If Electricity...

[DARK0717]

If electricity likes to shoot out of pointed things or the sharp edges of things, then what shape or geometrical figure does it like to go into?

Edited March 29, 2019 by DARK0717

[QuantumT]

18 minutes ago, DARK0717 said:

If electricity likes to shoot out of pointed things or the sharp edges of things, then what shape or geometrical figure does it like to go into?

Electricity does not care about the shape, only about the path of least resistance.

[studiot]

43 minutes ago, DARK0717 said:

If electricity likes to shoot out of pointed things or the sharp edges of things, then what shape or geometrical figure does it like to go into?

Really or just sometimes?

What kind of point sharp centre is in this ball?

24 minutes ago, QuantumT said:

Electricity does not care about the shape, only about the path of least resistance.

 

Perhaps you would like to expand on this as things are really more complicated.

Edited March 29, 2019 by studiot

[swansont]

25 minutes ago, QuantumT said:

Electricity does not care about the shape, only about the path of least resistance.

This is quite wrong.

1 minute ago, studiot said:

Really ?

What kind of point sharp cnetre is in this ball?

Electricity “liking” to “shoot out” of sharp points is not the same as claiming a point is required for a discharge.

[QuantumT]

11 minutes ago, studiot said:

Perhaps you would like to expand on this as things are really more complicated.

10 minutes ago, swansont said:

This is quite wrong.

I know the behavior of electricity, but the question was very specific, and I gave an equally specific answer.
I'd rather elaborate gradually than give a long lecture.

[Ten oz]

1 hour ago, DARK0717 said:

If electricity likes to shoot out of pointed things or the sharp edges of things, then what shape or geometrical figure does it like to go into?

Electrons orbit the atomic nucleusis. Different electrons orbit at different distances creating shells. The Valence Shell is the outer most electron shell around an atom. Atoms with Valence shells of 1 or 2 electrons are good conductors of electricity because an electron in a valence shell of 1 or 2 can be more easily dislodged allowing for electron flow. Atoms with valence shells consisting of 3-5 electrons are insulators. Their electrons are not easily dislodged which hinders electron flow. A valence shell of 1 is the best conductor and of 5 is the best insulator. 

Electricity is made of negatively charged electrons. They move to ground because it is positively charged. The electricity moves via the path of least resistance and as described above least resistance is determined by the valance shell of atoms.  

It doesn't matter how sharp an insulator is electricity won't like to "shoot out" of it. Likewise it does matter how dull or sharp a conductor is electricity will like to "go into" it. 

[swansont]

3 hours ago, Ten oz said:

It doesn't matter how sharp an insulator is electricity won't like to "shoot out" of it. Likewise it does matter how dull or sharp a conductor is electricity will like to "go into" it. 

That’s not the case, and why limit yourself to insulators?

Charges like to spread out, to minimize the potential energy of the system. You can’t have as much charge on a sharp point, or put another way, it would take a higher potential to put more charge there. So all else being equal (as in, the amount of stored charge), pointy structures tend to discharge more easily. Maximizing surface area reduces the energy.

Another factor is that points tends to stick up, and so are possibly closer to another point, at a different potential, to where they might discharge.

[studiot]

4 hours ago, DARK0717 said:

If electricity likes to shoot out of pointed things or the sharp edges of things, then what shape or geometrical figure does it like to go into?

In all fairness I meant to do this before.

+1 for what is really a good and thoughtful Physics question.

 

[Ten oz]

12 minutes ago, swansont said:

That’s not the case, and why limit yourself to insulators?

Charges like to spread out, to minimize the potential energy of the system. You can’t have as much charge on a sharp point, or put another way, it would take a higher potential to put more charge there. So all else being equal (as in, the amount of stored charge), pointy structures tend to discharge more easily. Maximizing surface area reduces the energy.

Another factor is that points tends to stick up, and so are possibly closer to another point, at a different potential, to where they might discharge.

I limited it to address the specific idea that shape matters with the most brevity. I assume, perhaps incorrectly but it remains to be seen, that Dark0717 doesn't know the basics. 

[DARK0717]

if u guys are still confused about my question, what i really meant is that electricity is more likely to discharge out off pointy things (or the pointiest part of something, it doesnt have to be specifially sharp). If it exits out off pointy things easily, then what shape or figure does it enter something easily?

Think of it as when you touch a few million volts of low amps and you point out your finger, electricity will want to discharge out off your finger and stop discharging out off your hair.

For example, if I want to direct electricity in a coil to one specific direction, then i will make it pass through, lets say a pyramidal shape conductor, and the will get discharged out of the tip. But then I want to somehow absorb that electricity, then what shape would I use to absorb the electricity just as easily discharging it off a pointy shape? Round perhaps? or Flat? or what?

If you guys want my reason why im asking, well, my idea may be too ambitious and kinda dumb but Im thinking of how wireless electricity could be really real. 1st part is filling/overloading the atmosphere with electricity using the earth's charge (if it would be possible)by stabbing the earth with a giant spike, with the pointy end facing the sky, but then how to receive it? Traditional antennas wont work as it would just serve as a discharge of electricity of whatever device its connected to. Or maybe not just wireless electricity, but to maybe redirect electricity or even lightning to one specific area or additional safety to areas where thunderstorms are frequent as lighting would want to hit THAT instead of people or house antennas.

Edited March 29, 2019 by DARK0717

[Endy0816]

5 hours ago, DARK0717 said:

if u guys are still confused about my question, what i really meant is that electricity is more likely to discharge out off pointy things (or the pointiest part of something, it doesnt have to be specifially sharp). If it exits out off pointy things easily, then what shape or figure does it enter something easily?

Think of it as when you touch a few million volts of low amps and you point out your finger, electricity will want to discharge out off your finger and stop discharging out off your hair.

For example, if I want to direct electricity in a coil to one specific direction, then i will make it pass through, lets say a pyramidal shape conductor, and the will get discharged out of the tip. But then I want to somehow absorb that electricity, then what shape would I use to absorb the electricity just as easily discharging it off a pointy shape? Round perhaps? or Flat? or what?

If you guys want my reason why im asking, well, my idea may be too ambitious and kinda dumb but Im thinking of how wireless electricity could be really real. 1st part is filling/overloading the atmosphere with electricity using the earth's charge (if it would be possible)by stabbing the earth with a giant spike, with the pointy end facing the sky, but then how to receive it? Traditional antennas wont work as it would just serve as a discharge of electricity of whatever device its connected to. Or maybe not just wireless electricity, but to maybe redirect electricity or even lightning to one specific area or additional safety to areas where thunderstorms are frequent as lighting would want to hit THAT instead of people or house antennas.

That's the idea behind lightning rods. Very common where I'm at in Florida.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_rod

Note it is based on charge density. Earth has a charge itself wanting to meet up.

You can transfer electricity wirelessly but the more you try and transfer the larger the costs.

Round is ideal for storing. Can see this in a Van de Graff generator.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_de_Graaff_generator

 

[DARK0717]

4 hours ago, Endy0816 said:

That's the idea behind lightning rods. Very common where I'm at in Florida.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_rod

Note it is based on charge density. Earth has a charge itself wanting to meet up.

You can transfer electricity wirelessly but the more you try and transfer the larger the costs.

Round is ideal for storing. Can see this in a Van de Graff generator.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_de_Graaff_generator

 

so i guess, based on what you said, in terms of attracting electricity via storing a different charge, then round is the best.

[Sensei]

16 hours ago, DARK0717 said:

If electricity likes to shoot out of pointed things or the sharp edges of things, then what shape or geometrical figure does it like to go into?

You're talking about static electric charge e.g. electrons gathered on some surface, like metal or so.. while the opposite side have "holes", misses electrons..

If you will make (in uniform medium) array of sharp wires pointing at +x axis,

and on the opposite side, make array of sharp wires pointing at -x axis direction..

then electrons will flow between one sharp wire to the second sharp wire, as it's the most optimal path of travel for them..

 

16 hours ago, studiot said:

Really or just sometimes?

What kind of point sharp centre is in this ball? 

..when there is discharge, electrons flow from one side to the another side.. that side is heated.. resistance of medium and resistance of material is variable vs temperature.. so the next time, when electrons will gather, they are flying slightly different path.. Previous optimal path is no more the most optimal path, as it has higher resistance caused by heated medium and heated material at the end of path..

 

[studiot]

2 hours ago, Sensei said:

 

..when there is discharge, electrons flow from one side to the another side.. that side is heated.. resistance of medium and resistance of material is variable vs temperature.. so the next time, when electrons will gather, they are flying slightly different path.. Previous optimal path is no more the most optimal path, as it has higher resistance caused by heated medium and heated material at the end of path..

 

Not sure I understand the connection ?

[John Cuthber]

The simple answer is "flat things"- things with large radii of curvature.

[DARK0717]

14 hours ago, John Cuthber said:

The simple answer is "flat things"- things with large radii of curvature.

thats it, thats what im looking for, Thank You, but would you mind explaining why?

[MigL]

Swansont already has.
Electrons ( and other charges ) repel one another, and like to 'spread out'.
IOW, they seek the lowest energy state, by maximizing separation.

[swansont]

If the target was pointy, a few charges would transfer and owing to the concentration of charges, you would raise the potential quite a lot. This would inhibit further discharge until those charges could dissipate.

[Chris S]

 

On Sunday, March 31, 2019 at 12:02 PM, swansont said:

If the target was pointy, a few charges would transfer and owing to the concentration of charges, you would raise the potential quite a lot. This would inhibit further discharge until those charges could dissipate.

Not if the receive path was conductive.

Edited May 5, 2019 by Chris S

[swansont]

6 hours ago, Chris S said:

 

Not if the receive path was conductive.

Charges on a conductor reside on the surface. As it charges up, the potential difference between it and the source will decrease. As I have already stated.