Calcium forms

[Longwell3]

Regarding calcium in the bloodstream, in drinking water, and in food. 

Are calcium ions always single, free atoms?  Is that the definition of "dissolved?"  (single atoms?)  

Does the bloodstream contain any undissovled calcium?  how much?  how big?  

Does drinking water contain any undissolved calcium?  Does it all dissolve when consumed by animals?  

Regarding calcium supplements, and antacids made from ground oyster shells :  Do these large, undissolved pieces readliy "dissolve" in water or in the body?  Or do some large chunks remain, roaming at large in the body?  
 

[chenbeier]

If it says dissolved then it is dissolved. But calcium can make compounds, like lime, CaCO3 or gypsium CaSO4 and others , which soloubility is poor. So there can be not dissolved particles in the water or other liquids. I think also heart attack is caused by this, if not solouble calcium compounds and other compounds block the venes.

[studiot]

Calcium as calcium carbonate in the digestive system is difficult to absorb in to the body.
Calcium supplements usually contain added vitamin D3 to help body functions.

Once in the body as calcium ions the calcium plays a vital part in animal (including human) biochemistry in what is known as the calcium pump.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?source=hp&ei=lprFXaaKJs21sAfj17iQCQ&q=calcium+pump&oq=calcium+pump&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0l10.764.3910..4426...0.0..2.914.6714.2-2j0j2j5j3......0....1..gws-wiz.......0i131.3ooanLPcLmk&ved=0ahUKEwimrdOQh9vlAhXNGuwKHeMrDpIQ4dUDCAc&uact=5

Note the Wikipedia article is poor and incomplete on this subject.

Yes drinking water has to contain some calcium (at least by UK law) as it prevents poisonous lead from old lead pipes entering the water.
This is measured by the 'hardness' of the water.
Particularly in 'hard water areas' other ions will also be present, aprticularly magnesium.
In some soft water areas these have to be added to bring the water up to standard.

No there are no lumps of undissolved calcium knocking about in your blood stream.
The furring up of water pipes is due to calcium etc salts depositing.
But the furring up of your arteries is due to lipids (fats).

Does this answer your questions?

[Longwell3]

yes, thanks.   The only calcium in the bloodstream is single, free ions (single atoms with one electron missing?)  The large chunks of calcium carbonate which we consume  are ALL perfectly disassembled by the digestive process.  

 

[chenbeier]

Calcium ions are Ca2+ so they lost 2 electrons

[Longwell3]

so they are not atoms, but actually less than atoms, and they are the only way calcium is found in the body.  Even if we drink hard water or eat Tums, etc, those larger molecules or chunks of calcium carbonate will be 100% disassembled by the digestive system leaving only individual calcium ions in the blood stream.  

Thanks I was delusionally seeing gigantic rocks careening through the body, lodging in the joints and organs.  

[John Cuthber]

1 hour ago, studiot said:

Calcium as calcium carbonate in the digestive system is difficult to absorb in to the body.

Calcium carbonate  which enters the digestive system will usually react with the HCl in the stomach.

It's famous for it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antacid

The resulting solution of calcium ions will be absorbed.

[Longwell3]

chenbeier, what you say about "other compounds" causing heart attacks is interesting.  I'd like hear more about that.  I have the "calcific aortic valve" condition.  I wonder what form is the calcium in dairy products?  free ions?  

 

[studiot]

5 hours ago, John Cuthber said:

Calcium carbonate  which enters the digestive system will usually react with the HCl in the stomach.

It's famous for it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antacid

The resulting solution of calcium ions will be absorbed.

Please check your facts before you quibble.

Calcium is not absorbed in the stomach, but later in the digestive system.

Quote

Calcium is absorbed in the mammalian small intestine by two general mechanisms: a transcellular active transport process, located largely in the duodenum and upper jejunum; and a paracellular, passive process that functions throughout the length of the intestine.

Mechanisms of intestinal calcium absorption. - NCBI

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov › pubmed

 

[John Cuthber]

13 hours ago, studiot said:

Calcium is not absorbed in the stomach,

I never said it was.

I said CaCO3 dissolves in the acid in the stomach- it does-and I said that the calcium is absorbed- it is.

I never said where it was absorbed so...
 

13 hours ago, studiot said:

Please check your facts before you quibble.

 

[studiot]

13 hours ago, studiot said:

The resulting solution of calcium ions will be absorbed.

Well I'm sorry that your statement was so vague I misinterpreted it.

 

I look forward to your exposition of the entry into and transport around the body of calcium for the benefit of the OP.
No doubt it will be considerbly more detailed than my broad brush treatment.

[Longwell3]

and only "dissolved" (single, independent, free, lonely) ions will pass through that intestine wall, because that is the intestine's job-- to select out  these tiny particles, smaller than an atom.  Everything bigger would be rejected and pooped out.  ???

So any accumulations or aggregations of calcium that wreak havoc in the body are re-combinations of these same tiny ions.  ???

[studiot]

4 minutes ago, Longwell3 said:

and only "dissolved" (single, independent, free, lonely) ions will pass through that intestine wall, because that is the intestine's job-- to select out  these tiny particles, smaller than an atom.  Everything bigger would be rejected and pooped out.  ???

So any accumulations or aggregations of calcium that wreak havoc in the body are re-combinations of these same tiny ions.  ???

What accumulations are you thinking of?

 

Here are some basic biological facts (from Apps, Cohen and Steel University of Edinburgh)

I wanted to introduce you to the vital importance of calcium in a normally functioning body.

The antacids mentioned by John Cuthber, the deficiencies mentioned above and any such 'accumulations' would be an abnormal function.

Calcium is not only vital for the skeleton but also in neurotransmitters and muscle action.

[Strange]

33 minutes ago, studiot said:

Calcium is not only vital for the skeleton but also in neurotransmitters and muscle action.

I once donated platelets where they pump the blood out of one arm, extract the platelets, then pump the blood back into the other arm. One side effect is that it also removes calcium ions from the blood (and lowers the temperature of the blood) which can be dangerous. They gave us indigestion tablets to suck to keep the calcium level up and said that if we started feeling tingling or numbness, we were to let them know immediately.

[Longwell3]

Thanks, I understand that calcium is a good thing when in ionic form.  Now I understand that that is the ONLY form that is found in the blood stream.  What about the urine stream?  Do the bigger chunks rejected by the intestine cause kidney stones?  

In my personal case, I was just diagnosed with calcific aortic valve disease.  Seems to be a genetic factor, so maybe not dietary at all.  

I think that (excessive?) calcium is implicated in arthritis?  kidney stones?  arteriosclerosis? 

But apparently it is not the size of the particles that determines the danger, because there are only calcium ions, which are all the same size (smaller than a calcium atom?)

So it must be either too much of a good thing causing problems, or some aggregation of calcium ions with other substances ? 

[John Cuthber]

1 hour ago, Longwell3 said:

Do the bigger chunks rejected by the intestine cause kidney stones?  

Stuff that's not digested by the intestines leaves by a different route.

 

Calcium ions will form a solid precipitate with, for example, phosphate. Calcium phosphate can form kidney stones (and also bones).

It is still calcium in the form of ions. Calcium metal reacts instantly with water.