reerer Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 According to Michelson, a stationary ether, composed of matter, exists in all of stellar space. At the surface of the earth, the earth daily and yearly rotational motions interaction with Michelson's stationary celestial ether forms an ether wind which Michelson's experiment is testing. An arc lamp and a beam splitter are used to form two light rays. One light ray propagates in the direction parallel to the ether wind and the second light ray propagates perpendicular to the ether wind. Initially only the parallel light ray is affected by the ether wind since the parallel light ray is propagating in the direction of the ether wind which would increase the velocity of the parallel light ray.The perpendicular light ray is unaffected by the ether wind since the perpendicular light ray is propagating perpendicular to the direction of the ether wind; consequently, the ether wind would not affect the velocity of the perpendicular light ray. Both the parallel and perpendicular light rays are combined to form an interference effect of Michelson's interferometer. Rotating Michelson's experimental apparatus, at certain angles, both light rays velocities would be affected by the ether wind that would result in the shift of the interference effect and verify the existence of the ether but the result was negative. Lorentz and Einstein reverses the negative result of Michelson and Michelson-Morley experiment to justify the ether but there are numerous problems regarding Michelson's experiment. First, according to Michelson, initially the parallel light ray's velocity is increased by propagating in the direction of the ether wind but after the parallel light ray is reflected by the mirror, the parallel light ray is propagating in the opposite direction that would reduce the velocity of the parallel light ray and cancel the test of the ether wind. In Michelson-Morley ether experiment, numerous reflection by the parallel light ray is used to conceal the cancelation problem but the net result of the all the reflections of Michelson-Morley experiment would also cancel the test of the ether wind. In addition, Michelson experiment is based on Fresnel's diffraction effect but Fresnel's describes diffraction uses interfering light waves that produce a diffraction pattern projected on a diffraction screen yet Michelson's interference effect is viewed using a small telescope pointed at the beam splitter since the two light rays of Michelson's experiment cannot produce a diffraction pattern projected on a screen. Experimentally, when two laser beam's intensities are combined, no interference effect is formed on a diffraction screen since the formation of wave interference requires an ether, composed of matter, that does not physically exist. Plus, Michelson and Michelson-Morley ether experiments are testing for the existence of the ether but both experiments are also using the ether to form interfering light waves that are used to produced an interference effect that is used to test for the existence of the ether which is a violation of scientific method. Also, the velocity of light is four order of magnitude greater than the maximum velocity of the ether wind (Vmax = 30,462 m/s) formed by the earth's daily and yearly motions; consequently, the ether wind cannot produce the shift of the interference effect that is used to justify the existence of the ether. Furthermore, Michelson is creating a contradiction regarding the motion of the ether. At the surface of the earth, Huygens-Fresnel ether is stationary but Michelson's is representing a stationary stellar ether which conflicts with Huygens' ether that is stationary at the surface of the earth. Also, Michelson's experiment is based on a ether wind that has a constant magnitude, at the surface of the earth but the ether wind, formed by the earth's daily and yearly rotational motions, at the surface of the earth, is not constant. At a point on the surface of the earth (6:00 pm), the magnitude of the earth's tangential velocity vector that forms the ether wind is 462 m/s (fig 7), and, increases to 5,077 m/s at 7:00 pm. At midnight, the earth's tangential velocity vector is 30,462 m/s; consequently, the magnitude of the ether wind increases from 462 m/s to 30,462 m/s (6:00 pm - 12:00 am) yet Michelson's experiment is based on a constant magnitude of the ether wind. Moreover, Michelson's experiment is unnecessary since light propagating in vacuum proves Fresnel's ether, composed of matter, does not physically exist. -1
Janus Posted October 29, 2017 Posted October 29, 2017 Just, stop. You don't have a sufficient grasp of the subject involved to do any analysis of the M&M experiment, and if you just copied this from someplace else, the same hold for being able to spot the errors in this "wall o' text". Just to highlight one incorrect statement is this mess. The fact the light traveling in one direction with respect to the aether gains speed and loses it in the other, doe not cancel out in terms of detecting motion with respect to the Ether. If there is no ether or you are at rest with respect to it, and the distance traveled by the light in one direction is L, then the round trip would be L/c + L/c = 2L/c . However, if there were an ether and you were moving at v with repect to it, then the light going in the same direction as your velocity would take L/(c-v), and the light going the opposite direction would take L/(c+v) for a total round trip of L/(c-v)+L/(c+v) = (Lc+Lv+Lc-LV)/( (c-v)(c+v) = 2L/(c-v2/c), which is not equal to 2L/c. So there would be a difference between moving with respect to the ether or not. The fact that the motion with respect to the ether would be variable is actually crucial to the experiment, as it removes the possibility that, by chance, the Earth just happened to be at rest with respect to the Ether when you perform the experiment. If you did the experiment just once, it is possible you might have hit on this rare occurrence. But if you perform it twice and at times when the Earth's velocity had to be different with respect to the Ether, then if there was an ether, then you would get a positive result for at least one of the runs. 2
studiot Posted October 29, 2017 Posted October 29, 2017 8 hours ago, Janus said: You don't have a sufficient grasp of the subject involved to do any analysis of the M&M experiment, and if you just copied this from someplace else, the same hold for being able to spot the errors in this "wall o' text". +1 for reading the 'wall' at all
John Cuthber Posted October 29, 2017 Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) 15 hours ago, reerer said: According to Michelson, a stationary ether, composed of matter, exists in all of stellar space. Actually, since the thing he's most famous for is showing the ether doesn't exist, that's as far as you need to read before you realise that the wall of text isn't worth reading. 15 hours ago, reerer said: First, according to Michelson, initially the parallel light ray's velocity is increased by propagating in the direction of the ether wind but after the parallel light ray is reflected by the mirror, the parallel light ray is propagating in the opposite direction that would reduce the velocity of the parallel light ray and cancel the test of the ether wind. That's a common misconception. If I run a mile and back at 10 miles an hour it takes me a fifth of an hour. (A tenth of an hour each way) If I run on a "travelator" that's doing 1 mile an hour then, WRT the ground I run a mile at 11 miles an hour and a mile at 9 miles an hour. The first "half" takes 1/11 hours and the second half takes 1/9 hours Overall it takes 1/11+1/9 ie 20/99 or 0.202020 hours. That's not 0.2 Edited October 29, 2017 by John Cuthber 2
studiot Posted October 29, 2017 Posted October 29, 2017 2 hours ago, John Cuthber said: That's a common misconception. If I run a mile and back at 10 miles an hour it takes me a fifth of an hour. (A tenth of an hour each way) If I run on a "travelator" that's doing 1 mile an hour then, WRT the ground I run a mile at 11 miles an hour and a mile at 9 miles an hour. The first "half" takes 1/11 hours and the second half takes 1/9 hours Overall it takes 1/11+1/9 ie 20/99 or 0.202020 hours. That's not 0.2 Nice +1
reerer Posted October 30, 2017 Author Posted October 30, 2017 I was thinking of what you had written and came up with this: Using c + v to represent the parallel light ray propagating toward the mirror in the direction of the ether wind, and, c - v to represent the parallel light ray propagating in the opposite direction of the ether wind where v represents the magnitude of the ether wind. The effect of the light ray propagating in both directions is represented with: (c + v) - (c - v) = 2v................................................1 But v represents the velocity of the ether wind. So what happen to the velocity of light? The problem is that this method is using the reflection as a separate effect when in fact they are the same; therefore, the real representation would be : c + v - v = c..............................................................2 which represents the Michelson's cancelation problem. For Michelson-Morley experiment we can add N to equation 2 c + N(v - v) = c..............................................................3 where N represents the number of reflections of Michelson-Morley experiment.
John Cuthber Posted October 30, 2017 Posted October 30, 2017 3 hours ago, reerer said: Using c + v to represent... That's not how velocities add at these speeds.
reerer Posted October 30, 2017 Author Posted October 30, 2017 I rewrote it. Maybe this will clarify the problem. § 6. Michelson In Michelson's paper, "The Relative Motion of the Earth and the Lumiferous Ether" (1881), Michelson tests for Fresnel's stationary ether composed of matter using an interferometer. "The undulatory theory of light assumes the existence of a medium called the ether, whose vibrations produce the phenomena of heat and light, and which is supposed to fill all space. According to Fresnel, the ether, which is enclosed in optical media, partakes of the motion of these media, to an extent depending on their indices of refraction. For air, this motion would be but a small fraction of that of the air itself and will be neglected." (Michelson, p. 120). "Assuming then that the ether is at rest, the earth moving through it, the time required for light to pass from one point to another on the earth's surface, would depend on the direction in which it travels." (Michelson, p. 120). "The interpretation of these results is that there is no displacement of the interference bands. The result of the hypothesis of a stationary ether is thus shown to be incorrect, and the necessary conclusion follows that the hypothesis is erroneous." (Michelson, p. 128). According to Michelson, a stationary ether, composed of matter, exists in all of stellar space. At the surface of the earth, the earth's daily and yearly motions interaction with Michelson's stationary celestial ether forms an ether wind which Michelson's experiment is testing. An arc lamp and a beam splitter are used to form two light rays. One light ray propagates in the direction parallel to the ether wind and the second light ray propagates perpendicular to the ether wind. Initially only the parallel light ray is affected by the ether wind since the parallel light ray is propagating in the direction of the ether wind which would increase the velocity of the parallel light ray. The perpendicular light ray is unaffected by the ether wind since the perpendicular light ray is propagating perpendicular to the direction of the ether wind; consequently, the ether wind would not affect the velocity of the perpendicular light ray. Both the parallel and perpendicular light rays are combined to form an interference effect of Michelson's interferometer. Rotating Michelson's experimental apparatus, at certain angles, both light rays velocities would be affected by the ether wind that would result in the shift of the interference effect and verify the existence of the ether but the result was negative. Lorentz reverses the negative result of Michelson's experiment to justify the existence of Fresnel's ether, composed of matter, but there are numerous problems regarding Michelson's experiment. First, according to Michelson, initially the parallel light ray's velocity +v is increased by propagating in the direction of the ether wind but after the parallel light ray propagates in the opposite direction the parallel light ray's velocity decreases -v which cancels the test of the ether wind (v - v = 0). Michelson-Morley uses numerous reflections to conceal the cancelation problem but the net result of the all the reflections [N(v - v) = 0] of Michelson-Morley experiment would also cancel the test of the ether wind. In addition, Michelson experiment is based on Fresnel's diffraction effect that interfering light waves produce the diffraction pattern projected on a diffraction screen yet Michelson's interference effect is viewed using a small telescope pointed at the beam splitter since the two light rays of Michelson's experiment cannot produce a diffraction pattern projected on a screen. Example, when two coherent laser beam's intensities are combined, no interference effect is formed on a diffraction screen since the formation of wave interference requires an ether, composed of matter, that does not physically exist (vacuum). Plus, Michelson ether experiment is testing for the existence of the ether but both experiments are also using the ether to form interfering light waves that are used to produced an interference effect that is used to test for the existence of the ether which is in violation of scientific method. Also, the velocity of light is four order of magnitude greater than the maximum velocity of the ether wind (Vmax = 30,462 m/s) formed by the earth's daily and yearly motions; consequently, the ether wind cannot produce the shift of the interference effect that is used to justify the existence of the ether. Furthermore, at the surface of the earth, Huygens-Fresnel ether is stationary but Michelson's is representing a stationary stellar ether; the ether cannot be stationary both in all of stellar space and at the surface of the earth, at the same time, because of the earth's daily and yearly motions. Also, Michelson's experiment is based on a ether wind that has a constant magnitude, at the surface of the earth but the ether wind, formed by the earth's daily and yearly rotational motions, at the surface of the earth, is not constant. At a point on the surface of the earth, at 6:00 pm, the magnitude of the earth's tangential velocity vector that forms the ether wind is 462 m/s (fig 7), and, increases to 5,077 m/s at 7:00 pm. At midnight, the earth's tangential velocity vector is 30,462 m/s; consequently, the magnitude of the ether wind increases from 462 m/s to 30,462 m/s (6:00 pm - 12:00 am) yet Michelson's experiment is based on a constant magnitude of the ether wind. Moreover, Michelson's experiment is unnecessary since light propagating in vacuum proves Fresnel's ether, composed of matter, does not physically exist. Time velocity ______________________ 6:00 pm 462 m/s 7:00 pm 5,077 m/s 8:00 pm 10,154 m/s 9:00 pm 15,231 m/s 10:00 pm 20,308 m/s 11:00 pm 25,385 m/s 12:00 am 30,462 m/s .................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... "Michelson did not conclude that the Earth travels at zero speed through the aether; he concluded, rather, that despite the care and precautions taken the device was too susceptible to extraneous facts, such as temperature and vibration, and was not suitable for measuring that speed. His exploration filed, he thought, to yield the interesting data he had hoped for. He could have sought an explanation for his 'null' outcome other than the inadequacy of his interferometer. If he had had sufficient confidence in the non-existence of the effect he tried to measure, he might have looked for a theoretical explanation. As it was, within a few years Albert Einstein had developed a theory from which it followed that the looked-for effect does not exist. Not that his theory ended the exploration. For perhaps, despite Einstein's theory, Michelson's effect does exist and it really was the inadequacies of his device which prevented him from detecting it. There have been enough surprise in the history of physics to make us cautious in ruling out the possibility of such a result (Collins and Pinch 1993: ch 2)."(Gower, p. 241). "More artificial theories have been tried out, assuming that the real truth lies somewhere between these two limiting cases: that the ether is only partially carried by the moving bodies. But they all failed! Every attempt to explain the electromagnetic phenomena in moving CS with the help of the motion of the ether, motion through the ether, or both these motions, proved unsuccessful. Thus arose one of the most dramatic situations in the history of science. All assumptions concerning ether led nowhere! The experimental verdict was always negative." (Weaver, p. 145). ____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
hypervalent_iodine Posted October 31, 2017 Posted October 31, 2017 ! Moderator Note Enough. If you aren't going to do everyone the courtesy of even attempting to provide evidence, then we are not going to allow you to continue posting here. You have been suspended for one week, and this thread is closed. I suggest you review the rules while you are away. 1
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