Are you atheist?

[SandroPaling]

I was an atheist, but not so long ago, I survived a car crash that was nearly impossible to survive.

[zapatos]

1 minute ago, SandroPaling said:

I was an atheist, but not so long ago, I survived a car crash that was nearly impossible to survive.

So what do you believe now?

And since it was only "nearly" impossible to survive, then how do you know your survival was miraculous?

[Phi for All]

2 hours ago, SandroPaling said:

I was an atheist, but not so long ago, I survived a car crash that was nearly impossible to survive.

Why give credit to gods when it was probably your doctors and whoever designed your car that truly helped you survive?

[Peterkin]

It's not unusual for people to have a "Damascus moment" after a narrow escape from death or danger. It's not a rational process; it's a great emotional upwelling or relief, joy, surprise, humility and gratitude. It's purposeless and undirected, so it spontaneously goes toward whatever supernatural entity is central to the belief system of his society.

Of course, the religious community welcomes the convert and makes him feel cherished, important, consequential - all of which feels good to him, and is, with the collusion of the community, attributed to the deity. The unconsidered inclination to believe is reinforced and rationalized, and veiled in a tacit agreement never to scrutinize it too closely.   

Edited October 20, 2022 by Peterkin

[iNow]

8 hours ago, zapatos said:

So what do you believe now?

That car manufactures and engineers are really good at what they do and protecting passengers, obviously 

[Bufofrog]

11 hours ago, SandroPaling said:

I survived a car crash that was nearly impossible to survive.

I'm glad you survived.

[TheVat]

9 hours ago, Bufofrog said:

I'm glad you survived.

OTOH, perhaps the accident was God's way of telling him to die, and so all that fine automotive engineering and medical treatment thwarted the divine will.  If people often argue that we cannot plumb the mind of God, being limited creatures, then they have to accept such possibility as part of their faith.  (Just playing here...)

[dimreepr]

On 10/20/2022 at 9:47 PM, Peterkin said:

It's not unusual for people to have a "Damascus moment" after a narrow escape from death or danger. It's not a rational process; it's a great emotional upwelling or relief, joy, surprise, humility and gratitude. It's purposeless and undirected, so it spontaneously goes toward whatever supernatural entity is central to the belief system of his society.  

Does it?

 

23 hours ago, TheVat said:

OTOH, perhaps the accident was God's way of telling him to die, and so all that fine automotive engineering and medical treatment thwarted the divine will.  If people often argue that we cannot plumb the mind of God, being limited creatures, then they have to accept such possibility as part of their faith. 

As would an atheist...

23 hours ago, TheVat said:

(Just playing here...)

Me too. 😇

I'm not saying atheism is a religion, but most of us have to believe that our teachers are reliably informed... 

Edited October 22, 2022 by dimreepr

[Peterkin]

33 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

Does it?

Yes. People absorb their society's cultural mores and habits and speech. Most English-speaking people, whether they are Christian or not, use the same Jesus- and God-related swear words when they drop a can of soup on their toe, or when their spouse fails to comprehend the argument they're making. Similarly, when growing exasperated with their employees or teenaged children, they tend to raise their eyes and hands toward heaven in a beseeching gesture, and might even mutter "Give me strength!". Not because they really expect help from that direction; simply because it is a habit of their culture to place a sympathetic deity up there. A Roman father would probably roll his eyes at his household shrine and a Druid would gesture toward the holly grove. Similarly, when people are spared a tribulation, encounter a favourable outcome, they are quite likely - atheist, agnostic and undecided, equally - to exclaim "Thank God!" or "Saints be praised!" Not because they really believe the good luck came from that deity; simply because it is the habit of their culture.

 And so, when a person who is not a believer, but neither is he locked in a dead-set vendetta against the Christian version of godhood, is the beneficiary of a great piece of good luck, his "Thank you" is automatically directed to the heaven of his cultural tradition. Emotionally, that's both more direct and more satisfying than trying to apportion the credit among designers, engineers, car factories, highway construction crews, traffic law makers, other drivers, the luck of weather conditions, etc. Just as, having scored a goal, football players look up and thank the sky, which they know had nothing to do with their three seconds of triumph. If they thought Jesus was scoring their goals, they wouldn't train and practice so hard, would they? People who really believe God will heal them don't go to the hospital in the first place. But people who trust in doctors, nurses and medicine, still thank God for their recovery. It's an emotionally satisfying habit.   

[dimreepr]

22 hours ago, Peterkin said:

Yes. People absorb their society's cultural mores and habits and speech. Most English-speaking people, whether they are Christian or not, use the same Jesus- and God-related swear words when they drop a can of soup on their toe, or when their spouse fails to comprehend the argument they're making. Similarly, when growing exasperated with their employees or teenaged children, they tend to raise their eyes and hands toward heaven in a beseeching gesture, and might even mutter "Give me strength!". Not because they really expect help from that direction; simply because it is a habit of their culture to place a sympathetic deity up there. A Roman father would probably roll his eyes at his household shrine and a Druid would gesture toward the holly grove. Similarly, when people are spared a tribulation, encounter a favourable outcome, they are quite likely - atheist, agnostic and undecided, equally - to exclaim "Thank God!" or "Saints be praised!" Not because they really believe the good luck came from that deity; simply because it is the habit of their culture.

Indeed, so faith in their teacher's/culture, supercedes their ability to think critically... 

[Peterkin]

1 hour ago, dimreepr said:

Indeed, so faith in their teacher's/culture, supercedes their ability to think criticall

Sometimes.

[dimreepr]

22 hours ago, Peterkin said:

Sometimes.

Well, not everyone is capable; are they wrong to trust?

 

[Peterkin]

1 hour ago, dimreepr said:

Well, not everyone is capable; are they wrong to trust?

Sometimes.

[Intoscience]

On 10/20/2022 at 6:27 PM, SandroPaling said:

I was an atheist, but not so long ago, I survived a car crash that was nearly impossible to survive.

Unfortunately such an event doesn't prove the existence of god. It's not uncommon to hear reports of "miraculous" survival incidents. Sometimes what seems impossible with odds stacked against, on further scrutiny turns out to be a viable, though not necessarily likely, but realistically possible outcome.

Often the victim of such an event feels (understandably so) a euphoric sense of spiritualism. Near death experiences can have such an effect on people.

But good for you, in that you survived and that this event may change your life outlook, hopefully for the better. Whether than includes a belief system in deity or just the realisation that life is not only fragile but precious, especially when faced with your own and those you love's mortality. 

   

[SandroPaling]

On 10/20/2022 at 8:27 PM, SandroPaling said:

I was an atheist, but not so long ago, I survived a car crash that was nearly impossible to survive.

After that incident, I started to go to church every day and thank God for letting me live and giving me a second chance. I changed my life entirely, and now I am happy with my life. If you want to learn more about God and where to find God, visit https://firstchurchlove.com. Here you can also have a small talk with a local priest that could explain the origins of this belief.

Edited October 25, 2022 by SandroPaling

[Intoscience]

4 minutes ago, SandroPaling said:

After that incident, I started to go to church every day and thank God for letting me live and giving me a second chance. I changed my life entirely, and now I am happy with my life. If you want to learn more about God and where to find God, visit https://firstchurchlove.com. Here you can also have a small talk with a local priest that could explain the origins of this belief.

So prior to the incident you were an Atheist and immediately after you did a 180 and changed your view to full belief. 

The important thing is that you are happy and if it required belief in a deity to achieve such then that's fine. Many atheists are happy in life without belief in a greater power. 

Personally I believe in love, to love all things and including yourself is the key to happiness.

I don't need a god to do this, thanks 

[dimreepr]

20 hours ago, Peterkin said:

Sometimes.

Those that are capable can teach their teachers, those that aren't have no choice but to trust their teachers.

1 hour ago, SandroPaling said:

After that incident, I started to go to church every day and thank God for letting me live and giving me a second chance. I changed my life entirely, and now I am happy with my life.

If it was you that changed your life, why do you need God?

[Moontanman]

3 hours ago, SandroPaling said:

After that incident, I started to go to church every day and thank God for letting me live and giving me a second chance. I changed my life entirely, and now I am happy with my life. If you want to learn more about God and where to find God, visit https://firstchurchlove.com. Here you can also have a small talk with a local priest that could explain the origins of this belief.

You insult us all by suggesting all we need is god and a good talk with a priest, you also suggest we do not know the origins of belief in a god or gods. My wife and I volunteered at a church as cooks, we cooked every sunday for the homeless, actually my wife was the cook, I was just her sioux chief, but we had a great time attending that church. Great people, I particularly liked the Pastor, we cooked up some really fantastic meals for the homeless until the city shut us down. My point being is that Atheists are part of this world, we, quite often, are atheists due to our understanding of the origins of belief in god or gods and your remark is insulting. 

Now... your near death experience is indeed yours, no one else's and until you can actually show your experience to someone else your personal experience is just that... personal. Personal experience is not evidence of anything. For me it is sad you were so easy to sucked back into religion... to me that would indicate your understanding of religion is flawed but your mileage might vary.   

[TheVat]

49 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

 I was just her sioux chief

I believe Lakota is preferred, nowadays.

(am easily amused by autocorrect)

[Peterkin]

4 hours ago, SandroPaling said:

If you want to learn more about God and where to find God, visit https://firstchurchlove.com. Here you can also have a small talk with a local priest that could explain the origins of this belief.

Or, I could just drive into a bridge abutment and wait for Him. 

18 minutes ago, TheVat said:

I believe Lakota is preferred, nowadays.

They were serving buffalo burgers. Very nice with sumac chutney.

[Dis n Dat]

On 11/4/2020 at 6:23 PM, iNow said:

Most people are atheist about over 99% of the gods humans have invented throughout history.

Can you provide evidence to these claims? I am interested in seeing the exact study you are getting this information from. 

1. Most people are atheists.

2. 99% of the gods humans have invented throughout history.

Thank you very much. 

[dimreepr]

13 minutes ago, Dis n Dat said:

Can you provide evidence to these claims? I am interested in seeing the exact study you are getting this information from. 

2. 99% of the gods humans have invented throughout history.

Have you met one?

[Dis n Dat]

18 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

Have you met one?

 

That's not evidence. I take it that you don't have any study to show or any empirical evidence to your claim which you just came up with because others have done so. 

Thanks for the response. 

Edit: Now I realised that you are just replying to every comment without anything to contribute. 

Edited November 2, 2022 by Dis n Dat

[swansont]

34 minutes ago, Dis n Dat said:

Can you provide evidence to these claims? I am interested in seeing the exact study you are getting this information from. 

1. Most people are atheists.

That wasn’t the claim. It was that they were atheistic regarding 99% of the gods.

34 minutes ago, Dis n Dat said:

2. 99% of the gods humans have invented throughout history.

Thank you very much. 

The general claim can be deduced (like a Fermi problem)

Do you (and people in general) believe in deities outside of your own religion? If no, then you are atheistic regarding these deities.

How many deities are there? How many thousands? (Egypt alone had >1400). Even if your religion has multiple deities, the percentage is likely close to or exceeds 99%. 

Now, if you are convinced that a deity isn’t real, because of your belief, then said deity must have been invented.

 

 

[Dis n Dat]

1 minute ago, swansont said:

That wasn’t the claim. It was that they were atheistic regarding 99% of the gods.

Ah. Sorry I misunderstood your comment. I have heard this comment made by most atheistic apologists on the internet 

 

2 minutes ago, swansont said:

The general claim can be deduced (like a Fermi problem)

Do you (and people in general) believe in deities outside of your own religion? If no, then you are atheistic regarding these deities.

How many deities are there? How many thousands? (Egypt alone had >1400). Even if your religion has multiple deities, the percentage is likely close to or exceeds 99%. 

Now, if you are convinced that a deity isn’t real, because of your belief, then said deity must have been invented.

That's not evidence. That's conjecture. It's like saying "there are many theories on who killed kennedy. So the whole thing must have been invented".