Moontanman

Wouldn't it be a hoot if we suddenly found out the universe is really excrement?

Overtone, it may have been punishment but the punishment was cruel and unusual and any infraction would add years to your sentence so that even a short sentence could effectively be a life sentence. The labor was forced and others profited by it, it was seldom make work, i would at least define that as tyranny and slavery.

Just for the record, John, Overtone, the type of slavery being discussed here, if I am reading this correctly,consisted of making laws that were almost impossible not to break and making months or years at hard labor the punishment. While it mostly happened to black people there were more than an insignificant number of poor whites who were also "enslaved" in this manner (has no one ever watched Cool Hand Luke?) In this day and time I would be loath to linger in certain parts of the south if I had no good reason to be there. There are still towns that have segregated proms and work camps still exist, yes it's shameful but denying it will not make it go away...

Ok, I'll give you that but why do innocents have to suffer due to actions of others they have no control over, if the driver is texting and his passengers are maimed by the crash how is that their choice? Your argument makes sense if everyone has a choice but that is demonstrably not true... God has also allowed us to choose the path of others as well, this is blatantly immoral, in fact "a God" by any definition is immoral when defined by his works....

So your dissatisfaction results in making unfalsifiable assertions that are no better than the traditions and beliefs you are already dissatisfied with?

You are making an association that cannot be falsified and so is meaningless... good job that...

This thread is not about the existence or nonexistence of a god or gods, please read the OP above, Several of us have allowed this thread to go off topic. I suggest a moderator split out the off topic posts....

Who created god?

Actually if the car is defective the fault is the car makers...

No the laws of such harmony do not reflect a creator, that is a logical fallacy, the assertion that the laws of nature point to a creator is not proof of anything but the laws of nature. If the laws of nature were different things would be different. it is not proof or even suggestive of a god. We are here because the laws of nature allow it, if the laws of nature were different we would not be here to debate the issue. Please show some empirical evidence, existence is not evidence of anything but existence. Quoting authority figures is meaningless, and the world around us is easily explained by natural means. Nature is not self evidence of god, naturalistic causes explain the life and the universe quite well with no need of god.

Again, an appeal to authority is not evidence of anything but that person belief which is no better or worse than anyone elses...

Yet another meaningless appeal to authority that is nothing but what someone else believes, belief does not equal knowledge...

The book of Mormon is demonstrably false, it is based on the lies of a convicted con artist, many glaring discrepancies exist, for instance the native Americans are not the descendants of the lost tribes of Israel.... If you want to debate the existence of God I suggest you start another thread, this is not the thread for that...

Offer it as many time as you wish it is still an appeal to authority... and as such a logical fallacy... Since you seem to like appeals to authority so much here is another quote from Einstein.... It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.

An appeal to authority is a logical fallacy, Einstein was not a an expert on theology his remarks on God are no better or worse than anyone elses. How about you answer my question about the sexual brutalization of children instead of appealing to authority.

I suggest you read the the forum rules then the OP, meanwhile why should anyone believe your concept of god over any others?

I suggest you read this http://carm.org/false-prophecies-of-joseph-smith

Which God?

So the sexual brutalization of children just has to happen?

No more than the environment affects the endothermy of a mammal or a bird, the idea behind being an endotherm is maintaining a constant body temp despite the temperature of the environment. Some dinosaurs lived at the polar regions, the long polar winters had to be cold. http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/polar-dinosaurs-200712.html

Most modern sources think dinosaurs were endotherms, at least to some extent, not all mammals are exactly hot blooded, sloths don't maintain high body temps and elephants have somewhat less than high body temps as well, in fact the tiny relatives of elephants called hyraxes. like elephants have imperfect endothermy. Some dinosaurs could have been endotherms just because they were so big but others apparently were active enough to have had to been endotherms. It's possible that dinosaurs had a wide range of endothermy we don't generally see in mammals. Some modern reptiles are endotherms as well as some fishes so endothermy is not a cut and dried yes or no thing...

It's thought that all dinosaurs, theropods in particular, could have had feathers at some stage of their development, even hatchling T-Rex could have had down type feathers. Sauropods shared many features of birds as well like hollow bones and advanced breathing apparatus no evidence of feathers but down type feathers on hatchlings is not impossible... http://www.walkingwithdinosaurs.com/news/editorial/diplodocus-sauropods-with-feathers/1/

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