Planets Magnetic fields

[Ghideon]

51 minutes ago, beecee said:

we observe

Thanks! Since OP seems not too fond of math but prefer observations and experiments you just gave me an idea. I think it might be possible to do some very basic observations to get evidence against "draft" in space, would that help?

Lets say the idea about "draft" for a moving body in space is true. (Hint: it is not) 
Then a comet moving through solar system would have a tail of gas and dust behind it? Just like a semi would on earth
It may be tricky to spot a comet the size of a semi using easily available equipment, but the effect would be same but stronger for a larger one? If you use binoculars* you could see for your self that a comet can have the tail pointing at an angle forward in the direction of travel. When you do that observation @Theredbarron, are you still convinced that your idea holds? Or do you need to research the mainstream science explanation? 
 

*) I haven't checked when the next time for such an event takes place, aerith.net/comet/weekly/current.html might be a place to start

Edited October 23, 2018 by Ghideon
grammar

[beecee]

2 minutes ago, Ghideon said:

 you could see for your self that a comet can have the tail pointing at an angle forward in the direction of travel. When you do that observation @Theredbarron, are you still convinced that your idea holds? Or do you need to research the mainstream science explanation? 

Excellent! I await with bated breath for his reply and that excellent observation.

[Theredbarron]

A gas trail is not the same thing at all. Look at the photo and tell me what force is being applied as it slingshots around. Not only gravity but that other force during obit that pushes you outward acting at the same time. The gas is much easier to manipulate then the comet. Putt it this way why is the gas following the comet at all?

2 hours ago, beecee said:

Excellent! I await with bated breath for his reply and that excellent observation.

 

When something falls to earth doesn't it do the same thing? The speed of the comet makes it keep going around just like an odd shaped orbit. 

It stays in the direction of travel then it begins to move. newtons first law

[Strange]

8 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

Not only gravity but that other force during obit that pushes you outward acting at the same time.

There is no such “other force”

8 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

Putt it this way why is the gas following the comet at all?

It isn’t following it. It is being evaporated from the comet. 

 

[Theredbarron]

The rotation of the sun in that image is whats attracting the comet. 

[Strange]

5 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

The rotation of the sun in that image is whats attracting the comet. 

The rotation of the Sun does not cause gravity. We know this because:

1. we have a theory of gravity
2. that theory is based on mass and distance, not rotation
3. the theory works so rotation is not a factor

Stop making crap up.

[Theredbarron]

7 minutes ago, Strange said:

There is no such “other force”

It isn’t following it. It is being evaporated from the comet. 

 

The speed is the other force.

If follows it as it is evaporating thats why you can see it. The draft part that is happening is right behind the comet. The density of the environment around the comet chooses how bit of an effect it has. So those gases are the effects. It moves to what is attracting it. The rotation of our planet can twist space time but not move air or anything else? Conveniently everything that has gravity in any observable and measurable way is in motion. Its not just the matter that is gravity. The matter is the existence of the electrical properties. The movement of these electrical properties is what create this attraction. Stop the suns rotation and tell me what happens? Everything that is orbiting now has to meat a lower escape velocity. IF the sun slowed too much then everything in our bubble with escape. Same for the planets. 

Just now, Strange said:

The rotation of the Sun does not cause gravity. We know this because:

1. we have a theory of gravity
2. that theory is based on mass and distance, not rotation
3. the theory works so rotation is not a factor

Stop making crap up.

Thats all you have. even your own theory states that the planets rotation twist space time. there is your observation of it. 

[Strange]

1 minute ago, Theredbarron said:

The speed is the other force.

Speed is not a force.

Reported for trolling.

[Theredbarron]

1 minute ago, Strange said:

Speed is not a force.

Reported for trolling.

Momentum my bad. I didn't know I had to teach you that. 

Speed controls orbit

Sorry momentum of the mass thats moving. 

I dont even know what trolling is. 

I never said any of the numbers are wrong. If we have the same numbers then its sort of useless. The acceleration rate of a planet doesn't change just because of the theory. The proof of burden is simply understanding but no its not at all possible so I guess you will just have to wait and see. 

[Strange]

5 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

Momentum my bad. I didn't know I had to teach you that. 

Momentum is not a force.

8 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

I dont even know what trolling is. 

I'm not sure you know what anything is.

 

[Theredbarron]

3 minutes ago, Strange said:

Momentum is not a force.

I'm not sure you know what anything is.

 

 If a semi didn't push the brakes and slammed into a wall then I guess there's no force there. What do you call it?

 

Your the one playing with words. 

Where are the tests on drafting in the main stream world? 

How about when you flush a toilet and it can pull solid liquid and gas just from the movement of matter. Thats called gravity. 

Edited October 23, 2018 by Theredbarron

[beecee]

47 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

A gas trail is not the same thing at all. Look at the photo and tell me what force is being applied as it slingshots around. Not only gravity but that other force during obit that pushes you outward acting at the same time. The gas is much easier to manipulate then the comet. Putt it this way why is the gas following the comet at all?

Huh? What the hell are you on about? Your obtuseness is now way out of hand.

According to your nonsensical mythical approach to physics, the tail of the comet should always be behind in the draft as you have labeled it. That isn't the case because space is mainly a vacuum, and the direction of the tail is controlled by the Solar wind....pretty simple really.

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When something falls to earth doesn't it do the same thing? The speed of the comet makes it keep going around just like an odd shaped orbit. 

Quote

 

Without gravity, an Earth-orbiting satellite would go off into space along a straight line. With gravity, it is pulled back toward the Earth. There is a constant tug-of-war between the satellites tendency to move in a straight line, or momentum, and the tug of gravity pulling it back.

An object's momentum and the force of gravity have to be balanced for an orbit to happen. 

from https://www.nasa.gov/audience/forstudents/5-8/features/orbit_feature_5-8.html

 

 

Quote

It stays in the direction of travel then it begins to move. newtons first law

I believe you are now getting desperate and saying whatever comes into your mind. The parameters that define an orbit has just been given to you.

[Theredbarron]

3 hours ago, beecee said:

Excellent! I await with bated breath for his reply and that excellent observation.

The sun and comet cross paths thats because our entire solar system is traveling in a direction. It might be at an angle but its direction would be towards the top of the image. 

[beecee]

48 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

The rotation of the sun in that image is whats attracting the comet. 

Bullshit. What keeps the comet in orbit is the spacetime curvature caused by the mass of the Sun and which we call gravity. nothing more, nothing less.

2 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

The sun and comet cross paths thats because our entire solar system is traveling in a direction. It might be at an angle but its direction would be towards the top of the image. 

That does not support your nonsensical unevidenced claim one bit. Our entire solar system, controlled by the Sun, is orbiting the galactic center which is governed by the gravity of all the other stellar systems and the SMBH at the core. 

[Theredbarron]

1 minute ago, beecee said:

Huh? What the hell are you on about? Your obtuseness is now way out of hand.

According to your nonsensical mythical approach to physics, the tail of the comet should always be behind in the draft as you have labeled it. That isn't the case because space is mainly a vacuum, and the direction of the tail is controlled by the Solar wind....pretty simple really.

 

I believe you are now getting desperate and saying whatever comes into your mind. The parameters that define an orbit has just been given to you.

The trail is evaporation isn't that what was said? its evaporating due to the reduction in pressure from the exact thing I'm talking about. the draft spot thats behind it.  ITs literally pointing at the direction of travel. I dont get how you can just dismiss newtons law when it applies but you get to use space time wrap and I'm saying that gravity is not space time wrap. If it even says the rotation of earth is twisting space time, the movement is directly related to the attraction of space time. That means they are not the same thing. Waves happen in water too. 

Where the rest of the pattern for the comet?

Rapid changing density only in motion. 

[beecee]

2 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

The trail is evaporation isn't that what was said? its evaporating due to the reduction in pressure from the exact thing I'm talking about. the draft spot thats behind it.  ITs literally pointing at the direction of travel. I dont get how you can just dismiss newtons law when it applies but you get to use space time wrap 

I'm not dismissing Newton's law/s, the facts as shown and evidenced completely refute what you claim by the draft. The direction the tail is pointing changes as the comet orbits and always points away from the Sun, which is at times in the direction from whence the comet is coming from...in front of it. Is being so obtuse the only answer you have to being totally wrong? Is it that hard to admit and accept you are wrong?

Quote

and I'm saying that gravity is not space time wrap. If it even says the rotation of earth is twisting space time, the movement is directly related to the attraction of space time. That means they are not the same thing. Waves happen in water too. 

I'm afraid I've just had another "huh?" moment. The twisting of spacetime is related to the rotation of the Earth, and is simply a variation in the geometry of the spacetime curvature caused by the mass...and it certainly adds nothing to you silly claims. 

[Theredbarron]

1 minute ago, beecee said:

I'm not dismissing Newton's law/s, the facts as shown and evidenced completely refute what you claim by the draft. The direction the tail is pointing changes as the comet orbits and always points away from the Sun, which is at times in the direction from whence the comet is coming from...in front of it. Is being so obtuse the only answer you have to being totally wrong? Is it that hard to admit and accept you are wrong?

I'm afraid I've just had another "huh?" moment. The twisting of spacetime is related to the rotation of the Earth, and is simply a variation in the geometry of the spacetime curvature caused by the mass...and it certainly adds nothing to you silly claims. 

Are you saying the tail is pointing in the direction or its the tail of the direction? The spot that I'm referring to is behind it. That means the rear side of travel. I'm not sure if I clarified that just so you dont think I'm changing my words. The tail is the rear. So we are talking about the same thing. 

Is it just simply the geometry of space time, really? So forget that all of it is moving and it doesn't matter. That sounds like it was ignored. Mine can be created which I have demonstrated but just putting something near something doesn't attract it. So explain why motion is ignored?

Forget everything I said and explain why motion is not part of it? Dont give me the reason you think gravity is. Give me the information that take motion out of the picture undoubtedly so that I can actually research it instead talking to a human as to avoid influence. 

[beecee]

5 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

Are you saying the tail is pointing in the direction or its the tail of the direction? The spot that I'm referring to is behind it. That means the rear side of travel. I'm not sure if I clarified that just so you dont think I'm changing my words. The tail is the rear. So we are talking about the same thing. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comet_tail

A comet tail—and coma—are features visible in comets when they are illuminated by the Sun and may become visible from Earth when a comet passes through the inner Solar System. As a comet approaches the inner Solar System, solar radiation causes the volatile materials within the comet to vaporize and stream out of the nucleus, carrying dust away with them. Separate tails are formed of dust and gases, becoming visible through different phenomena; the dust reflects sunlight directly and the gases glow from ionisation. Most comets are too faint to be visible without the aid of a telescope, but a few each decade become bright enough to be visible to .  

A comet's orbit showing the different directions of the gas and dust tails as the comet passes the Sun.

NB:  Please note [in first photo] the direction of the tail in relation to the direction of the orbit and the fact that it has nothing to do with any draft.

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Is it just simply the geometry of space time, really? So forget that all of it is moving and it doesn't matter. That sounds like it was ignored. Mine can be created which I have demonstrated but just putting something near something doesn't attract it. So explain why motion is ignored?

Gravity is the geometry of spacetime. Motion is not ignored. The spacetime curvature associated with any mass, obviously and logically, travels along with the mass and its motion. 

Quote

Forget everything I said and explain why motion is not part of it? Dont give me the reason you think gravity is. Give me the information that take motion out of the picture undoubtedly so that I can actually research it instead talking to a human as to avoid influence

I already have. A suggestion though...instead of pretending you are Einstein or Newton, and are competent enough to undergo any research, please make yourself familiar with the model or theory/s you are trying to invalidate. It's been 300 years since Newton proposed his gravitational and motion laws and theories, and a 100 years since Einstein gave us a more accurate description of gravity...You have a lot to learn.

26 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

 The tail is the rear.  

NO...The tail/s can be in any position as governed by its relative position in relation to the Sun!

[Theredbarron]

47 minutes ago, beecee said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comet_tail

A comet tail—and coma—are features visible in comets when they are illuminated by the Sun and may become visible from Earth when a comet passes through the inner Solar System. As a comet approaches the inner Solar System, solar radiation causes the volatile materials within the comet to vaporize and stream out of the nucleus, carrying dust away with them. Separate tails are formed of dust and gases, becoming visible through different phenomena; the dust reflects sunlight directly and the gases glow from ionisation. Most comets are too faint to be visible without the aid of a telescope, but a few each decade become bright enough to be visible to .  

A comet's orbit showing the different directions of the gas and dust tails as the comet passes the Sun.

NB:  Please note [in first photo] the direction of the tail in relation to the direction of the orbit and the fact that it has nothing to do with any draft.

Gravity is the geometry of spacetime. Motion is not ignored. The spacetime curvature associated with any mass, obviously and logically, travels along with the mass and its motion. 

I already have. A suggestion though...instead of pretending you are Einstein or Newton, and are competent enough to undergo any research, please make yourself familiar with the model or theory/s you are trying to invalidate. It's been 300 years since Newton proposed his gravitational and motion laws and theories, and a 100 years since Einstein gave us a more accurate description of gravity...You have a lot to learn.

NO...The tail/s can be in any position as governed by its relative position in relation to the Sun!

Gas trail is lower density then the dust trail. As the comet is pulled to the sun its as if its turning giving the appearance as falling if your perspective is from standing the surface of the sun. Do you understand rocket science? The gas is more in line with the direction of travel as you can see its always pointing at the sun comet first. The dust trail is more dense so it doesn't get pulled by the comet as easy as the gas. The gas is showing the change in density trailing its motion. So it is as if its in a drift across space like a car in a drift that orbits the sun. The comet is moving pretty fast I might add so a semi doesn't quite compare. 

You call it a trail even. What else does that mean?

He just gave you it? I'm confused are you still trying to solve it or is it complete?

Edited October 24, 2018 by Theredbarron

[beecee]

24 minutes ago, Theredbarron said:

Gas trail is lower density then the dust trail. As the comet is pulled to the sun its as if its turning giving the appearance as falling if your perspective is from standing the surface of the sun. Do you understand rocket science? The gas is more in line with the direction of travel as you can see its always pointing at the sun comet first. The dust trail is more dense so it doesn't get pulled by the comet as easy as the gas. The gas is showing the change in density trailing its motion. So it is as if its in a drift across space like a car in a drift that orbits the sun. The comet is moving pretty fast I might add so a semi doesn't quite compare. 

You call it a trail even. What else does that mean?

bullshit and avoiding the bone of contention. 

https://www.quora.com/What-happens-to-the-tail-of-a-comet-when-it-moves-far-away-from-the-Sun

There are usually two tails to a comet. More on that in a moment.

As the comet moves farther away from the sun, the heat from sunlight falling on the surface of the comet diminishes. The conversion of ice and other frozen liquids to gasses due to the sun’s heating slows down and eventually stops altogether until the comet swings around to approach the sun again.

It’s this outgassing that pushes dust, rocks, other small pieces of ice etc. out behind the comet forming a tail that extends in the opposite direction of the comet’s path. If you can see a comet with the naked eye, this is the tail that you see.

The second tail is made up of some of the ionized gasses that pushed the solid debris out to form the first tail. This tail of ionized gasses interacts with the sun’s magnetic field and always points away from the sun, regardless of the comet’s path. This tail is harder to see without a telescope, but some have reported seeing it with the naked eye in ideal viewing locales with an energetic comet.

And of course the tail of a comet at aphelion can be non existent. 

 

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The gas is more in line with the direction of travel as you can see its always pointing at the sun comet first.

The tail/s of a comet is always pointing away from the Sun for the reasons as described in the links I have given you...even when the comet is moving directly away from the Sun, which absolutely invalidates your mythical claims.

Edited October 24, 2018 by beecee

[Theredbarron]

2 minutes ago, beecee said:

bullshit and avoiding the bone of contention. 

https://www.quora.com/What-happens-to-the-tail-of-a-comet-when-it-moves-far-away-from-the-Sun

There are usually two tails to a comet. More on that in a moment.

As the comet moves farther away from the sun, the heat from sunlight falling on the surface of the comet diminishes. The conversion of ice and other frozen liquids to gasses due to the sun’s heating slows down and eventually stops altogether until the comet swings around to approach the sun again.

It’s this outgassing that pushes dust, rocks, other small pieces of ice etc. out behind the comet forming a tail that extends in the opposite direction of the comet’s path. If you can see a comet with the naked eye, this is the tail that you see.

The second tail is made up of some of the ionized gasses that pushed the solid debris out to form the first tail. This tail of ionized gasses interacts with the sun’s magnetic field and always points away from the sun, regardless of the comet’s path. This tail is harder to see without a telescope, but some have reported seeing it with the naked eye in ideal viewing locales with an energetic comet.

And of course the tail of a comet at aphelion can be non existent. 

 

 

 

Wow. You dont even read what I'm putting do you. That first part you said. Moves! What happens when it stops? Do the tails do the same thing? Why doesn't the dust part actually cover the comets path? The motion relative to space not the sun alone. Remember the heliosphere. 

[hypervalent_iodine]

!

Moderator Note

Theredbarron, I think other members have shown you quite conclusively the ways in which you are incorrect in your thinking. Your refusal to engage meaningfully with their points has gotten tiresome. As such, staff have decided this thread is done.