Moontanman

I worked for dupont, polyester plant. Not huge ones, I never meant to suggest I was perfect but the overall picture of my life satisfies me quite well... My conscious is clear. of course there are things like boat wreaks and financial disasters that would be nice to avoid but trying to second guess the past never amounts to much more than unnecessary stress... I had a step father like that, the whole community thought he was the best thing since sliced bread but in private he was satan...

Yes I have to agree, the quality of the evidence does speak for it's self...

The neanderthal genome would mix with our own again and generations on they would be absorbed into the population... maybe? I used to work with a guy, in the encyclopedia under neanderthal was "his" picture, I ragged him incessantly over it...

So semjase, it doesn't bother you that Silly Billy is a confirmed liar? An obvious attention hoe?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Meier The very assertion that extraterrestrials would be so human in appearance to be perfectly human is simply silly, it falsifies the assertion immediately. There is simply no way a human could evolve on an other planet independent of the Earth... Just silly... http://forgetomori.com/2009/aliens/asket-and-nera/ More silly from Billy... http://www.iigwest.com/investigations/meier/dinosaur_deconstruction.html Billy did a lot of silly stuff... http://www.iigwest.com/investigations/meier/

Of course not he was protestant...

Give me the post number... No, we cannot possibly do any where near the number of natural experiments that occurred in just a year on the primitive earth, literally billions of chemical combinations a second at that rate even something extremely unlikely becomes certain... No it isn't, please show some evidence of this from someplace besides creation scientists... several planets in our solar system are possible abodes of life, Mars, Europa, Titan, in fact Saturn has a moon that spouts geysers, that contain complex organics, very similar to bacteria but the instruments sent weren't designed to confirm the exact composition because it was an unknown thing when the space craft was sent. I would include Neptune and Uranus in that estimate but that's another conversation... I was evidently unaware that such long odds possibilities was being considered...

No, actually project SIGN concluded in their "Estimate of the Situation" that UFOs were extraterrestrial space craft... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Sign Bold is done by me... Remember this was in 1947, if such craft had been built by the US or the soviets by now everyone would be riding in them and riding to Earth orbit on top of fireworks would never have happened.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimate_of_the_Situation So now we are back to UFOs cannot be alien space craft? While i am not aware of the methods used a great many such pictures were identified as either hoaxes or too little information to make a determination, but the investigators can use various techniques to tell if an object is something small close up or something large far away and various other things like comparing it to the background and such... It was how Billy Meier was exposed... Again, unless aliens are beaming a signal directly at us it's highly unlikely we could detect it even if it was around the nearest star...

Please feel free to explain it to me in detail, I hate sloppy thinking, please help me understand... you do realize you are confusing being faithful with faith don't you? I am faithful to my wife, I have faith she is faithful to me but my faith in her is based on evidence not blindly believing against all reason and evidence...

So what ever anyone believes is just as real as the reality we see around us? or is only your religions faith real? If it's only yours how can you tell? How do you perceive something that is supernatural? What effect on the world does the supernatural have? What part of our first world civilization has been provided by anything other than reason?

Depends on many things, the point I am making is that UFOs are not taken seriously due to government disinformation, before that even the government was convinced they were interplanetary space craft... Again your idea of conformation is unreasonable and would not be applied to any other phenomena with as much evidence... Ummm actually that can be detected in a photograph... Planets are so common that even if one in a billion stars have life bearing planets there are thousands of them in our galaxy alone... just don't assume it's not and we can at least agree on that... but you should know those photos in Semjase's post were well before photoshop but still investigated and found to be hoaxes, if i remember correctly the models he used were found in his home as well...

Semjase, Billy Meier was shown to be a hoaxer when i was a young man, i am now an old man and his photos are still hoaxes...

I called what was BS and then said no one called it BS? i think it's more plausible that laboratory conditions are far to confined to ever produce life from chemicals but possible chemical pathways have been identified and are being investigated So how did life survive in the ocean before ozone? I would not contest that... The first is not evidence of anything as i have already pointed out. We have not really tested any other planet in our solar system other than mars and many scientists think those tests were flawed and can't be used to support either contention... The third part of this can be said to be misleading at best since radio signals from the earth are now thought to be absorbed by the interstellar medium before even the nearest star could receive them... Strawman yet again, no one has suggested that we are talking about anything but protein based life in water... Feel free to use that any way you want, i would suggest printing it out and rolling it into a spindle...

Quotes about faith... William K Clifford “It is wrong always, everywhere, and for anyone, to believe anything upon insufficient evidence.” Richard Dawkins “Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.” Benjamin Franklin “The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason.” William James “Faith means belief in something concerning which doubt is theoretically possible.” Søren Kierkegaard “Certainty... lurks at the door of faith and threatens to devour it.” Martin Luther “Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.” Blaise Pascal “Faith certainly tells us what the senses do not, but not the contrary of what they see; it is above, not against them.” Bertrand Russell “We may define ‘faith’ as the firm belief in something for which there is no evidence. Where there is evidence, no one speaks of "faith." We do not speak of faith that two and two are four or that the earth is round. We only speak of faith when we wish to substitute emotion for evidence.” Mark Twain “Faith is believing what you know ain’t so.” Voltaire “Faith consists in believing when it is beyond the power of reason to believe.” So you have heard, felt, smelt, touched God? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_and_rationality

So we've traveled from so unlikely as to be meaningless to just unlikely but not such long odds it's not worth considering, wow i made progress... Again, this is not evidence of anything, i didn't want to say this but if only one sighting is really an alien space craft then that one is the most important event in recent human history, the fact that the rest are false is meaningless... That is why i generally concentrate on early sightings from a time when it was more difficult to cover up. I've went over this closely, you are going to have to rub my nose it it i guess... More meaningless horse feathers...

You said this, it is nothing but horse feathers, the very same horse feathers creationists use to support their own horse feathers, do some googling and see for your self This statement is false, science does not predict such a thing... No, you misread it... I am well aware of the sterilization effects of UV light, I use UV sterilizers in my aquariums but the organism has to be exposed to be effected and various wave lengths of UV light effect organics in various ways and killing off modern organisms by directly exposing them to the most effective biocidal rays is not evidence of any thing other than the special conditions inside an UV sterilizer... I designed and helped build UV sterilizers for DuPont at one time... I am honestly not sure what you are asserting here, please elaborate... Can you provide evidence it is not? Plants are less sensitive to High CO2 levels but have a limit just like animals but animals are far more sensitive but both animals and plants are capable of evolving to live in higher levels but to say the earth is perfect is ignoring the fact that life on earth has evolved to fit the earth... yeah... I'll work on that... I'll use your examples to identify them...

meaningless assertion, the odds do not falsify the possibility Do you read what you type? I'm not sure ridiculous is the best way to describe it but I am not asserting any likelihood, only that it deserves to be investigated and that ridicule and negative assumptions are meaningless... Claiming something to be true is not evidence... Of course there were people who did not see it, ever drive in the mountains on the old two lane roads? No you have made that claim many times and it is indefensible... and lab work not finding new life is not evidence it is a rare event...

Again, no one is suggesting anything but protein based life in water and lightning striking a rock is horse feathers... Citation please, uv light can indeed build complex organic molecules... You are ignoring much of chemistry and physics here... I said a minor constituent, say for instance CO2, increase CO2 levels by several times and complex life as we know it would die... You need to stop building them...

Is it possible that the sudden increase in surface area when the meteor comes apart causes the sudden release of energy?

When the impossible is eliminated what remains is the truth... Sometimes yes but not always... I will be very specific from now on... I think you have gone out of your way to say that they all have to be something else. I was using it as an example of how UFO fanatics think that anything difficult to explain must be aliens... citation needed Again it was in a remote location, the helicopters were not chasing it and others did indeed see this but from a much greater distance... Please back up the assertion that life is rare or stop stating it...

I am sure that the definition of faith as something believed in with out evidence and against all reason predates the "enlightenment" by a considerable margin and in fact was demanded by Early Christian thinkers if not in the bible it's self...

How is that relevant to this issue? This is at best out dated clap trap and at worst intentional obfuscation, which is it? A simple change in the minor atmospheric gases would eliminate complex "life as we know it" on earth, you are building straw men for no apparent reason, no one is suggesting anything but carbon based water containing life... total straw man...

So deductive reasoning is useless? You require an actual alien space craft to land and say hey guys we're here? Most are more likely not alien space craft, some have limited degrees of freedom to be anything else... I meant that one case and you know that was what I was saying... That is a straw man, no one says all UFOs are alien space craft... I readily admit the vast majority are not alien space craft but that leaves literally hundreds of unexplained UFO cases that cannot be explained by any known phenomena... It was at night, in an isolated area, and I do not concede that was an alien space craft... Cop cars do now, they didn't always have them... and such sightings that involve many people have been reported... Yet you scoff at the very concept in spite of evidence of a caliber that would convict you of high crimes if it was directed toward you... this at least should indicate that investigation is warranted instead of ridicule and negative assumptions... I happen to agree it's unlikely but unlikely things become a sure bet if enough time passes... Of course if intelligent life always self destructs or we are unique in our desire to explore new territory, of if complex life is outrageously rare then you win but we have only one data point...

The oceans of Europa could have more oxygen than earths oceans... http://phys.org/news174918239.html "Life as we know it", life has adapted to the Earth and changed the earth to suit the life that lives there. We can't draw a conclusion from one data point. No, it means the conditions for forming life no longer occur... The current conditions and conditions that we can deduce show that life cannot form independently on this "perfect" earth... in fact if life was completely eliminated from the earth conditions would have to change drastically for life to develop again... Then there is the fact that any new organic molecules are eaten by current life forms as soon as they form... Again please show this probability, with only one data point this is not a supportable assumption...

From your link... EM radiation is ionizing under the right circumstances...