Moontanman

Why would we assume the planet is habitable to begin with ? Being the correct distance from it's star does not a habitable planet make....

Why does the idea that humans are apes bother you so much? There are several species of apes, they are all just as different from each other as humans are from each of them. An ape is not a species of animal, gorillas are apes, as are chimps, orangutans, and humans... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ape

An insanity plea would be a bit late at this point which is the main reason I have a problem with the death penalty. It's so... final...

The whole playing doctor thing is how kids seduce each other it is not the end it is the means to the end which can be sexuality just as intense as the sex between adults, i was there i did that. That is not true, dogs that taste blood are not ruined, nor do they seek out blood there after, this analogy simply does not hold up. But I agree that a child is not equipped to handle a bad adult/child sexual experience. I don't see how any of this has anything to do with what we are discussing. This i agree with totally. I'm not sure how you would go about allowing sexual contact between a child and an adult, i am a Dad, i tried to make sure my children did not fall victim to sexual predators. I know for sure that any adult i had found having sex with my children would have come to a bad end. It's really a crazy situation, i sought out sex as a child but not all children have sexual feelings, i would think that most do not, but who would have sex with children if they were allowed to have sex? Does some adult man ask my 6 year old out on a date? The entire thing is crazy from six different directions. I feel like i was lucky i didn't fall victim to a "bad adult" when I was a child. i see no reason to react like a crazy person if a child has sex with another child but the idea of trusting an adult to have sex with my child and not harm them in some way is just not acceptable.... not acceptable....

Ok Marat, how do you decide between sexual contact that is harmful and sexual contact that is not. It is obvious that some adult/child sexual contact is harmful, has to be if for no other reason than some adult/adult sexual contact is harmful. Where do you draw the line? A 3 year old girl who enjoyed cunnilingus, would that be allowed? If this slope is not slippery there has never been one for sure...

I agree, it is far too likely the child will be taken advantage of for it to really be allowed. I had sex as a child, pretty much continuously from the age of 6, i had some sexual contact from the age of three, i enjoyed it immensely, orgasms and all but I consider myself lucky in that i wasn't forced to do anything by a true predator type person. There was very much mutual pleasure... and desire, very strong desire on my part... Nope the sexual desire was quite real....

Yes, I agree, you have hit the nail directly on the head, invincible ignorance fallacy is exactly what you have been using. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invincible_ignorance_fallacy

This makes no sense what so ever, cars are far more simple than living organisms and who said it precluded intelegent design? Again you are making a claim that makes no sense, the idea that corn and wheat do not cross pollinate supports evolution, the idea that Chinese peasants can interbreed again supports evolution, you are trying to straw man the argument and not doing a very good job. Chinese peasants are the same species, human beings, none of them are separated genetically far enough to be different species, why would you even suggest such a thing. Corn and wheat have been separate many millions and years and cannot cross pollinate because they are not closely related, exactly what evolution would predict, both of the situations you suggest support evolution. Needimprovement you have demonstrated many times you are an intelligent man and then you make such a ridiculous assertion, i am sure you can do better than this. Um maybe because those are all very closely related? Plants are often easier to cross breed than animals but closely related animals can also often cross breed. Are you seriously asking this question... again? You say "It is perfectly believable that species evolved," then you say "How did very different species evolve?" make up your mind, is it believable that species evolve or isn't it? While we cannot say for sure the exact route that life took from non life we have many routes to choose from and most think that a synergy of many different routes that produced life. life evolved from chemicals, these chemicals eventually produced single celled life forms we would recognize as life. These single cells evolved into the complex life forms we see today. No IDer needed so why require one? The idea of irreducible complexity has been shown to invalid so many times on this forum i will not go through the trouble of doing it again. The eye exists in every form from a simple spot that detects light to eyes that are far better than human eyes and every degree in between. if you are going to challenge evolution you need to try something else... The evidence we have shows that animals evolved, it does not show they were created, yes it does matter if ID exists if he exists then he has gone far out of his way to plant misleading evidence and to lie to us about how things happen by making everything look like he doesn't exist. This is simply not true, the idea that the platypus is some how a special case and that is has developed from several different animals is false. the platypus the one of the last remnants of of a line of primitive mammals evolved from animals that split off from mammals millions of years ago, before the time of the dinosaurs. the platypus is not a combination of several non related animals that is an old wives tale used to explain the platypus to children.

Actually no you cannot use the idea of G to predict the atmospheric pressure, Titan has far less than one G but more than 50% higher pressure and more density than the Earth and actually a more massive atmosphere. I would have to say no, the internal heat of the star would prevent this and the gravity of the star would compress it's substance to far greater density with a cut off just like we see in our sun... Oxygen would not be found as anything other than compounds and them only if the temp was low enough. Now is possible for gas to accumulate in a ring around a star or planet (see Larry Niven's book, "The Integral Trees" as a fictional example) Hydrogen and Helium make up almost all of Jupiter, the other elements are diluted to the point of being trace elements. Jupiter is made up mostly of liquid metallic hydrogen not hydrogen gas. Gasses like oxygen would never be found in their molecular form, they are always found as compounds. Earth like pressure could only be found high in Jupiter's atmosphere not deep inside it...

I honestly cannot see any reason to allow pedophilia, it may very well be true that much of the harm has more to do with how society reacts to pedophilia but i can see no reason to allow it. Allowing behavior that might or might not be harmful but almost certainly has no positive side seems problematic at the very best. This article link hits briefly on how this has been seen as different by other societies... http://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/post.cfm?id=an-ode-to-the-many-evolved-virtues-2010-09-22&sc=WR_20100928

If the number of females in humans is great enough to be significant i would think it's an evolutionary echo of the time when females died more often due to child birth so populations that had more females were more likely to successfully reproduce....

You have most of it, gravity and temperature are important factors in holding onto an atmosphere but the size of the planet would matter as well, if you took a planet 3/4 the size of the earth but with the same mass it could not hold onto as extensive an atmosphere as the Earth does now and the Earth couldn't hold onto as extensive an atmosphere as a planet 5/4 the size of the Earth could with the same mass. Saturn's moon Titan is a good example it has a huge atmosphere several times deeper than earths atmosphere and with a higher pressure and density. If Titans mass was in a smaller body it could not hold onto such an extensive atmosphere. the gravitational potential falls off slower from a large planet than a small planet if there masses are the same.

According to SETI what makes it a civilization is the ability to make radio telescopes. It really depends on what you are looking for doesn't it?

You could be correct but that would mean no need for slow boats and it would indicate a technology beyond what we can conceive of as well. The idea so far is that aliens wouldn't have technology beyond our understanding. I have to agree with this, living in zero gee would have consequences we do not know of for sure, i think there would have to be a minimum to keep us healthy as well as human. Of course some genetic engineering might make this a moot point... I think we can assume a planet has to be big enough to hold an atmosphere to be any more useful than asteriods which Luna cannot do and which Mars does very poorly. There is unlikely to be organisms that evolve in a vacuum But this ignores the low probability that a planet would be useful for anything but resources, resources that can be obtained easier from asteriods... That is the idea behind artificial habitats, everyone lives inside large structures, they travel from start to star in these structures, generations pass they loose any interest in planets. And it would take many thousands of years to use all the resources around one star. They use the debris around stars as sources of materials to build the artificial self contained colonies.. I'm not sure what you mean by this... Using gravity assist could take you all over the solar system with very little fuel.... What fuel components would a planet have that other smaller objects orbiting the stars would not have? You could easily target the asteroids that have everything from hydrocarbons to iron to water... again, why would you want to land on any planet much less a lifeless one, asteroids in Trojan orbits around Jupiter would have everything Mars would have. Kuiper belt objects would be ideal, no need to even get close to the star... Nuclear weapons do far more than just use a shock wave, in space there would still be a blast of hard radiation, particles and EM radiation, i wouldn't want to be close to a nuclear weapon when it went off just because it was in a vacuum... A nuclear bomb for use in space might be designed slightly different but it would at the very least vaporize and irradiate anything close by... a neutron bomb (enhanced radiation bomb) might be better than a bomb designed for maximum blast effects on a planet...

Diva, i am quite sure there is no logic in this, all parties would seem to be less that sane by any comparison i can think of. i have never been able to understand the twisted thinking of anyone who would commit violent crimes for any reason. I can only guess at the motivation and the facts are as crazy as the crime, you have to wonder why the men would do it, how sex with mom and daughter figure into it and why all of them thought they could get away with it. insanity is crazy.... B)

Ok, first of all we need to define who is a child, do we go by what society says at this time? What society said 200 years ago? I think that once a human being passes puberty they naturally start seeking out sex, older males generally seek out younger females and younger females generally seek out older males. Young females can be quite aggressive about it in their own way, every bit as aggressive as males. Now i can remember sexual feelings from 3 years old or so, and at least twice in my young life, well before puberty, an adult female had some sexual contact with me. only once did an adult male make seek out sexual contact with me when I was a child. I also had sex many times with other children, as far as i can tell the only way it affected my life was by leaving me with a couple of minor sexual fetishes. i remember being very much interested in sex and i sought it out consistently. However one persons experiences cannot be used to make genralizations...

I have a problem with the IQ thing, if I was in the position of being executed if my IQ was above a certain level i am quite sure it would be impossible to get a true IQ reading on me, i think she was smart enough to fake it and IQ tests are fairly easy to fail to be sure... Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and good sex doesn't nesesarrily have anything to do with looks, sometimes kinky is more important than anything else and it did say sex with her and her daughter... kinky is as kinky does There was no mention of being high in the report so that is just speculation, to me it seems more likely the two guys were high but that is neither here nor there really. Wanting to kill doesn't require a high IQ, she is supposed to have the IQ of a 14 year old, 14 year olds have indeed committed murder so the idea she is too retarded to kill or to understand what killing is seems to me to be a bit less than realistic.

Cruising speed? A small group of asteroids similar to the Trojan asteroids of Jupiter would yield enough materials to make hundreds if not thousands of habitats, all of them exactly the way you want them, planets are iffy from the beginning, a life bearing planet has "life" life that you may or may not be able to live with, something as simple allergens from plant life could make a planet completely uninhabitable, trace elements could make living on a planet impossible. once you make it to the star you can use very slow low energy orbits to go anywhere you want. planets are only useful if you don't plan to go anywhere else and if you know they are inhabitable before hand. simply using the materials already freely available around a star makes nearly every star useful, if you rely on planets very few stars will have earth like planets and only a few, if any, of them will be usable.

Since the "asteroids" are the source of both fuel, construction materials and environmental chemicals. leaving a planet would take vastly more fuel than simply maneuvering from one asteroid to another. Planets are just deep gravity wells they contain nothing that asteroids do not and are much harder to come and go from...

I'm not sure that a man who is half out of it would be much good for a "date" but i see no reason to assume all the people who are being drugged are women but can a woman force sex on a half passed out man? I am quite sure that in some cases cheap tequila is being substituted for good tequila... assuming of course there is such a thing as good tequila

I don't know about nitrogen but helium will over come you quite quickly, I remember many many many years ago when my sons were in grade school being at an event where i was giving out helium balloons and filling them on order from a cylinder and amusing the kids by talking in the high pitched voice by breathing in helium and i almost passed out in front of several dozen kids. It put me on my butt, very emabarrassing.....

I disagree, antifreeze type chemicals lower the temp that freezing occurs and that ice crystals form but they do not prevent it completely and once the temps fall low enough the "bug" would freeze with all the resulting problems of ice crystals and cell destruction. Liquid nitrogen temps are plenty cold enough to over come any natural antifreeze...

I've given it some thought, i see no reason to push my own feelings on this on others, if no one else agrees with me then let it be, it is an emotionally charged idea that i may not be completely neutral about. BTW i disagree with the idea that a 17 year old is a child but is that another thread?

The sleeping pill "Ambien" can be similar in it's effects when combined with alcohol. it makes you susceptible to suggestion and the next day you have no memory of what you did. I have experienced this, it's really weird, i try to make sure i do not take ambien and drink and get on the computer. i have lost friends this way. My wife takes ambien and drinks wine, when she wakes up in the morning she has no memory of love making (or anything else) what so ever the next morning...

I'm not sure I understand, there is no difference between simply freezing something and dropping the temp to liquid nitrogen temps? A great many insects survive freezing temps in the winter, mostly by hibernating someplace where the temps do not fall completely below freezing, sometimes by producing antifreeze type chemicals in their bodies but i am sure liquid nitrogen temps is far below the antifreeze can cope with.