Help with English

[Alfred001]

I'd like to hear from native speakers of English only here.

 

When I say someone works as a salesman, does that mean to you someone who works at a store (say selling computers) or does that word have a more general meaning that includes that, as well as someone sitting at an office, calling people up to offer them wares, traveling salesmen etc.?

If I want to refer to someone who works at a computer store or a shoe store, would you refer to that as a retail salesman, necessarily?

[Strange]

This is one of those things that probably varies between US and U.K. English.

 

Personally, to me (UK English speaker [mainly]) a salesman is someone who is on the phone and on the road to sell things. Someone who works in a shop, I would call a sales assistant or shop assistant.

[iNow]

My opinion?

 

Salesperson includes folks sitting at desks making calls, taking people out to dinner, calling prospects and flying to provide demonstrations.

 

The person a brick and mortar store selling computers and televisions is a retail sales clerk.

[Strange]

retail sales clerk.

See! I told you. In the UK, I think a clerk (pronounced clark) only works in a bank or, just maybe, an office.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Strange

[Phi for All]

The person a brick and mortar store selling computers and televisions is a retail sales clerk.

 

And the difference is usually whether or not commissions are offered by the store. Clerks usually do no more than a feature dump, telling you what-all this thing does. A salesman is usually needed when the thing doesn't sell itself so easily, and a more presentational style skill is needed, and usually compensated by a percentage of the sale.

[StringJunky]

 

And the difference is usually whether or not commissions are offered by the store. Clerks usually do no more than a feature dump, telling you what-all this thing does. A salesman is usually needed when the thing doesn't sell itself so easily, and a more presentational style skill is needed, and usually compensated by a percentage of the sale.

It's complicated. I'm in line with Strange on the meaning here in the UK. A salesman is an in-your-face person trying to to trick you into buying something.

Edited March 10, 2017 by StringJunky

[Phi for All]

It's complicated. I'm in line with Strange on the meaning here in the UK. A salesman is an in-your-face person trying to to trick you into buying something.

 

There are certainly those types around.

 

I'm thinking of an acquaintance of mine who had a product he invented and sold to Walgreens. It was a shoe accessory, packaged and put on a rack. It was a clever product though, and not that intuitive, and so it did poorly at Walgreens (where there are only clerks to ring your purchases up). Walgreens also owned Foot Locker though, where the need for a salesperson to fit shoes lent itself well to explaining my friend's product. He sold a ton of them through Foot Locker, and the difference was in the presentation by someone on commission.

[StringJunky]

 

There are certainly those types around.

 

I'm thinking of an acquaintance of mine who had a product he invented and sold to Walgreens. It was a shoe accessory, packaged and put on a rack. It was a clever product though, and not that intuitive, and so it did poorly at Walgreens (where there are only clerks to ring your purchases up). Walgreens also owned Foot Locker though, where the need for a salesperson to fit shoes lent itself well to explaining my friend's product. He sold a ton of them through Foot Locker, and the difference was in the presentation by someone on commission.

I was being sardonically humorous there. Sales people are important to any business in getting it going and keeping it going.

[John Cuthber]

"If I want to refer to someone who works at a computer store or a shoe store,"

...

"shop assistant."

[Alfred001]

Well, let me put it this way, if you wanted to put it in your CV that you worked this kind of job at a computer store, this kind of job being sitting in the store, dealing with customers as they come in and want to buy something, what would you call it?

[StringJunky]

Well, let me put it this way, if you wanted to put it in your CV that you worked this kind of job at a computer store, this kind of job being sitting in the store, dealing with customers as they come in and want to buy something, what would you call it?

Computer sales assistant or shop sales assistant. In that role you are actively assisting someone to buy something which involves some sales methods. It may involve handling money as well. If you just stood behind or sat at a cash register, not offering advice/promoting goods as an integral part of the job you would be a shop assistant. Both titles could mean the same thing but if you entered 'shop assistant' in your CV when you have experience of promoting products and advising, a prospective employer may assume you just worked at the checkout.

Edited March 11, 2017 by StringJunky

[Strange]

Sales assistant

 

 

Yes. (Or sales clerk, if is going on a resume rather than a CV.)

[StringJunky]

 

 

Yes. (Or sales clerk, if is going on a resume rather than a CV.)

Do they handle some administration as well, working with records? Why on a resume but not on a CV? If they do then, certainly, that woud be more accurate and more impressive on an employer.

 

 

Clerk - A person who works in an office performing such tasks as keeping records, attending to correspondence, or filing.

Edited March 11, 2017 by StringJunky

[iNow]

The thing about folks who work in brick and mortar stores... they're usually just Associates. They're utility upinfielders [EDIT - should say infielders] who float across roles where they're needed. It's like a cashier with a bit more flexibility.

Edited March 11, 2017 by iNow

[StringJunky]

The thing about folks who work in brick and mortar stores... they're usually just Associates. They're utility upinfielders who float across roles where they're needed. It's like a cashier with a bit more flexibility.

Now, that's Yankee talk.

[Strange]

Do they handle some administration as well, working with records? Why on a resume but not on a CV?

 

 

Just because the word resume is more likely to be used in the US and CV in the UK, which then correspond to sales clerk vs sales person/assistant.

[StringJunky]

 

 

Just because the word resume is more likely to be used in the US and CV in the UK, which then correspond to sales clerk vs sales person/assistant.

Yeah, I forgot they say "resume".

[DrKrettin]

Yeah, I forgot they say "resume".

 

Do they really say that in two syllables without the acute accents?

[iNow]

Reh-suh-may

[Alfred001]

Thanks, guys!

Wait, aren't resume and CV the same thing?

[StringJunky]

Thanks, guys!

 

Wait, aren't resume and CV the same thing?

They are, The former is used by Americans and the latter the British.

 

Do they really say that in two syllables without the acute accents?

i missed it out but i'm not sure if they add it themselves.

[imatfaal]

Thanks, guys!

 

Wait, aren't resume and CV the same thing?

 

 

They are, The former is used by Americans and the latter the British.

 

Not sure that is the complete answer. The British tend to use CV almost exclusively - but I tend to think that American English uses both and that they have slightly different meanings. For instance a few weeks ago one of our moderators said something along the lines of "that would be OK if it were written in a CV but not in a résumé"

 

I believe the difference in Amenglish * is that a résumé is a brief employment and experience summary whereas a CV is a fairly extensive list of accomplishments, achievements, and accolades. Academics in the US tend to have both

 

*made-up word - now thinking Amer-English is more euphonious

Edited March 19, 2017 by imatfaal
admission of neologism

[StringJunky]

Not sure that is the complete answer. The British tend to use CV almost exclusively - but I tend to think that American English uses both and that they have slightly different meanings. For instance a few weeks ago one of our moderators said something along the lines of "that would be OK if it were written in a CV but not in a résumé"

 

I believe the difference in Amenglish * is that a résumé is a brief employment and experience summary whereas a CV is a fairly extensive list of accomplishments, achievements, and accolades. Academics in the US tend to have both

 

*made-up word - now thinking Amer-English is more euphonious

Right. Is it still required to put the accents in résumé? I leave them out, relying on context to differentiate from the other meaning.

Edited March 19, 2017 by StringJunky

[imatfaal]

Required? No; not in general usage. Yes; if you are me.

 

If you put them, in the worst that people can think is that one is a bit precious, perhaps a little nerdish, and overly concerned with correctness. If you miss them out, then people can assume that you don't care or that you don't know. Thus: Yes; if you are me.

[CharonY]

 

 

 

Not sure that is the complete answer. The British tend to use CV almost exclusively - but I tend to think that American English uses both and that they have slightly different meanings. For instance a few weeks ago one of our moderators said something along the lines of "that would be OK if it were written in a CV but not in a résumé"

 

I believe the difference in Amenglish * is that a résumé is a brief employment and experience summary whereas a CV is a fairly extensive list of accomplishments, achievements, and accolades. Academics in the US tend to have both

 

*made-up word - now thinking Amer-English is more euphonious

 

In academic circles a CV is more common, which generally lists accomplishments often in a tabulated form. In addition a cover letter is used, which is usually not longer than a page, highlighting why one is a good fit to a given position (and often there are additional documents highlighting e.g. research or teaching plans). One could argue that that is similar to a resume (and it kind of is), but usually the search listing will ask for cover letter, CV and additional docs rather than a resume.

 

From the little I know of the industrial sector, resumes (yes, I leave them out because I tend to mess up the keyboard combo. Also there is the resumé for when you want to demonstrate that you can add it to one, but not both) tend to be 2-page highlights of your accomplishments, built into a narrative highlighting your fit into the company and for the position. That being said, they are sometimes used interchangeably and the best way to figure out what they want is length limitation (i.e. if they accept or want something that is longer than two pages a CV is the better format. No one wants to read you waxing on about yourself for 10 pages).