Hydrogen powered jets

[Darren cronin]

The Hydrogen powered jet

Hi My names Darren Cronin I live in bristol and want to help with climate change.
if you think there might be something in this idea please pass it on.

The one problem with a hydrogen powered jet is the fuel (hydrogen) would have to be stored in a large pressurised or cryogenic tank inside the aircraft utilising the space required for passengers where as traditional aircraft store jet fuel in their wings.  My proposal is a radical idea that traditionalists might scoff at but hear me out. We have to come up with an alternative to jet fuel, the environmental costs are building! 

Hydrogen is the obvious choice as it burns even more efficiently then jet fuel producing more power when ignited and all you get is water vapour, not C02 as a byproduct. So how can we get over the storage problem? 
My solution is radical and when I tell you you might think it’s mad but some of the best ideas are at first thought of this way and in my opinion the simpler the solution the better.

My idea would radically change the infrastructure supplying fuel to airports if developed. It would immediately make the vast networks of aviation pipe lines, storage and logistics, redundant!

They also occasionally blow up I’m sighting Bunsfield near London as just one of many examples, 10 years ago it was the biggest explosion in Europe since WW2. (google it it was enormous)

My proposed idea would be a fraction of the cost of these facilities. A fact everyone would benefit from.

It would turn an aircraft from what is essentially a flying bomb into a much safer mode of transportation.

Instead of loading the hydrogen onto the aeroplane in a central tank why not load it into the wings in a demineralise water form with a percentage of antifreeze! 

Obviously you will then need an electric reaction that separates the hydrogen from the oxygen  equal to the power you want the engines to produce. 

Even the most modern batteries at this point in time are not capable of storing that kind of power but remember hydrogen is more efficient then jet fuel so all you need to do is store one third of the electricity required, in pre-charged on board batteries add a dynamo to the engine to recharge the battery and get the proses going with an initial power surge and keep adding to boost the chain reaction. 
A fast form of water spray being exposed to an electric arch in which hydrogen is separated from oxygen, the oxygen then being reintroduced after the hydrogen is ignited would be one challenge, but one I’m sure is solvable.

Ps: I’m under no illusion about the complications involved in this idea, having an idea is easy, bringing it to fruition is the hard part. But if there is even a one percent chance this could work I think we can all recognise the importance, not for the planet, the planet will survive us!  It’s good for millions of years to come, its humanity and the current ecosystem that needs rescuing so we need to explore every possibility.

Sincerely Darren Cronin 23/01/2020  



[Strange]

Not a topic I know much about, but batteries capable of providing enough energy to spit the water fast enough to generate hydrogen (nicely, it would also generate oxygen to burn the hydrogen with) would be presumably be pretty massive.

And if you are carrying batteries that powerful, maybe they could drive the engines directly? After all, the hydrogen can't have any more energy than the batteries provided to create it.

Interesting idea, though.

[studiot]

Hello Daren and welcome.

+1 for thinking seriously about this subject.

There would remain many difficulties to overcome.

The main one would be the rate of chemical reaction to overcome.
Obtaining hydrogen by electrolysis is not a rapid process and unfortunately by far the maximum rate of usage of fuel is at takeoff.
It is certainly not a 'chain reaction' nor do you want such a reaction which by definition rapidly goes out of control.
I have trouble visualising an eletrolytic system capable of splitting off hydrogen at the rate required for this.

So you would need (temporary) storage of some hydrogen and a compression system to place it there.
Just what you want to avoid.

Aviation has not had a happy history of hydrogen based fuel, from the Hindenberg through to american space rockets (and it is believed Russian ones as well they will not admit to).
The rockets fuelling is based on hydrazine, a hydrogen compound, not hydrogen directly.
But still sadly dangerous.

 

Interestingly modern aircraft can store fuel in underwing pods rather than directly in the wings themselves for a number of technical and safety reasons.

 

One of my more distant relatives was the Fire Officier in charge of the Buncefield disaster (note the correct spelling if you want to google it).

 

So keep thinking.

[Darren cronin]

Hi Studiot thanks for getting back to me on this extremely important subject.

You are right about the dangers and history of storing compressed hydrogen.  One of my objectivity is to completely avoid that very thing and to also get rid of the very explosive fuel currently kept in the wings of planes I believe a 747 carries 180 tons of it during take off. And again you are right, the slow chemical reaction of passing a current through the water so you can extract the hydrogen and oxygen is an engineering problem I think as yet there is no easy answer to that that I’m aware of.

I was thinking maybe hundreds of small points of positive and negative charge each one producing its own patch of gasses might do the trick or someone coming up with a much faster way where water is sprayed through an electric field where gasses are separate at a much faster rate could be developed.

It just seems a shame we haven’t found a faster way to create hydrogen from water yet if we could solve this problem hydrogen powered flight where the hydrogen is kept in its water form as you fly until it’s needed would be a far safer way to fly in my opinion. The making of the  hydrogen could be turned on and off at the flick of a switch only producing the required amount for flight, and yeah external tanks of compressed hydrogen for take off why not!  They could even be dropped at a safe zone.

ps: sorry about the Buncefield mistake I should know better I’ve worked on the rebuild of that place on and off over the last 3 years, all back up and running now 90 million pounds later. 
 Again thanks 🙏 

 

[studiot]

 

9 hours ago, Darren cronin said:

I live in bristol

Bristol has a very proud tradition in the aircraft industry.

Sadly it will probably be the last part of our aircraft industry to be indescriminately destroyed by successive governments of both colours.

My personal opinion is that at this time hydrogen fuel is a step too far.
We would be needing too develop on too many fronts to make your proposal work.
More effort should be directed towards far better batteries. I wonder if £100 billion would do the job?
If so it would be a better investment for mankind than HS2.