beecee

You on the other hand respectfully of course, do seem to have an agenda. I answered your question, now you answer mine.... In the case I have mentioned many times, of the little girl being raped and tortured, do you believe the perpetrator should be given another chance? or have his life sentence reduced? ps: remember, he was alreay out on parole. Of course there is an answer. It just appears you don't want to accept that answer. and are making philosophical excuses, as you have with Hitler in trying to make him less of a monster then we all know he was.

I believe your position is wishy washy...I'm no philosopher, I'm no politician and I am not speaking from any political position, either left or right of the spectrum. I say what I feel, and what I believe the evidence supports.

Sure I'll answer it, but the merry-go-round will not stop.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve, with the interpretation of what then constitutes "deserving" being impacted upon by numerous fields, with many differing viewpoints and perspectives, including the concepts of moral correctness based on ethics, rationality, law, religion, equity and fairness. The state will sometimes endeavour to increase justice by operating courts and enforcing their rulings. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: In my own words justice does or should do as I said...[1]Punish [2] protect, [3] rehabilitate. All three apply because not all violent criminals of which I am speaking of, can be rehabilitated...you know that, I know that, and society knows that. There are good and evil people, from the top echelons of government and business, to the average man in the street. When you eventually admit that, then the merry-go-round will stop.

The essence of what I said of course has by-passed you, and actually has as much chance of implimentation as your wishy washy compassion for evil and evil doers. I certainly took pleasure in dishing out my version of comeuppance as a 10 year old and a few other moments in my life, when needed. Yes, you have said many unsupported and a couple of rather silly things relating to that monster. That's easy. Because what's left is why we have a reasonable justice system and prison, that gives the perpetrator his comeuppance, protects society and the victim, and makes rehabilitation possible. That will not change to any great extent. A far, far better place then letting evil incorrigibles run free and forgetting about the vicitm and society in general. That has nothing to do with criminal and society justice. There is a thread in which I have made comments and my feelings known on that, so if you like, question them there. You were and are understood, as you well know....and criticism [which you have ignored to a great extent] has been forthcoming with regards to your unworkable system, and may I say, a system that would not be accepted by any reasonable society. With all the wishy washy papers on political correctness with relation to justice and the criminal that have been put out for publication and the "feel good" talk fests that it gives birth to, not much has really been achieved, [other then what I have mentioned] simply because society in general, reject that, and see it for what it is, and what I have mentioned a few times now....that is politically, philosophical and unsupported, unrealistic rhetoric.

Another old Rocker jas left us and gone to rock n roll heaven... This blokes still going...perhaps some truth in the old adage, only the good die young......

Progress in NSW Australia re prison reform and violence....... https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/throw-away-the-key-worst-of-worst-to-stay-locked-up-20100410-rzs3.html Throw away the key: worst of worst to stay locked up: THE state's worst murderers and violent criminals will be kept behind bars after their sentences have finished under a radical plan by the NSW government that will target prisoners who resist rehabilitation. Premier Kristina Keneally will today order Corrective Services to begin an audit of the 750 ''worst of the worst'' prisoners in NSW. more at link........

Yep, of course. Bingo! While I accept that we have no good evidence of any life existing off the earth, I'm pretty confident that it does...a near infinte universe in extent and content, along with the stuff of life being everywhere we look, nearly guarantees that.

The issue is that mainly all we have got is philosophically and/or politically [and possibly religious] motivated banter and grand plans and ideas, as opposed to a minute sample of actual cases of extreme crimes of violence, both here and in the torture thread. I reiterate a position I put previously, that was incrediously dismissed...a position imo of reality, sympathy, and logic...A perpetrator of any serious crime of violence, to expect sympathy, should at least show some remorse and/or regret for what he has done. That in no way though dismisses the necessity of appropriate punishment. How can any perpetrator of any serious crime of violence, expect for example, any consideration of parole, a suspended sentence, or house arrest? It is in a word, inconceivable to accept that.

Apologies.

It can't be done because we have all types and sorts of people in any society, that are more interested in taking advantage of such attempts...those in the powerful factions you seem obsessed with, and those others that just simply will not, or will ever fit into a normal society. Justice for all! particularly including justice for victims and criminal justice. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve, with the interpretation of what then constitutes "deserving" being impacted upon by numerous fields, with many differing viewpoints and perspectives, including the concepts of moral correctness based on ethics, rationality, law, religion, equity and fairness.

Not much has changed in this thread from page 1, so I thought I would check it out again...generally a lot of political/philosophical banter as has continued. My position, based on facts, has not changed from my first post near the bottom of page 1... Justice for all! particularly including justice for victims and criminal justice. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve, with the interpretation of what then constitutes "deserving" being impacted upon by numerous fields, with many differing viewpoints and perspectives, including the concepts of moral correctness based on ethics, rationality, law, religion, equity and fairness.

Not sure where you dragged those figures from, but irrespective, that 1/100,000 makes it about 3,500/350,000,000 going on the last estimate I saw of the USA population, so we'll stick that lot in your suburban region, OK? [and realistically probably a lot more] Except that isn't quite exactly the situation. In my country and I presume in the US to a similar extent, we have parole, suspended sentences, house arrests, ankle bracelets etc, coupled with smaller sentences for petty crimes and repeat offenders of petty crimes. Remember justice serves three, obligatory purposes...[1]Punsishment": [2] Protecting victims and society: [3] Rehabilitation. They should all necessarily and ideally work in unison.

Just found a list.... 1 What is the universe made of? ... 2 How did life begin? ... 3 Are we alone in the universe? ... 4 What makes us human? ... 5 What is consciousness? ... 6 Why do we dream.. 7 Why is there stuff? ... 8 Are there other universes? My attempts to answer them. [1] The elements, [Baryonic matter] Dark matter, dark energy, space and time. [DM and DE are place mats for we don't know and make up around 95% of what is there] [2] There is really only one scientific answer to that....Abiogenesis, although we do lack the detail. [3]Most probably not, although as yet we do not have any validated evidence of any life off the Earth. [4]Biological evolution. [5]Awareness of existence. [6]The brain being in an active mode? [7] Uncertainty principal? evolution of space and time, and false vacuums and phase transitions? [8]We don't know. What do others reckon about my answers? Any errors, alterations or corrections? Some I'm confident with, others not so much.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-08-24/woman-charges-through-wa-border-rams-police/100401858 A 47-year-old woman has been remanded in custody to serve 14 days’ quarantine after allegedly speeding through a checkpoint at Western Australia’s border with South Australia and ramming a police car. Just after 10 o’clock Monday morning, Brenda Elena Bleazard allegedly led police on a dramatic high-speed chase while driving a Volvo wagon and towing a caravan. Police said she reversed her caravan at speed into a police car, tried to run over an officer who was approaching her car on foot and threw a large jar full of petrol at an officer before trying to light it on fire. Ms Bleazard, of no fixed address, appeared in the Kalgoorlie Magistrate’s Court on Tuesday via audiolink from the lock-up at Eucla police station. She declined help from Legal Aid WA and represented herself in court. She was not required to enter a plea. In an exchange with the magistrate, Ms Bleazard requested an interpreter while speaking perfect English. “I need an interpreter … I don’t understand what you’re talking about,” she said. Magistrate Andrew Matthews explained she was facing eight charges, including two counts of reckless driving to escape pursuit by police. She replied by asking: “Can I charge the police?” While the charges were read to her, Ms Bleazard repeatedly interrupted Magistrate Matthews and told him she did not believe in the judicial system and demanded to be released so she could “immigrate overseas”. The officer in charge of Eucla police station, Senior Sergeant Russell Chamberlain, could be heard on the audiolink twice trying to get Ms Bleazard to cooperate. “You need to show him a bit of respect,” he said, referring to Ms Bleazard’s attitude towards the magistrate. Magistrate Matthews did not consider a bail application, saying he had concerns about Ms Bleazard’s ability to comply with any conditions imposed by the court. She will be in quarantine — most likely at Eastern Goldfields Regional Prison — until September 6. She’s doing a good job of a nutter’s defence.

Yep, the first obvious, expert necessary proviso. I took the OP on face value.

We already [at least where I am] have comprehensive family services for all requiring them, and we also have a universal health care system and have since 1972. Your final paragraph has it all arse up. I am certainly concerned about all you have mentioned, but just as certainly, give less emphasis to the incorridgible criminal and perpetrator of violence. Same perspectives, different emphasis. Join the club. It is a beautiful heart warming philosophy in many ways, but totally and completely unrealisitc and unworkable. Perhaps if you get the Dalai Lama to attempt a better explanation? 😜

Quite admirable and like religion, probably could give one a nice warm inner glow of contentment. And if you or dimreeper can ever show me that such a philosophical stance will ever have 100% success rate, or even close to it, you may even get me to support such a philosophy. And effectively, both of you have agreed that it will not and cannot ever be achieved. That's why we have a justice system...that's why we have the necessary evil orginizations such as Police forces Armies, etc...that's why we have prisons. There will always be incorridgible criminals and violent people within society, just as there will always be victims of crime and violence. My sympathy first and foremost, goes with the vicitm and society of crime and violence.

😁 Trust you to pick up that faux-pas! My error, I had other things on my mind! 😉

No justice specifically as called for in any reasonable westernised country and society. Probably both...Yet many many other people through the annals of the human race, have had similar unfortunate and terrible upbringings, and have risen above it, and in many cases, exceeded and become someone who demands respect from society as a whole. And you see, this is the point, that I have said many times, and you seem to wishy washy over it...There is all kinds of people that make up society, from the Mandella's to the Hitler's, and the evil bloke in my prime example. The prisons are for the latter. Inner peace can be achieved in many ways I suggest. For example, if I take the extreme opposite tack that you and Buddhism take, I would find it an interesting philosophy in elliminating all the known evil doers in society, petty criminals included, and then be able to relax, with total inner peace, comforted by the knowledge that no inncoridgible bully, will attempt to harm or take advantage of me. But like your extreme scenario, it is but a dream. Yes, agree totally, and a point I have made throughout this thread for the obvious reasons. In the case I presented the perpetrator was on parole, and after submitting the little girl to satisfy his evil gratifications, then attacked and knifed a couple of hero rescuers that stumbled upon the still active crime scene. It argues your post quite admirably imo, particularly since you suggested that Hitlerism/Nazism could possibly lead to a better life. If that is part and parcel of Buddhism, then that religion/philosphy has certainly lost my respect. Not a terribly great fan of pure philosophy, and align with the Lawrence Krauss'of this world. Also reminds me of a remark "Philosophy consists very largely of one philosopher arguing that all others are jackasses. He usually proves it, and I should add that he also usually proves that he is one himself". Henry Louis Mencken. That's nice. Still, the facts remain, that it takes all kinds to form any society, and not all society are involved in, or part of any of the above. That may all well be true, but the facts remain again, that 100% success rate will never be achieved, and despite any and all efforts of social justice, some will spit it back in your face.

Justice according to the crime commited.

No not really, but we do have some knowlegable folk who are probably crawling out of bed now, and they maybe able to help. ps: Thanks for your well presented thread...nice photos.

Are you serious? 😲As we know, like many bulies, he was also a coward also and didn't have the stomach to face justice. His henchman [the one's that didn't take the easy way out] were humanely hung until they were dead...thankfully. Many believe they should have been given the same long, slow torturious death they did to 6 million Jews. It was a movie sure...I did mention that, but also an analogy that in many ways resembled the real life victim that I presented. Yes, he was an evil monster [in the case I presented] and yes the two young rednecks in the movie got what most normal folk would expect them to get and what they deserved...and it was equally pleasing that the other vicitm in the movie, the Father, was found not guilty of taking justice into his own hands. Neither the rednecks in the movie, nor the real life arsehole in the real life case I presented, deserve any sympathy in line with that which society, and the law needed to give to the little girl and her family, first and foremost. That is nothing more then nonsensical philosophical clap trap.

Uh oh!! The movie "The Blob" comes to mind!!😉 All joking aside, as you saw it explode in the sky, it is termed a bolide and the pieces you found are meteorites. The "biological" structures maybe from some orgasm or bacteria picked up in the atmosphere. In 1984 a meteorite was found in the Antarctic and labeled ALH84001. This has been validated as originating from Mars, and also had what some thought to be some sort of biological structure imbedded within. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_Hills_84001 As yet, I don't believe it has been fully substantiated as a valid Martian fossilized organism...debate [I think] continues.

I believe he hit the nail fair square on the head in the first moment of the Interview...The capitulation of the Afghan forces for their own survivability. Mistakes were made, not simply by the Americans but by all the allied forces that invaded the country, initially and rightly to prevent a haven for terrorists and of course to eliminate Bin-Laden, after 9/11. I have a sneaking suspicion that if the new breed of Taliban do not live up to their word, that other actions, sanctions and repuccusions maybe in the pipeline. While that will be detrimental for the average Joe Blow in the streets, the facts are that if this is still the old Taliban in disguise, then things will be 100 times worse for the average Afghan. On Biden, and speaking as an outsider, I sort of thought he was too old for the job, but then again, anything was acceptable in place of the former redneck ratbag Trump. Otherwise, I feel rather sorry he is confronted with such a scenario. Will he maintain forces after the 31st August? That also will be interesting.

Some one will be along to help in time with your maths query. I'm only a rank amateur with a poor grasp of maths, but just a comment on the above. The Sun is approximately 400 times further away then the Moon, and also coincidently 400 times larger in radius than the Moon. The Moon has over the course of time, gradually moved further and further away from Earth [at present about 2 cm or so every year] We can then deduce that in the past when the Moon was closer, all eclipses [discounting partial eclipses] were just that, total eclipses irrespective of aphelion or perihelion, and in the distant future when it is further away, all "total eclipses" will all be Annular eclipses. the following shows an Annular eclipse that presently occurs when the Moon is at aphelion. That same eclipse would be total if the Moon had been at perihelion.