Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 I believe the Einstein is right. I do not exactly know since it can not yet explain my metaphysical values but for sure so far perfectly points every physical entities whereabout and whatabout(energy, matter in space (time) I am excited about what our scientists seek to discover and understand. I believe (I dont exactly know) but I sense that Science raises Humanity out of darkness. Does science is my religion than?
John Cuthber Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 In science, you accept the facts even if they don't agree with your beliefs. In religion, you accept your beliefs even if they on't agree with the facts. Science can't be a religion. 2
Strange Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 Science is not a religion. It is a way of creating and testing ideas about the world. 1
koti Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, Lasse said: I believe (I dont exactly know) but I sense that Science raises Humanity out of darkness. Does science is my religion than? The network protocol which is used to send your post to this forum is called TCP/IP and consists of 7 layers. The device which you used to type your post is based on semiconductors processing millions of operations per second - Alan Turing was the inventor of the first computer during WWII. There is nothing to sense. There is everything to know. Science deals with knowing not believing.
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 1 minute ago, koti said: The network protocol which is used to send your post to this forum is called TCP/IP and consists of 7 layers. The device which you used to type your post is based on semiconductors processing millions of operations per second - Alan Turing was the inventor of the first computer during WWII. There is nothing to sense. There is everything to know. Science deals with knowing not believing. This I know. I know you know. I sense also what you do not know. You can not say in the name of science that you know everything. I am not a scientist but I experience your recognitions. If I know something what I previously believed than what is it? My culture? My religion? My intuition? All of them?
zapatos Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 I imagine you could call science your religion if you chose to do so. There is a history, texts, artifacts, icons, rituals, people to worship, and you can take everything on faith (you can believe it without ever seeing any evidence).
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 Exactly On the level of my understanding. I know some, the rest, I believe You know what you know, and set the right questions untill I try to catch up to understand. I can assure you, there are many in my shoe
dimreepr Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 5 minutes ago, Lasse said: Exactly On the level of my understanding. I know some, the rest, I believe You know what you know, and set the right questions untill I try to catch up to understand. That only works when there's a disconnect between knowledge and understanding.
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, dimreepr said: That only works when there's a disconnect between knowledge and understanding. On this we disagree. They support one another. I recognize that there are things I do not understand. I know what I know.
dimreepr Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 Just now, Lasse said: They support one another. Nope, the disconnect is belief.
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, dimreepr said: Nope, the disconnect is belief. Part of what I do not know. Scientists still has questions. I believe they right what they know Now and that the future questions and answers will be right as well. Some of the questions not yet set... I believe they will be right Edited April 5, 2018 by Lasse
Phi for All Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 31 minutes ago, zapatos said: I imagine you could call science your religion if you chose to do so. There is a history, texts, artifacts, icons, rituals, people to worship, and you can take everything on faith (you can believe it without ever seeing any evidence). The difference is that with science, you could support your beliefs by learning what the evidence suggests. You don't have to use faith alone, you also have something to trust. Religions have no evidence to support what they claim. 1
zapatos Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 1 minute ago, Phi for All said: The difference is that with science, you could support your beliefs by learning what the evidence suggests. You don't have to use faith alone, you also have something to trust. Religions have no evidence to support what they claim. I agree, with the exception of "religions have no evidence to support what they claim". It would be more accurate to say they have 'no evidence to support much of or some of what they claim'. It is not a requirement of any religion I've heard of to never have evidence for any claims. Regardless though, Lasse didn't ask "is science a religion", Lasse asked "can science be my religion", and that is why I answered in the affirmative. 2
dimreepr Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, Lasse said: Part of what I do not know. Scientists still has questions. I believe they right what they know Now and that the future questions and answers will be right as well. Some of the questions not yet set... I believe they will be right 5 minutes ago, Phi for All said: The difference is that with science, you could support your beliefs by learning what the evidence suggests. You don't have to use faith alone, you also have something to trust. When one thinks one knows, understanding is not to be trusted and belief takes over.
Phi for All Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 32 minutes ago, zapatos said: I agree, with the exception of "religions have no evidence to support what they claim". It would be more accurate to say they have 'no evidence to support much of or some of what they claim'. It is not a requirement of any religion I've heard of to never have evidence for any claims. Regardless though, Lasse didn't ask "is science a religion", Lasse asked "can science be my religion", and that is why I answered in the affirmative. Fair points. I still think it's unnecessarily inaccurate to lump science in with religion just because it's what you "believe". You know me, there's more than one type of belief. 20 minutes ago, dimreepr said: When one thinks one knows, understanding is not to be trusted and belief takes over. Which is the reason science deals in theory instead of proof. Best current explanations are more trustworthy than answers.
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) 22 minutes ago, dimreepr said: When one thinks one knows, understanding is not to be trusted and belief takes over. We did not born with what we know today. I do not know what I will learn tomorrow. Do you know everything? Edited April 5, 2018 by Lasse
dimreepr Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, Lasse said: Do you know everything? Nope.
Phi for All Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, Lasse said: We did not born with what we know today. I do not know what I will learn tomorrow. Do you know everything? The point isn't really what you know. The point is that religion uses faith, a strong belief that doesn't need anything but a strong belief. Science uses evidence to ensure that our explanations for natural phenomena are the best currently available, and always subject to change when new evidence is uncovered. Scientific explanations can be trusted, and I think that's a stronger form of belief than faith or wishful thinking. 1
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Phi for All said: The point isn't really what you know. The point is that religion uses faith, a strong belief that doesn't need anything but a strong belief. Science uses evidence to ensure that our explanations for natural phenomena are the best currently available, and always subject to change when new evidence is uncovered. Scientific explanations can be trusted, and I think that's a stronger form of belief than faith or wishful thinking. It depends. What I know became culture as I teach and raise my kids related to that. Me, They,We are Society. Culture impact science or Science impact Culture? I would vote on the second. They seems to be fundamentally interconnected at the end of the day. I believe what I know. Or what I know that you know Edited April 5, 2018 by Lasse
HB of CJ Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 Religion usually is based upon faith. Beliefs unsupportable as facts. Science should be empirical hard facts proven by experiment. Religion and Science are different.
Phi for All Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 32 minutes ago, Lasse said: It depends. What I know became culture as I teach and raise my kids related to that. Me, They,We are Society. Culture impact science or Science impact Culture? I would vote on the second. They seems to be fundamentally interconnected at the end of the day. I believe what I know. Or what I know that you know What I've found is this. People of faith find it almost impossible to change their beliefs no matter how much the evidence shows they should. Religious beliefs are NOT required to be reasoned. People of science find it trivially easy to change what they choose to trust when better evidence provides a better, more trustworthy explanation. Science requires a great deal of critical thinking. I don't like thinking of science as a religion. They're different words and different concepts for good reasons. I distrust arguments trying to conflate them, since there are so many people out there trying to give science a bad name, for their own agendas.
swansont Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 4 hours ago, Lasse said: I believe the Einstein is right. I do not exactly know since it can not yet explain my metaphysical values but for sure so far perfectly points every physical entities whereabout and whatabout(energy, matter in space (time) I am excited about what our scientists seek to discover and understand. I believe (I dont exactly know) but I sense that Science raises Humanity out of darkness. I don't see what any of that has to do with religion. You can believe anything without understanding it, accept it as dogma even though it isn't. So you can have a religious belief in science, but that doesn't make science a religion
Lasse Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, John Cuthber said: In science, you accept the facts even if they don't agree with your beliefs. In religion, you accept your beliefs even if they on't agree with the facts. Science can't be a religion. True. I/0. I believe that it has an answer. And thereby i believe that our scientists sooner or later will be able to give an answer. I believe scientists will be able to explain infinity or finite. Relativity and Reality. Determin the smallest possible unit of space and time (if they did not do that yet). I believe we will be able to digitally recognize reality. My beliefs changing as science progresses and my understanding is developing. Until I do not understand everything, the unknown part of that knowledge is handled as the believed to be good part of my individual recognition. I think religion is very individual. Edited April 5, 2018 by Lasse
iNow Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 Science is a process. You may as well make house cleaning or hair brushing a religion. It would be roughly equivalent. Such an approach, however, dilutes the usage of the term “religion” so much that it’s effectively rendered useless.
John Cuthber Posted April 6, 2018 Posted April 6, 2018 13 hours ago, Lasse said: Do you know everything? No, and again, that's a vital aspect of the reason science is different from religion. Science accepts that it knows very little - and tries to do something about it. Religion believes that it has all the answers.
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