Wulphstein Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 My true motive is to talk to somebody. I have no one else to talk to. I'm on a month suspension for calling an atheist on Facebook... woo, twice!!! He claimed I was personally attacking him! Well, anyway, I just came back from ... with the word Yahawa, ancient Hebrew name of God. I looked it up on the internet and found this link. https://yahawah-is.blogspot.com/ I'm not trying preach to anyone and I'm not trying to threaten anyone or make you feel uncomfortable. I have argued scientifically that a Creator is required to create the physical laws of this universe. The fact that I hear the name Yahawah, one can infer that the Ancient Hebrew God Yahawah created the universe or claims to have created the universe. One can possibly infer that the universe was created by a Jew, maybe. You're not being threatened with hellfire, that wasn't the message. It was more like, for your information, not only was the universe created, but it was created by a Jew. Just thought you'd like to know. -1
Strange Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 The idea that yahweh was the creator is a relatively late idea, dating from when the Israelites became monotheistic (and so, having only one god, that god presumably had to also be the creator god). Quote n the oldest biblical literature, Yahweh is a typical ancient Near Eastern "divine warrior", who leads the heavenly army against Israel's enemies;[9] he later became the main god of the Kingdom of Israel (Samaria) and of Judah,[10] and over time the royal court and Temple in Jerusalem promoted Yahweh as the god of the entire cosmos, possessing all the positive qualities previously attributed to the other gods and goddesses.[11][12] By the end of the Babylonian captivity (6th century BCE), the very existence of foreign gods was denied, and Yahweh was proclaimed as the creator of the cosmos and the true god of all the world.[12] Quote Pre-exilic Israel, like its neighbours, was polytheistic,[65] and Israelite monotheism was the result of unique historical circumstances.[66] The original god of Israel was El, as the name demonstrates—its probable meaning is "may El rule" or some other sentence-form involving the name of El.[67] In the early tribal period, each tribe would have had its own patron god; when kingship emerged, the state promoted Yahweh as the national god of Israel, supreme over the other gods, and gradually Yahweh absorbed all the positive traits of the other gods and goddesses.[12] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahweh 1
QuantumT Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 The first name of the jewish gods was Elohim. It translates: The gods who are both male and female. It was not until later they decided to have one god only, and call him Jahve or Yahweh. -1
Phi for All Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 44 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: I have argued scientifically that a Creator is required to create the physical laws of this universe. Not successfully. Your arguments are similar to a puddle's argument that the world fits it perfectly. 44 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: It was more like, for your information, not only was the universe created, but it was created by a Jew. Just thought you'd like to know. I have no reason at all to trust your guesswork. This doesn't even make semantic sense, since the worshippers of a god don't necessarily define it. Mars and Ares were the same god, so was Mars Roman and Ares Greek? 1
Amazing Random Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) First of all , God doesnt exist until proven otherwise . Only science exists for the time being . God can be an entity made by humans for the explanation of the unexplainable . The one who believes in God is as fool as any theories in science which are not verified experimentally. But the unexplainable may become explainable in the future . Or God exists to make us be moral . Or he exists because we dont want to feel alone as a species . God is pure psychology. Edited August 3, 2019 by Amazing Random -1
FreeWill Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Amazing Random said: God doesnt exist until proven otherwise . The earth was round even it wasn't proven until the 15th century. The earth was not flat even taught to be and recognized so by the majority those times. The existence of God is independent from whether you can proove it or not. Edited August 3, 2019 by FreeWill
Amazing Random Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 1 minute ago, FreeWill said: The earth was round even it wasn't proven until the 15th century. The earth was not flat even taught to be and recognized so by the majority. The existence of God is independent from whether you can proove it or not. No everything must be tested . Since we cant test if there is God , there isnt. -1
Strange Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, FreeWill said: The earth was not flat even taught to be and recognized so by the majority. The majority have never thought the Earth is flat.
FreeWill Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, Strange said: The majority have never thought the Earth is flat. there were times when they did: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth Can you support your affirmation?
swansont Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 9 minutes ago, FreeWill said: The earth was round even it wasn't proven until the 15th century. Eratosthenes showed it was round ca 240 BC by measuring its circumference. The Greeks already knew it was spherical https://www.aps.org/publications/apsnews/200606/history.cfm 2
FreeWill Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) 56 minutes ago, swansont said: Eratosthenes showed it was round ca 240 BC Still was not proven until Magellan arrived back to Spain in 1522. His recognition was right and the majority were wrong for millennia, until the theory was certified. God could exist even we can not verify it currently. Edited August 3, 2019 by FreeWill
swansont Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 13 minutes ago, FreeWill said: Still was not prooven until Magellan arrived back to Spain in 1522. Bollocks. There is no “proven” (much less prooven), there is evidence. You are artificially narrowing what evidence you will accept. That’s inconsistent with intellectual honesty
FreeWill Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 7 minutes ago, swansont said: Bollocks. There is no “proven” (much less prooven), there is evidence. You are artificially narrowing what evidence you will accept. That’s inconsistent with intellectual honesty Evidence were always there but until someone did not execute the trip around the globe based the theory, it is not proven. Why something can not be proven? Is it proven that 1+1=2 or we have just have strong evidence for that?
swansont Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, FreeWill said: Evidence were always there but until someone did not execute the trip around the globe based the theory, it is not proven. Again, bollocks. 2 minutes ago, FreeWill said: Why something can not be proven? Science is inductive. You can accumulate evidence to support a model, but you cant do a deductive proof. 2 minutes ago, FreeWill said: Is it proven that 1+1=2 or we have just have strong evidence for that? That’s math, not physics.
Wulphstein Posted August 3, 2019 Author Posted August 3, 2019 I made sound arguments that it takes a creator, a planner, an engineer and a mathematician to create a physics model of how to set physics constants, and how to implement the physical universe with light (virtual photons and real photons) in a way that thermodynamically and inevitably leads to little molecular machines that lead to life that evolves from prokaryotes to eukaryotes to multicellular life forms to fish to reptiles to mammals to hairy apes to humans. But it takes a deity to actually make it happen. If you don't understand my well constructed arguments, it's not because I didn't make a good argument. I have verified my argument with people who have powerful troublelshooting skills, powerful engineering skills, people who can navigate their way through the technical universe. If you don't understand my argument, it's because you don't want to. 1 hour ago, Amazing Random said: No everything must be tested . Since we cant test if there is God , there isnt. People who can't fit a square peg into a square hole are not able to see the evidence of GOD. People who can't see outside the bandwidth of their own little contrived universe of "whatever goes on in your head" can't find evidence of God or anything. The evidence is there, you just can't see it or you can't understand it. 1 hour ago, QuantumT said: The first name of the jewish gods was Elohim. It translates: The gods who are both male and female. It was not until later they decided to have one god only, and call him Jahve or Yahweh. Did you make that up? Prove to me that the Jews were polytheists. They never were. -1
FreeWill Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 34 minutes ago, swansont said: There is no “proven” (much less prooven), there is evidence. Can you support this affirmation with evidence?
swansont Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 Just now, FreeWill said: Can you support this affirmation with evidence? It’s called science. You should become acquainted with it. 1
Strange Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 8 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: Prove to me that the Jews were polytheists. They never were. See the (well referenced) Wikipedia article on Yahweh. I assumed everyone knew this. And the fact he used to be married! 1
Wulphstein Posted August 3, 2019 Author Posted August 3, 2019 1 minute ago, swansont said: It’s called science. You should become acquainted with it. What's it called when people face reality, when they stop hiding behind "logical fallacies" and absolute physics constants that are set to 1, and actually figure out how the physical universe is being implemented (like what is time, what is space, what causes the invariance of the speed of light, so that they can actually get around to inventing anti-gravity? Because the practioners of "science" aren't doing it. -1
Phi for All Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 8 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: I made sound arguments that it takes a creator, a planner, an engineer and a mathematician to create a physics model of how to set physics constants, and how to implement the physical universe with light (virtual photons and real photons) in a way that thermodynamically and inevitably leads to little molecular machines that lead to life that evolves from prokaryotes to eukaryotes to multicellular life forms to fish to reptiles to mammals to hairy apes to humans. But it takes a deity to actually make it happen. If you don't understand my well constructed arguments, it's not because I didn't make a good argument. I have verified my argument with people who have powerful troublelshooting skills, powerful engineering skills, people who can navigate their way through the technical universe. If you don't understand my argument, it's because you don't want to. You certainly didn't persuade anyone here, so you didn't make any sound arguments. You've convinced yourself you did, and now are just soapboxing. You aren't listening, or learning, or teaching anybody anything. Its easy to make things up, and call anyone who agrees with you "powerful". 1
beecee Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, FreeWill said: Can you support this affirmation with evidence? A scientific theory is as good as it gets. The goal of science is constructing models that align with evidence of our observations and explains the results of our experiments. We are not able to test GR or any model in any part of the universe or in any and all conditions, we can only test it within a range allowed for by present technology. Theories of course do grow in certainty over time, and as they continue to match the evidence. For that reason/s, any real truth and/or reality is not the scientific goal, if it is at all obtainable.
Strange Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 16 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: I made sound arguments that it takes a creator You simply asserted this without evidence. You didn't even bother with the usual Creationist "it looks designed so it must be" twaddle.
beecee Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 5 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: What's it called when people face reality, when they stop hiding behind "logical fallacies" and absolute physics constants that are set to 1, and actually figure out how the physical universe is being implemented (like what is time, what is space, what causes the invariance of the speed of light, so that they can actually get around to inventing anti-gravity? Because the practioners of "science" aren't doing it. Are you suggesting a "god of the gaps" solution for the areas of science where we have gaps in our knowledge?
Wulphstein Posted August 3, 2019 Author Posted August 3, 2019 4 minutes ago, Phi for All said: You certainly didn't persuade anyone here, so you didn't make any sound arguments. You've convinced yourself you did, and now are just soapboxing. You aren't listening, or learning, or teaching anybody anything. Its easy to make things up, and call anyone who agrees with you "powerful". You have been brainwashed to say "I don't know how the universe got here. Maybe Thor did it!". It's total brainwashing! You atheist scientists can't explain consciousness or duplicate it. But you are brainwashed to believe people's experiences are false. That's not reason, that's brainwashing! The question is: what reinforces the brainwashing? You atheists have been trained to automatically use words like "crackpottery", "god of the gaps". You have been trained to be atheists because your reactions are predictable. You are trained to say "I dunno how we got here by accident, but it wasn't GOD". I could list all of the tropes and tricks in your atheist bag. Because it's not reasonable to think that consciousness can emerge from molecular machines by accident or without planning. That is not reasonable. That is brainwashing. -1
Strange Posted August 3, 2019 Posted August 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: You have been brainwashed to say "I don't know how the universe got here. That is not brainwashing. It is just rationality. 2 minutes ago, Wulphstein said: But you are brainwashed to believe people's experiences are false. Who said anyone's experience are false? You truly are a master of non-sequiturs and logical fallacies.
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