket of all time, the Boeing-led Space Launch System (SLS), which is currently under development but has seen numerous delays and has been criticized in some quarters as a bloated jobs program. more at link......

Gravitational waves [as I see it] are ripples in the "fabric" of the universe/space/time itself. Since mass exist in that fabric, the stretching and compressing of that mass as a gravitational wave passes through can be visualized. The vacuum you mention, is that same spacetime. Probably the most useful sought after information or detection of gravitational waves, will be detecting gravitational waves from the BB itself. Such a discovery will not be curtailed by the 380,000 year recombination era, as it is for EMR and light and will [as I see it] go right back to the actual instant of the BB.

Along with most other aspects of our life. Science doesn't need to answer any questions re the existence of anything we have no evidence for and which appears to be a stop gap answer and attempts in explaining that which science has not yet been able to explain. That's your prerogative. I prefer the support of evidence, or to simply admit that we are ignorant of all the answers at this time, but are ever so slowly chipping away at that ignorance and gaining more and more evidenced backed knowledge all the time.

Here is a recent article on that matter........ https://solarsystem.nasa.gov/news/863/nasa-study-reproduces-origins-of-life-on-ocean-floor/ NASA Study Reproduces Origins of Life on Ocean Floor: Scientists have reproduced in the lab how the ingredients for life could have formed deep in the ocean 4 billion years ago. The results of the new study offer clues to how life started on Earth and where else in the cosmos we might find it. A time-lapse video of a miniature hydrothermal chimney forming in the lab, as it would in early Earth's ocean. Natural vents can continue to form for thousands of years and grow to tens of yards (meters) in height. Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/Flores Astrobiologist Laurie Barge and her team at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, California, are working to recognize life on other planets by studying the origins of life here on Earth. Their research focuses on how the building blocks of life form in hydrothermal vents on the ocean floor. To re-create hydrothermal vents in the lab, the team made their own miniature seafloors by filling beakers with mixtures that mimic Earth's primordial ocean. These lab-based oceans act as nurseries for amino acids, organic compounds that are essential for life as we know it. Like Lego blocks, amino acids build on one another to form proteins, which make up all living things. more at link.....

I'm rather confident that the universe continues as a contest between the DE component of spacetime, and the gravity from matter/energy opposing that scenario. The evidence at this time shows that the universe evolved/Inflated from a hotter, denser state, [expansion] which continued to slow down for the first 8 billion years or so. As the mass/energy density continued to decrease with expansion, a point was reached around 5 billion years ago, when the DE component gradually overcome the continued slowing down of the expansion, as mass/energy density decreased, and we are now accelerating in that expansion phase. That is what the evidence tells us, and that is what [at least to me] sounds pretty logical.

I've seen your attitude on at least three science forums I have been a part of in my time. On all occasions, the so called open discussion you speak of are no more then agenda driven hypotheticals or unevidenced ideas that people seem to pull out of their rear end. We have a place for mainstream science discussions that deals in mainstream science, and we have speculative sections where people can put ideas and be prepared to support them. In near all cases they cannot, and then start crying when their ideas are challenged. S I don't see evidence, only unsupported opinion.

Nothing is perfect but the general scientific review system is the best we have and in the majority of cases through history, has been of great benefit.

Yep, that's another way of putting it.

Science is what we know: Philosophy is what we don't know. So why would those measurements be any different anywhere else in the solar system/galaxy/universe? I have a problem in accepting your confidence in your own hypothetical, when you have failed to even get the basics right. Like the following..... A scientific theory is as good as it gets, and they are either invalidated or made even more valid by further observational and/or experimental data. Also the 11 year cycle of the Sun is as far as I know, a magnetic field thingy which is reflected in increased sun spot activity and solar flares. Exoplanets are also evidenced by gravitational tugs or radial velocity, among other methods. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methods_of_detecting_exoplanets That is rubbish. We have seen various stages of the formation of planetary formation in other stars and the accretion disks from whence they are formed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protoplanetary_disk https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/a23318/triple-solar-system-forming-in-galaxy/ https://www.quantamagazine.org/stellar-disks-reveal-how-planets-get-made-20180521/ The evidence and observations above dispute that. Planetary disk formation is an evidenced backed theory. .. That is why I reject your confidence in your personal hypothesis when you cannot get the basics correct. No one claims absolute truth in cosmology. Theories are supported by evidence and the more evidence forthcoming, the more certain a theory becomes. eg: the BB, SR, GR,the theory of evolution just to name a few of the really near certain ones. Planets form at various distances from the center of the accretion disk and roughly speaking take on the makeup of the material in that part of the disk, which differs with the heavier elements closer in and lighter ones further out. eg: The terrestrial planets are closer in then the gaseous and icy giants. Also we also have much evidence of planetary migration and capture of other bodies.

BH's of all classifications and persuasions are evidenced in many ways. The relatively recent dozen or so gravitational waves discoveries matching templates of different sizes of BH's has made the theory of BH's near certain, noting of course that a theory is as good as it gets.

That's a fairy tale. We cannot see the stars in daytime, simply and logically because the brilliant light from the star/Sun, drowns out the rather dim light from the stars.

Listen here matey, I went to a Catholic school and was also an Altar boy! Until I got the sack when found with another, drinking the altar wine behind the altar!

The finite speed of light ensures that there is no universal "now". Any "now" is defined when photons reach our eyes. The further away a photon/light originates from, the further back in time we are looking.

Jesus, Mary and Joseph!!! BH's are BH's, pure and simple, whether quantum BH's [if they at all exist], Stellar BH's or SMBH's as found near the center of galaxies. It is simply a means of classification, much as we classify stars of different colour, and size. Also I saw something about BH density...To speak of BH density is an invalid concept, as according to GR, once the Schwarzchild radius is reached, further collapse is compulsory, at least up to the quantum/Planck level. Essentially a BH is nothing but critically curved spacetime with the mass at the core, at or below the quantum/Planck level, to the best of our knowledge and application of physics and GR.