India's Democracy !

[Commander]

Unless I give below the link I can not do justice to the topic !

'2019 Election is the Last Chance for Indian Democracy'

 

 

[iNow]

16 minutes ago, Commander said:

Unless I give below the link I can not do justice to the topic !

Which is, what exactly?

How do you wish this topic to be discussed?

What questions do you wish to explore, commandingly or otherwise?

[Commander]

Hi iNow

I wanted to give the link to this Debate about what's going on in the Indian Democracy but then as I inserted the link it got embedded.

Basically I want to say that INDIAN DEMOCRACY is almost Doomed & this can be realized only if what is being stated is understood.

All the Intellectuals and Right thinking Citizens of India are under attack & either really or vicariously Muted or Eliminated.

If anything is not understood because of use of Hindi words etc I can clarify.

Of course I understand that the audience may need to know more about some issues before being able to appreciate the topic fully & therefore I can explain them further.

[iNow]

35 minutes ago, Commander said:

All the Intellectuals and Right thinking Citizens of India are under attack & either really or vicariously Muted or Eliminated.

What is a right thinking citizen?

[Commander]

25 minutes ago, iNow said:

What is a right thinking citizen?

 

Well they are called let's say RATIONALISTS which is perhaps well understood here in the Scientific Community which believes in Nothing but what is proven Scientifically.

I give below a part of the list :

Critics have raised questions on the safety of writers and journalists against after the killing of senior Kannada journalist Gauri Lankesh in Bengaluru. Lankesh called herself an ‘activist-journalist’ and was an outspoken critic of right-wing Hindutva politics.

Lankesh’s death is being counted as the latest in a string of murders of ‘rationalist’ writers, including MM Kalburgi, Govind Pansare and Narendra Dabholkar.

Here’s a list of some of the writers and journalists killed in recent years:

MM Kalburgi

The 77-year-old outspoken rationalist was killed in a manner similar to Lankesh. He fell to the bullets of two unidentified men at his residence in Dharwad, Karnataka in September 2015. The incident sent shock waves across the Kannada literary world and elsewhere in Karnataka.

Govind Pansare

Leftist leader and a prominent activist and rationalist, Govind Pansare was shot dead by two unidentified persons in February 2014 when he was returning home from his morning walk in Kolhapur. He died in Mumbai on February 20. Sanatan Sanstha activist Samir Gaikwad was arrested in connection with the murder, and later granted bail.

Narendra Dabholkar

On August 20, 2013, Dabholkar, a prominent anti-superstition crusader, was allegedly gunned down by two bike-borne men during his morning walk in Pune.

According to a CBI charge sheet filed in September last year, Akolkar and Pawar, two members of the right-wing organisation Sanatan Sanstha, gunned down the rationalist. In June 2014, the case was handed over to the CBI after the Pune police failed to make any headway.

Ranjan Rajdeo

Ranjan, a journalist with Hindi daily Hindustan, was shot from close range by assailants on a motorcycle in May last year. He headed the paper’s bureau in Siwan, Bihar and had written extensively on the case involving Shrikant Bharti – an aide of BJP MP Om Prakash Yadav – who was shot dead in 2014.

Also the Lynchings going on :

Mob lynchings in India: A look at data and the story behind the numbers

 

One of the most stinging descriptions of the dangers of mob violence never to be published (at least by the author in his lifetime) was Mark Twain’s response to a racial lynching in Missouri in 1901. He saw in it the danger of America turning into “The United States of Lyncherdom”. The secular republic of India, more than a century later, appears to be amidst the shadow of a similar fear.

A recent report by IndiaSpend, basing itself on the content analysis of news reports, concludes that “In the first six months of 2017, 20 cow-terror attacks were reported–more than 75 per cent of the 2016 figure, which was the worst year for such violence since 2010. The attacks include mob lynching, attacks by vigilantes, murder and attempt to murder, harassment, assault and gang-rape. In two attacks, the victims/survivors were chained, stripped and beaten, while in two others, the victims were hanged.”

Another analysis  of mob violence and public disorder between January 2011 and June 2017 on Observer Research Analysis, shows that cow-related violence has spiked up dramatically from five per cent of the total incidents (of Lynching or Public Disorder) to over 20 per cent by the end of June 2017.

The anguish against this recent mob violence has been palpable among a large section of the citizenry. It has recently led to series of protests and demonstrations (including the “Not In My Name” campaign) in many parts of the country.

Everyone condemns mob lynching deaths, so what is the problem?

There has already been a spate of opinion pieces in mainstream media over the murder of people by mob lynching in India. A common thread which emerges across the Right and the Left is that vigilantism and mob lynching should have no place in society. Its presence shows an inept law and order situation and prevents society from facing and handling other serious issues of development.

However, going beyond the valid concern of law and order, there is also the dimension of a perceived escalation in such mob-violence over the past few years, and its relationship with the rise of the Right-wing in power. It has been eloquently pointed out that this recent spate of mob lynching indicates state indifference and a majoritarian denial of reality, that it is the deliberate persecution of minorities based on hate,  an anti-Muslim feeling buoyed by the current Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh-Bharatiya Janata Party dispensation, and that a lynching is a majority’s way of telling a minority population that the law cannot protect it. This rings out loud in the aftermath of legislations passed on cattle trade and the now infamous rise of cow vigilantism in India.

There are however certain sections within the media who deny such perception any basis in reality. They point out to the gruesome history of mob violence and massacres in the past, particularly prior to the current central government, to state that lynching is essentially a law and order problem. They argue that there is only a “narrative” within a politically biased mainstream media, which seeks to hold the central BJP government and the RSS responsible and that a consequence of such “selective condemnation and bigotry”, is that it absolves law enforcement and drives away the moderates from the debate.

The question, therefore, hinges on looking at the trends of such mob violence and lynchings in India in the recent past.

Communal lynchings: A new form of hate crime

In the absence of any official data on mob violence and lynching, news content could certainly serve as an important data sources with regard to such crimes. Some insightful characteristics can definitely be discerned by any such content analysis on mob violence. The authors of this piece did an exercise searching specifically for ‘mob lynching’ in ‘India’ on Google news between 2010 and 2017.

The exercise is somewhat similar to that by IndiaSpend that uses different key words such as ‘cow vigilantes’, ‘gau rakshaks’, ‘beef’, ‘lynching’, ‘cow slaughter’, ‘cattle thieves’, ‘beef smuggler’ and ‘cattle trader’.  The results of the IndiaSpend article have not been duplicated and can be found here separately.

The biggest trend that could be observed from our data-set is that of the lynching of individuals by a mob acting as an executor of an extrajudicial punishment. It includes the lynching of individuals who have been accused of petty crimes, individuals accused of murder and rape, and individuals perceived by the mob as deviants. There have also been quite a few instances of mob-violence on the basis of race against African and African-American students and tourists.

Apart from the incidents considered in our analysis there are three other prominent issues which merit an independent investigation and have not been included here as the incident count pertaining to them is too large. In addition, cases related to these issues are also often not reported. First are lynching deaths based on witch-hunting. These numbers are shocking in themselves. One report indicate that 2,097 such murders were committed between 2000 and 2012 in at least 12 states. The second type pertains to the historical issue of caste violence against Dalits. Caste atrocities often include lynching but are generally under-reported. The purpose behind these displays of violence in public is of course to intimidate by way of making an example. Curiously, one of the first widely reported instances of mob lynching based on bovine issues in recent times was based on a rumour of cow slaughter in 2002, where five Dalits from Haryana were lynched by a frenzied mob. The third includes lynching incidents which have occurred during riots or have been the instigating cause of riots (for instance in Muzzafarnagar as well as in Kokrajhar). These incidents are part of communal violence and rioting and must be considered separately.

There is, then, a clear history of mob violence and lynching in India, reflecting a society with palpable remnants of pre-modern values -- the barbaric caste system being the most glaring example. This above listing of mob violence seen in conjunction with the data released by IndiaSpend (which cover a total of 101 cases), however, shows the creation of an entirely new category of violence -– bovine-related mob lynching deaths. This category has its own characteristics -- the victims are largely Muslims, the proximate causes often based on rumours, built upon the prejudices against a community. It is also revealing that the proportion of this type of lynching among all cases of mob violence has increased in the last three years.

Edited September 4, 2018 by Commander

[Ten oz]

@Commander imprisoning journalists and assaulting/killing activists is wrong and no govt should oppress their citizens that way. You can simply state as much, as I just have, and we can discuss it. When you copy and paste the words of others it makes it unclear what you wish to discuss. What are your personal insights on this issue?

[Commander]

58 minutes ago, Ten oz said:

@Commander imprisoning journalists and assaulting/killing activists is wrong and no govt should oppress their citizens that way. You can simply state as much, as I just have, and we can discuss it. When you copy and paste the words of others it makes it unclear what you wish to discuss. What are your personal insights on this issue?

Hi Ten OZ

I gave more details as I could not have edited out here and there and shortened it without losing the Import the message will carry.

I only changed  "Gauri Lankesh was murdered in Bengaluru on Tuesday" to "Gauri Lankesh was murdered in Bengaluru" as that Tuesday was an year ago.

Also, it will not be easy to grasp and understand the gravity of the Situation for those who are not in India.

Imagine if Beef is banned in USA [India being the world's largest exporter] what will you feel ? What I mean is US Govt passes a Law that no one in US can eat Beef !

They have done that in India in most States !

This will give you a little more understanding of what these articles & Arun Shourie's Lecture has brought out.

More later

TY

Edited September 4, 2018 by Commander

[observer1]

so i ask you what is they ban pork in all western countries that eat bacon and like it? ofc all the muslims will be happy but the MAJORITY  are angry.
even if usa bans beef nothing will happen to india as the total export of beef from india is 3.17 billion and india's gdp is 147.35 trillion. A scratch in comparison

you are saying that if a democratically elected government comes to power is undemocratic even it took it 39 years to come to the central election. Also the congress killed a LOT of journalists during emergency but no one talks bout that?

i know this was created a long time ago but just keeping it there fr all who want to know the other side

Edited August 17, 2022 by observer1

[mistermack]

38 minutes ago, observer1 said:

even if usa bans beef nothing will happen to india as the total export of beef from india is 3.17 billion and india's gdp is 147.35 trillion. A scratch in comparison

What currency are you quoting? GDP is usually quoted in dollars, and for India GDP that's $3.5 trillion approx.

[swansont]

1 hour ago, mistermack said:

What currency are you quoting? GDP is usually quoted in dollars, and for India GDP that's $3.5 trillion approx.

Or you can use the country’s own currency, the rupee

[mistermack]

1 hour ago, swansont said:

Or you can use the country’s own currency, the rupee

I wondered that, but it's still out by a factor of two for GDP. 

Maybe it's in Rupees, adjusted for purchasing power. It's still well out, but not by so much. It's rare to quote a GDP in anything other than dollars these days. 

[swansont]

56 minutes ago, mistermack said:

I wondered that, but it's still out by a factor of two for GDP. 

Maybe it's in Rupees, adjusted for purchasing power. It's still well out, but not by so much. It's rare to quote a GDP in anything other than dollars these days. 

Depends also on your reference year

 

Real GDP or Gross Domestic Product (GDP) at constant (2011-12) prices … First Revised Estimate of GDP for 2019-20 of ₹ 145.69 lakh crore.

https://statisticstimes.com/economy/country/india-gdp.php

Matches up pretty well.