Gun control, which side wins?

[iNow]

53 minutes ago, J.C.MacSwell said:

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/asia/2022/07/08/attack-on-former-japan-pm-stuns-nation-known-for-gun-control.html

Japan’s tight gun laws add to shock over Abe’s assassination

"Abe’s security team may face serious questions. But because such attacks are extraordinary in Japan, relatively light security is the norm, even for former prime ministers."

Thank you. I should’ve been more clear.

I’m aware Japan has relatively light security. I was asking about heavier security elsewhere, and guns being the primary reason why that security in other nations is more proactive (as opposed to general threat levels and extra-legal activities, etc). Your link doesn’t support that, but that’s what was suggested.

Doesn’t matter, though. I don’t need it even want a link so long as nobody’s arguing Abe would still be alive were he making this visit in Azerbaijan or Austria or Afghanistan or something. 

9 minutes ago, mistermack said:

The gun looked like a homemade short barrelled shotgun, although it was just a glimpse on the video. The sound also sounded like shotgun ammunition, but there was a lot of echos. 

3D printed guns are the bigger threat IMO. They’re already much more common than we’d prefer. 

10 minutes ago, mistermack said:

you would imagine that shotgun ammunition would be less restricted than handgun or rifle ammo, so Japan will probably have to clamp down on it, if that was the case.

It’s also easier to load your own shells and make your own. 

[mistermack]

12 minutes ago, iNow said:

It’s also easier to load your own shells and make your own. 

Can you re-use a fired shotgun cartridge? 

[iNow]

18 minutes ago, mistermack said:

Can you re-use a fired shotgun cartridge? 

Of course 

But you can get gallon sized bags of them for cheap so would only do that if times were really tough

[mistermack]

11 minutes ago, iNow said:

Of course 

But you can get gallon sized bags of them for cheap so would only do that if times were really tough

In the USA, of course it's easy to get what you want. But in Japan maybe not so easy. 

Even in the USA, it might be better to reload a cartridge you found in the woods for an asassination, since it wouldn't be traceable to you. 

This guy made his own gun, so it wouldn't be surprising if he made his own ammunition.

[StringJunky]

21 minutes ago, mistermack said:

In the USA, of course it's easy to get what you want. But in Japan maybe not so easy. 

Even in the USA, it might be better to reload a cartridge you found in the woods for an asassination, since it wouldn't be traceable to you. 

This guy made his own gun, so it wouldn't be surprising if he made his own ammunition.

It seems if you use a sawn off shotgun it will leave characteristic striations on the wad after exiting the barrel. If you've got the gun and they find the wad, I suppose they just have to match the powder trace chemistry on the wad and in the gun as well to implicate your weapon. A reloaded used cartridge won't necessarily get you off in that situation.

[zapatos]

45 minutes ago, mistermack said:

Even in the USA, it might be better to reload a cartridge you found in the woods for an asassination, since it wouldn't be traceable to you.

I'm not sure how a cartridge will be traceable to you unless you left a fingerprint on it. And if you are planning to escape you can just take it with you and throw it in the ocean.

[mistermack]

A shotgun or homemade gun isn't really the ideal weapon if you planned to escape anyway. Not if the target victim has protection. This guy must be a nut-case, as he was 100% sure to get caught in that situation. 

Probably a narcissist like the guy who killed John Lennon. Or paranoid, with an obsessive grudge against Abe, or politicians in general. 

Jill Dando, the UK Crimewatch presenter, was murdered with a homemade or home-altered gun, and they never traced the killer, but she was alone when she was killed. 

[iNow]

It seems Abe is a bad name for people who wish to lead nations and not get shot. 

[mistermack]

4 minutes ago, iNow said:

It seems Abe is a bad name for people who wish to lead nations and not get shot. 

That's why you'll never see an Abe Kennedy.

[J.C.MacSwell]

2 hours ago, mistermack said:

That's why you'll never see an Abe Kennedy.

Hopefully soon all the Ferdinand's remove Vladimir from lists of possible baby names as well...

[dimreepr]

10 hours ago, mistermack said:

That's why you'll never see an Abe Kennedy.

Of course not, you've entirely missed @iNow and @Phi for All point.

Edited July 9, 2022 by dimreepr

[mistermack]

1 hour ago, dimreepr said:

Of course not, you've entirely missed @iNow and @Phi for All point.

And yours.

[J.C.MacSwell]

1 hour ago, dimreepr said:

... @iNow and @Phi for All point.

Better to name your kid Lee Harvey Booth?

[dimreepr]

4 minutes ago, mistermack said:

And yours.

When you fear the gun, don't walk into a firing range... 

[TheVat]

15 hours ago, iNow said:

 

3D printed guns are the bigger threat IMO. They’re already much more common than we’d prefer. 

 

Yep.  It will also help to crack down on ghost guns, which are also assembled by an end user...

UPS just gave notice it would stop shipping for retailers that vend ghost gun parts:

https://www.vice.com/en/article/5d3bdk/ups-ghost-gun-rules

[TheVat]

I would hazard a guess that many people in the central Front Range area of Colorado are getting tired of mealy-mouthed politician responses to mass shootings. Littleton, Aurora, Boulder, now CO Springs - I haven't broken it down statistically, but that seems like a high concentration there.  And the latest shooting, at the gay nightclub in CS, it seems the shooter evaded the Red Flag law that should have taken his weapons from him a couple years ago.  I hope this tragedy will prompt some modifications in enforcement of such laws.  In any case, heroic job done by the fellow who went all Liam Neeson on the guy - probably stopped the body count from going into double digits.  

[iu360]

Hi
 

"Gun control is a deeply divisive topic with valid arguments on both sides. Proponents argue that stricter laws can reduce gun violence and increase public safety, while opponents believe it infringes on personal freedoms and the right to self-defense. Ultimately, the 'winning' side often depends on finding a balance between safeguarding rights and ensuring community safety. What do you think would help in achieving this balance?"

 

[zapatos]

Hi back!

May I ask who you are quoting?

[Phi for All]

I don't think there can be a balance. You need a weapon to hunt or for target shooting, that's the "sporting" argument. Arguing to have weapons to defend yourself from other citizens or even your own government throws off any balance you might have had. There's no balance when both the police and the citizens are armed.

I am curious about how easily the MAGA crowd will give up their guns when TFG asks for them (they've given him everything else he's asked for). You can't be an authoritarian leader with an armed citizenry. All his heroes heavily restrict who can have a gun in their respective countries. Eventually he's going to tell his worshippers that the enemy within might steal their guns and use them on innocents, and it's best if he confiscates them before that happens. He really just wants to protect you, whether you like it or not.

[iNow]

4 minutes ago, Phi for All said:

Eventually he's going to tell his worshippers that the enemy within might steal their guns and use them on innocents, and it's best if he confiscates them before that happens

I see it as more likely that he “deputizes” his 2A followers to help with the mass deportation raids, be damned whether the person being raided is truly a criminal or here illegally without appropriate documents. “Brown enough” will be the new threshold for MAGA vigilantism. 

[Phi for All]

3 minutes ago, iNow said:

I see it as more likely that he “deputizes” his 2A followers to help with the mass deportation raids, be damned whether the person being raided is truly a criminal or here illegally without appropriate documents. “Brown enough” will be the new threshold for MAGA vigilantism. 

Kiss the ring, get an armband, keep your guns? It's what Putin and Orban did. Otherwise, you need a full psychiatric evaluation to be licensed in Russia. Kim Jong Un might let some folks hunt (the East Germans used to have government supervised "hunts" for certain agricultural collectives), but as far as I've heard, he doesn't allow guns for protection except in military hands. 

[swansont]

5 hours ago, iu360 said:

Hi
 

"Gun control is a deeply divisive topic with valid arguments on both sides. Proponents argue that stricter laws can reduce gun violence and increase public safety, while opponents believe it infringes on personal freedoms and the right to self-defense. Ultimately, the 'winning' side often depends on finding a balance between safeguarding rights and ensuring community safety. What do you think would help in achieving this balance?"

 

!

Moderator Note

I will make this official: if you quote someone else, you need to give us the source.