What are the chances

[Guest Katsuro]

ok so i found a web site selling an ebook that supposedly gives you extremely specific instructions on how to convert your average car to run on water. http://www.h2oconversion.com now i know the theory behind it quite well. however i do not know all the problems that keep this technology back. i've been told hydrogen burns way too hot. a car could not handle it. and there is the conspiracy that it is just the oil companies keeping it back. so what is your opinion. is this technology capable of exsisting and do you think this site could have it?

[Dak]

Hydrogen power != running on water (unfortunately)

 

Its probably an infrastructure problem... whos going to build H₂ pumps if cars dont run on hydrogen, and whos going to buy a hydrogen-car if there are no hydrogen pumps? i dimly recall hearing something about a proposed (UK) govournment plan to introduce hydrogen as a power source, but im not sure how far the plans got.

 

By the way, its worth remembering that energy is needed to convert water to hydrogen and oxygen, and this power has to come from somewhere: in other words, if the power plants are dirty, then switching to hydrogen power as a storage medium wont make our energy system 100% green.

[lethalfang]

Cars running on water? Baloney.

If they intend to extract H2 out of water as a fuel, where do they get the energy to split hydrogen and oxygen?

If they intend cold fusion, well, where is the energy for fusion to occur?

[Guest Katsuro]

water can be split into oxygen and hydrogen using a car battery right. and a car battery is continually recharged by the car's alternator. could this not also sustain the electrolysis process?

[BenSon]

water can be split into oxygen and hydrogen using a car battery right. and a car battery is continually recharged by the car's alternator. could this not also sustain the electrolysis process?

Are you suggesting that it is perpetual motion, because thats just a world of wrong...

[lethalfang]

Water molecules are very stable molecules. Water is at a lower free energy than oxygen and hydrogen.

With that in mind, you have to put in a net positive energy to split water. Therefore, you cannot use water as a fuel. Splitting water to do work is impossible.

Gasoline (I think it's octane) are at a higher free energy than their combustion reaction products. Unlike water, gasoline molecules are not very stable. Therefore, you can use gasoline as a fuel, by initiating a favorable combustion reaction.

[Guest Katsuro]

so you are saying that the amount of energy needed to split water into hydrogen and oxygen is in fact the same amount of energy you get out of it through combustion. making it foundamentally a wast of time?

[Ophiolite]

And because of inefficiencies in the process you get less out than you put in. (Possibly google heat engines). The advantage of a hydrogen powered car is that you centralise the pollution generation where it could be better controlled, rather than spewing out noxious fumes in urban areas.

[ydoaPs]

unitednuclear will soon be selling hydrogen conversion kits. http://unitednuclear.com/h2.htm

[lethalfang]

They are using hydrogen molecules as a fuel. That is certainly possible and practical, once you work out the safety issues. Hydrogen molecules are highly unstable, i.e. they go to a lower free energy state via combustion, therefore giving out energy to do work.

One should never forget that in generating hydrogen molecules, one need to put in more energy than you will ever get out. In this case, it is okay, because you trade in electronic energy of splitting water for the portability of hydrogen molecules.

One can never use water as a fuel.

As a rule of thumb, stable materials can never be used as a fuel.

A material used as a fuel must go to a lower free energy state after the reaction occurs (combustion in vehicles), in order to use the energy of the reaction to do work.