Volcanic "wonder" fertile soils...

[Externet]

Greetings.

When I walked on the Galapagos glasslike volcanic soil, nothing grows on it, perhaps saw a lost lizard.
How many centuries takes for that soil to turn to the "great soil of volcanic origin" often described covered by lush jungle vegetation ?  How does lava converts to fertile soil ?

 

Edited October 19, 2020 by Externet

[naitche]

Not the full answers you are looking for, But I remember a talk given by a a geologist of his trip to a recent (under 10 year old) volcanic island and the teams excitement at finding the 1st plant.

Much fuss and conjecture trying unsuccessfully to identify the species . One of researchers wives solved it. It turned out to be a tomato plant growing out of the excrement of one the research team.

Bird/sea mammal  droppings,  and ocean borne seeds and weed (coconuts etc) combine to start the process.

[John Cuthber]

On 10/19/2020 at 1:18 PM, Externet said:

How many centuries takes for that soil to turn to the "great soil of volcanic origin" often described covered by lush jungle vegetation ?  How does lava converts to fertile soil ?

 

Not long
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surtsey#Settlement_of_life

(The tomato plant gets a coy reference.)

[studiot]

On 10/19/2020 at 1:18 PM, Externet said:

Greetings.

When I walked on the Galapagos glasslike volcanic soil, nothing grows on it, perhaps saw a lost lizard.
How many centuries takes for that soil to turn to the "great soil of volcanic origin" often described covered by lush jungle vegetation ?  How does lava converts to fertile soil ?

 

Plants require four things for seeds to grow into plants.

Water
Carbon dioxide
Sunlight
A few trace elements, mainly phosphorous.

Rocks break down to finer particles by processes of weathering and particularly into their constituent minerals by chemical weathering.
Basaltic rocks are most resistant, followed by granites.
Volcanic lavas are much more loosely bound and break down more readily and quickly.

So all the ingredients are there as soon as some phosphoric material and seed are available.
As already noted bird droppings (guano) can supply this, otherwise.

Quote

The phosphorus contents of most igneous rocks usually lie between 0.01 and 0.5% P20 S' Assuming that all phosphorus is con- tained in apatite, igneous rocks in general contain between 0.02% and 1.2% apatite. Phosphorus concentrations in metamorphic rocks range from 0.01 % to 1.3%.

 

Phosphate Minerals in Terrestrial Igneous and Metamorphic ...

 

[swansont]

I imagine that once the first plant takes hold the process accelerates, as the root structures will physically break down the rock, which makes it easier for the next ones.

[John Cuthber]

12 hours ago, studiot said:

Plants require four things for seeds to grow into plants.

Water
Carbon dioxide
Sunlight
A few trace elements, mainly phosphorous.

and  symbiotic bacteria

Ok

Plants require four five things for seeds to grow into plants.

Water
Carbon dioxide
Sunlight
A few trace elements, mainly phosphorous.

and symbiotic bacteria.
 

 

And sometimes fungi

 

Ok

Plants require four  five   six things for seeds to grow into plants.

Water
Carbon dioxide
Sunlight
A few trace elements, mainly phosphorous.

symbiotic bacteria.

and sometimes fungi.


OK among the things that plants require are such elements as...
pollinating insects.
 

[MigL]

Vulcanic soils are especially good for viniferous grape growing, and excellent wines.
The area around Mt. Vesuvius, near Pompeii in southern Italy, is very fertile.
So, about 19-20 centuries ( since the 79 AD eruption ) should do it.

[J.C.MacSwell]

On 11/27/2020 at 7:16 AM, naitche said:

Not the full answers you are looking for, But I remember a talk given by a a geologist of his trip to a recent (under 10 year old) volcanic island and the teams excitement at finding the 1st plant.

Much fuss and conjecture trying unsuccessfully to identify the species . One of researchers wives solved it. It turned out to be a tomato plant growing out of the excrement of one the research team.

Bird/sea mammal  droppings,  and ocean borne seeds and weed (coconuts etc) combine to start the process.

I guess one of them "soiled" it...

[Sensei]

On 11/27/2020 at 1:35 PM, studiot said:

Plants require four things for seeds to grow into plants.

Water
Carbon dioxide
Sunlight
A few trace elements, mainly phosphorous.

What with Nitrogen? It is part of DNA/RNA/amino acids..

 

Google Translated from foreign website:

"Nitrogen fertilizers. Their use has the greatest impact on increasing the yield mass [5] and extending the growing season. Nitrogen contained in the soil is quickly washed away, so fertilization should be spread over time and applied during the period of intensive plant growth [6]."

"Phosphorus fertilizers Phosphorus is retained in the soil and does not wash away even under the influence of rain. Soil fertilized with phosphorus accumulates the element over the years, therefore phosphorus fertilizers are used in concentrated doses every 2-3 years. This type of fertilizer should be applied in the soil at a depth of 10-40 cm [7]."

"Nitrogen accounted for the vast majority (78%) of the nutrients consumed in manufactured fertilizers, with an estimated consumption of 59 kg/ha on average in the EU that ranged from 19 kg/ha in Portugal to 125 kg/ha in the Netherlands. In contrast, the average estimated consumption for Phosphorus was 6 kg/ha (from 2 to 10 kg/ha) and 11 kg/ha for Potassium (from 2 to 33 kg/ha). "

Edited December 8, 2020 by Sensei

[studiot]

3 hours ago, Sensei said:

What with Nitrogen? It is part of DNA/RNA/amino acids..

Yes you are right some nitrogen is also required and this doesn't come directly from the air.

[Externet]

Nitrogen...  Can you PLEASE be very precise ?

Am sick of wrong easy lazy wording in science.  Is it properly 'potassium nitrate',  'calcium nitrate' ,  'ammonium nitrate' , nitrophosphate fertilizing compounds instead of 'nitrogen' ??  Nitrogen is in the air,  are you referring to a component of air as fertilizer ??

What is the scientific proper terminology for what vulgars name as nitrogen fertilizer ?

[MigL]

34 minutes ago, Externet said:

What is the scientific proper terminology for what vulgars name as nitrogen fertilizer ?

I have even seen trucks 'injecting' ammonia under the soil surface in corn fields.
What would you call any compound containing a lot of Nitrogen ?

[Externet]

I would call its proper chemical compound name, not nitrogen.

If it is injecting ammonia, then, ammonia fertilizer. Not nitrogen.😳

[CharonY]

On 12/8/2020 at 9:07 AM, Externet said:

Nitrogen...  Can you PLEASE be very precise ?

Am sick of wrong easy lazy wording in science.  Is it properly 'potassium nitrate',  'calcium nitrate' ,  'ammonium nitrate' , nitrophosphate fertilizing compounds instead of 'nitrogen' ??  Nitrogen is in the air,  are you referring to a component of air as fertilizer ??

What is the scientific proper terminology for what vulgars name as nitrogen fertilizer ?

It depends on the plant, actually. First, atmospheric nitrogen is not typically considered a fertilizer, but there are plants which together with bacteria, can fix atmospheric nitrogen (legumes are the most relevant crops with this ability).

Generally speaking nitrogen fertilizer refers to basically any nitrogen source that can be directly used by a given plant. So that includes various nitrates, but also ammonia and urea for example.

[Sensei]

On 12/8/2020 at 7:48 PM, Externet said:

If it is injecting ammonia, then, ammonia fertilizer. Not nitrogen.😳

Fertilizers are classified by what they give the plant.

"Nitrogen fertilizer" is scientific proper name.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertilizer#Nitrogen_fertilizers

There are also "potassium fertilizers", "phosphorus fertilizers" etc. etc.

 

 

Naturally the soil is fertilized by "thunderstorm rain".

https://www.google.com/search?q=thunderstorm+in+nitrogen+cycle

"lightning that accompanies thunderstorms can act to add nitrogen to the soil. ... Nitrogen is transformed to a plant-usable form (nitrogen fixation) by the electrical discharges that can occur within thunderstorms. The usable nitrogen is added to the soil as a component of precipitation."

"Nitrogen in the atmosphere can be transformed into a plant-usable form, a process called nitrogen fixation, by lightning. ... Lightning does add nitrogen to the soil, as nitrates dissolve in precipitation. This helps plants, but microorganisms in the soil do the vast majority of nitrogen fixation."

I have container outside, where I am catching rainwater, and use it for houseplants instead of tap water.

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=how+much+nitrogen+does+lightning+produce

"According to a new paper by Ott and Pickering in the Journal of Geophysical Research, each flash of lightning on average in the several mid-latitude and subtropical thunderstorms studied turned 7 kilograms (15.4 pounds) of nitrogen into chemically reactive NOx"