What is the Purpose of Life ?

[dimreepr]

  On 6/10/2021 at 12:01 PM, Goude said:

I do believe life has a purpose, but it is not religion. I think there is a greater reality out there and our physical lives are only a small part of it. So I am excited about what I learn from life. On 60 minutes last week there was a segment on dementia with new findings that changed everything. I love knowledge and study it. I like to read about things I don't agree with or understand the most.

Expand  

Have you read the previous 6 page's of this thread?

Because we seem to be going round in circles.

The only purpose of life is to live and that's only on an individual bases; the universe expands but that's not it's purpose, it's merely the stage for you to find your purpose, much like religion/culture.

An NDE is also a personal experience, there was nothing magical about mine.

Gathering knowledge doesn't automatically confer understanding,

[Goude]

  On 6/10/2021 at 12:22 PM, dimreepr said:

Have you read the previous 6 page's of this thread?

Because we seem to be going round in circles.

The only purpose of life is to live and that's only on an individual bases; the universe expands but that's not it's purpose, it's merely the stage for you to find your purpose, much like religion/culture.

An NDE is also a personal experience, there was nothing magical about mine.

Gathering knowledge doesn't automatically confer understanding,

Expand  

No, I have not read every post in this thread. But I never expect people to totally agree on any question. Yes, a NDE is personal and can only be fully accepted by the person experiencing it. Mine was like someone opening a window. I saw there was more to life than the house I lived in. I saw no religious aspects, no judgments,  no punishments, a very pleasant event.

I would love to hear the details of your NDE very much. Should a new thread be started?

Thanks for answering my posts, and the last line of yours is so true. Understanding is a horse of a different color. Much harder to ride.

[Cooper]

To simply be is the purpose of everything ? Everything there is exist because it is possible to exist , so to be is the reason we are here .

[beecee]

  On 6/10/2021 at 12:22 PM, dimreepr said:

An NDE is also a personal experience, there was nothing magical about mine.

Expand  

Nor mine when as a teenage I fell of a second story balcony, or the time I was bowled arse over head by a motor vehicle....

Seriously probably the nearest "death like" experience I have realy had was when under general anaesthetic for a procedure...It was like a slice out of my life...no memory, no recall, no feeling, just blank. I imagine death like that.

 

We are a product of evolution to a stage where we are able to reason, think logically [some of us] have feelings, love, hate, etc

Edited June 11, 2021 by beecee

[Goude]

  On 6/11/2021 at 9:31 PM, beecee said:

Nor mine when as a teenage I fell of a second story balcony, or the time I was bowled arse over head by a motor vehicle....

Seriously probably the nearest "death like" experience I have realy had was when under general anaesthetic for a procedure...It was like a slice out of my life...no memory, no recall, no feeling, just blank. I imagine death like that.

 

We are a product of evolution to a stage where we are able to reason, think logically [some of us] have feelings, love, hate, etc

Expand  

Those experiences would have been very scary. I didn't remember anything during my heart surgery either. When I had a heart attack and found myself without my body was my NDE. The only time in my life when I heard someone talking in my head asking me if I wanted to continue living or go on. Something you never forget. That is why I believe in a greater reality than just our physical lives. It seems so useless to learn and work a whole lifetime and then vanish from existence.  I appreciate your comments. Thanks

[dimreepr]

  On 6/12/2021 at 12:01 PM, Goude said:

Those experiences would have been very scary. I didn't remember anything during my heart surgery either. When I had a heart attack and found myself without my body was my NDE. The only time in my life when I heard someone talking in my head asking me if I wanted to continue living or go on. Something you never forget. That is why I believe in a greater reality than just our physical lives. It seems so useless to learn and work a whole lifetime and then vanish from existence.

Expand  

Only if you spend your life in useless pursuit's... 😉 

For instance, looking forward to a perfect holiday, and having it spoiled because of a stain on the lawn?

[Goude]

  On 6/12/2021 at 1:03 PM, dimreepr said:

Only if you spend your life in useless pursuit's... 😉 

For instance, looking forward to a perfect holiday, and having it spoiled because of a stain on the lawn?

Expand  

I sometimes deal with suicidal people. They feel life is useless, I try to give them hope, 30-40 years ago NDEs were taught in college and to groups of suicidal people with some good results. There is a large amount of material. Too bad about its status today. It could help many find hope and meaning in life.

[Prometheus]

  On 6/12/2021 at 3:51 PM, Goude said:

I try to give them hope, 30-40 years ago NDEs were taught in college and to groups of suicidal people with some good results. There is a large amount of material. Too bad about its status today. It could help many find hope and meaning in life.

Expand  

The same effect can be achieved with DMT. The way clinical trials are proceeding it shouldn't be too long before it is available for a number of conditions, including depression.

[Goude]

  On 6/12/2021 at 4:04 PM, Prometheus said:

The same effect can be achieved with DMT. The way clinical trials are proceeding it shouldn't be too long before it is available for a number of conditions, including depression.

Expand  

I don't think N,N-Dimethyltryptamine is a legal drug. No? I know drugs can make you feel good, but they do nothing to change your belief system. NDEs are more than feel good, they teach you things unknown. I will show a video of one here and I hope it is OK. If not just delete it.

Pam reynolds' NDE

[iNow]

  On 6/12/2021 at 8:22 PM, Goude said:

don't think N,N-Dimethyltryptamine is a legal drug. No? I know drugs can make you feel good, but they do nothing to change your belief system.

Expand  

You need to stop thinking of your opinions as facts and look into the tremendous and lasting therapeutic benefits DMT and MDNA are having on depression as documented for years in scientific literature. It has nothing to do with getting high or legality. It has to do with efficacy and positive results. 

[Prometheus]

  On 6/12/2021 at 8:22 PM, Goude said:

I know drugs can make you feel good, but they do nothing to change your belief system. NDEs are more than feel good, they teach you things unknown.

Expand  

People's reported experiences with DMT, and other psychedelics, are every bit as profound as as those reported during NDEs. Read the link i provided above if you're interested.

[Goude]

  On 6/12/2021 at 8:44 PM, iNow said:

You need to stop thinking of your opinions as facts and look into the tremendous and lasting therapeutic benefits DMT and MDNA are having on depression as documented for years in scientific literature. It has nothing to do with getting high or legality. It has to do with efficacy and positive results. 

Expand  

We must be reading about different drugs. I have read about them for years and did not get that impression. They produce some very bad things as well as pleasant But still do not have the power to change lives like NDEs do.

 

  On 6/12/2021 at 8:44 PM, iNow said:

You need to stop thinking of your opinions as facts and look into the tremendous and lasting therapeutic benefits DMT and MDNA are having on depression as documented for years in scientific literature. It has nothing to do with getting high or legality. It has to do with efficacy and positive results. 

Expand  

It is not just my opinion, it is my personal experience. I have read about the drugs for years and didn't get that from the material. Please view the video and listen to what the Doctor said about it. I don't want to argue. It is something for each person to learn about individually.

[iNow]

  On 6/12/2021 at 9:42 PM, Goude said:

I don't want to argue

Expand  

That’s bound to happen when you make claims that are refuted by evidence, or when you suggest your personal incredulity alone is reason enough to reject said evidence. 

[Goude]

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:25 AM, iNow said:

That’s bound to happen when you make claims that are refuted by evidence, or when you suggest your personal incredulity alone is reason enough to reject said evidence. 

Expand  

I am sorry. I thought it could be discussed in a calm manner. The evidence is clear and strong . The video is only one of many, many events. Yes, I do believe what I have experienced, most people do. Watch the video and remember it is only one of hundreds. We need to discuss the video.

[zapatos]

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

I am sorry. I thought it could be discussed in a calm manner. 

Expand  

Who isn't calm?

[iNow]

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

sorry. I thought it could be discussed in a calm manner.

Expand  

Who’s not calm?

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

The video is only one of many, many events.

Expand  

Yes, this is called an anecdote, not evidence. 
 

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

Yes, I do believe what I have experienced, most people do

Expand  

This was never in question. What IS in question is why you seem to think that’s in any way relevant, or that it’s somehow good enough to convince others that the decades of research on this topic are wrong. 
 

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

Watch the video and remember it is only one of hundreds. We need to discuss the video.

Expand  

What about it?

Also, see 2.7:

https://www.scienceforums.net/guidelines/

  Quote

Links, pictures and videos in posts should be relevant to the discussion, and members should be able to participate in the discussion without clicking any links or watching any videos. Videos and pictures should be accompanied by enough text to set the tone for the discussion, and should not be posted alone.

Expand  

X-posted with Zap who literally said the EXACT same thing 😂 

[Prometheus]

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

We need to discuss the video.

Expand  

It's a bit disingenuous to ask people to click your link when it's clear you haven't read the linked article for the counter argument.

Especially when your 'evidence' is a youtube video, and the evidence you ignore is a peer reviewed academic paper in a psychology journal.

[Goude]

I tried to show something beautiful, but they cared not look.

[dimreepr]

  On 6/10/2021 at 3:24 PM, Goude said:

No, I have not read every post in this thread. But I never expect people to totally agree on any question. Yes, a NDE is personal and can only be fully accepted by the person experiencing it. Mine was like someone opening a window. I saw there was more to life than the house I lived in. I saw no religious aspects, no judgments,  no punishments, a very pleasant event.

Expand  

What you're describing is that magical moment (enlightenment) when we understand the point of life; most religions are based on the person who could articulate that understanding to other's.

You're putting the cart before the horse, by assuming an NDE taught you, IMO religion's were never intended to teach about a magic moment.

  On 6/13/2021 at 10:48 AM, Goude said:

I tried to show something beautiful, but they cared not look.

Expand  

Then you didn't show it well enough; if teaching is your purpose, you need to learn why... 😉

[beecee]

  On 6/13/2021 at 12:57 AM, Goude said:

 Watch the video and remember it is only one of hundreds. We need to discuss the video.

Expand  

OK, I watched the video. And I understand why to any individual experiencing such a apparently highly mystical event, such as Pam experienced, may see that as a NDE and view it as she has. 

Still, the point that struck me was around the 8 minute mark and the "unexplained" conclusion. Science does not know everything as I'm sure you know. Not knowing too much about any supposed NDE, I googled and came across this excellent article in "Scientific American". Please take the time to read all of it...it discusses NDE's from different well known people........ 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-near-death-experiences-reveal-about-the-brain/

 

an extract from the article:

"Modern death requires irreversible loss of brain function. When the brain is starved of blood flow (ischemia) and oxygen (anoxia), the patient faints in a fraction of a minute and his or her electroencephalogram, or EEG, becomes isoelectric—in other words, flat. This implies that large-scale, spatially distributed electrical activity within the cortex, the outermost layer of the brain, has broken down. Like a town that loses power one neighborhood at a time, local regions of the brain go offline one after another. The mind, whose substrate is whichever neurons remain capable of generating electrical activity, does what it always does: it tells a story shaped by the person’s experience, memory and cultural expectations.

Given these power outages, this experience may produce the rather strange and idiosyncratic stories that make up the corpus of NDE reports. To the person undergoing it, the NDE is as real as anything the mind produces during normal waking. When the entire brain has shut down because of complete power loss, the mind is extinguished, along with consciousness. If and when oxygen and blood flow are restored, the brain boots up, and the narrative flow of experience resumes".

Edited June 13, 2021 by beecee

[Goude]

  On 6/13/2021 at 9:45 PM, beecee said:

OK, I watched the video. And I understand why to any individual experiencing such a apparently highly mystical event, such as Pam experienced, may see that as a NDE and view it as she has. 

Still, the point that struck me was around the 8 minute mark and the "unexplained" conclusion. Science does not know everything as I'm sure you know. Not knowing too much about any supposed NDE, I googled and came across this excellent article in "Scientific American". Please take the time to read all of it...it discusses NDE's from different well known people........ 

Expand  

Thank you. I know it took courage to do it. The theory of brain electrical activity I read years ago. There are several reasons why this does not explain the NDE. Medical science says the brain can live about 11 seconds after the heart stops. Pam was clinically dead for an hour. She was looking down upon her dead body watching the doctors work, this is fairly common in NDEs. The brain would have to live for an hour and take a position above the body which is not possible.

We are first Spiritual (intelligent energy) and second Human. When we die all of us return into the spiritual world. The are no God judgments or punishments waiting. It is a pleasant experience. The NDE started to become a factor when Medical Science advanced to the point of taking a dead body from an ambulance and bringing it back to life.

An estimated 10 million Americans have had the experience over the years. There is much, much more to learn, but I will leave it as this for now.

[Moontanman]

  On 6/14/2021 at 1:55 PM, Goude said:

Thank you. I know it took courage to do it. The theory of brain electrical activity I read years ago. There are several reasons why this does not explain the NDE. Medical science says the brain can live about 11 seconds after the heart stops.

Expand  

I think we need a citation for this. 

 

  On 6/14/2021 at 9:55 AM, Goude said:

Pam was clinically dead for an hour. She was looking down upon her dead body watching the doctors work, this is fairly common in NDEs. The brain would have to live for an hour and take a position above the body which is not possible.

Expand  

Unless of course the brain was hallucinating. 

  On 6/14/2021 at 9:55 AM, Goude said:

We are first Spiritual (intelligent energy) and second Human.

Expand  

Citation please. 

  On 6/14/2021 at 9:55 AM, Goude said:

When we die all of us return into the spiritual world. The are no God judgments or punishments waiting. It is a pleasant experience.

Expand  

Citation please. 

  On 6/14/2021 at 9:55 AM, Goude said:

The NDE started to become a factor when Medical Science advanced to the point of taking a dead body from an ambulance and bringing it back to life.

Expand  

Again, citation please. 

  On 6/14/2021 at 9:55 AM, Goude said:

An estimated 10 million Americans have had the experience over the years. There is much, much more to learn, but I will leave it as this for now.

Expand  

Citation please, you keep making sweeping statements with nothing but your own assertions as evidence. 

[Goude]

I did expected push-back. Dr. Raymond Moody worked in a large hospital. Some of the surgery patients were telling about these strange experiences. Dr. Moody asked, and got permission, to study these experiences which he labeled "Near Death Experiences". After a year or more Moody published his first book "Life After Life." When the hospital senior management found out about the book,they fired Dr. Moody. There is documentation in his book.

I can understand the reluctance, having a hard time understanding the hostility. There is nothing to fear from reading and learning about NDEs. Whether you wish to consider or reject them it's OK.  While the information does damage religious doctrine and rituals it does not change much of scientific study. Science has been very good for us Humans over the years and I read a lot of science news.

I think you are seeing it all in the video, there are more videos of Pam, and Dannion Brinkley is another NDE standout experiencer.

[Prometheus]

  On 6/15/2021 at 3:38 PM, Goude said:

When the hospital senior management found out about the book,they fired Dr. Moody.

Expand  

Is this true? I couldn't find any documentation.

Explain to me why if these subjective experiences are to be considered serious evidence of life after death we can't also take seriously people who report the existence of DMT elves (a real community of people, not one i've just made up).

[StringJunky]

  On 6/15/2021 at 3:38 PM, Goude said:

I did expected push-back. Dr. Raymond Moody worked in a large hospital. Some of the surgery patients were telling about these strange experiences. Dr. Moody asked, and got permission, to study these experiences which he labeled "Near Death Experiences". After a year or more Moody published his first book "Life After Life." When the hospital senior management found out about the book,they fired Dr. Moody. There is documentation in his book.

I can understand the reluctance, having a hard time understanding the hostility. There is nothing to fear from reading and learning about NDEs. Whether you wish to consider or reject them it's OK.  While the information does damage religious doctrine and rituals it does not change much of scientific study. Science has been very good for us Humans over the years and I read a lot of science news.

I think you are seeing it all in the video, there are more videos of Pam, and Dannion Brinkley is another NDE standout experiencer.

Expand  

Asking for a citation or or evidence is not being hostile.