Blow to US Democracy -Split from: U.S. presidential election modelling

[joigus]

5 hours ago, J.C.MacSwell said:

I have to stop binge watching "The Twighlight Zone" before going to bed. You'll never guess who I dreamt was President the last four years.

Another possibility is that someone has been messing around with alternative histories. Parallel-universe plumbing if you will.

[Phi for All]

1 hour ago, Janus said:

But anyone in the Republican party who really understands Trump also knows that Trump would expect to be the major candidate for that new party.  If you strip him of the ability to run for federal office again, you would remove his interest in forming the new party.  

So it's in the GOP's best interests to urge their senators to convict T...., for the future of the party. Or perhaps they'll just offer him $300M or so to fuhgeddaboudit.

[DrmDoc]

6 hours ago, Janus said:

But anyone in the Republican party who really understands Trump also knows that Trump would expect to be the major candidate for that new party.  If you strip him of the ability to run for federal office again, you would remove his interest in forming the new party.  

Although he may be barred from office, Trump's massive vote count in this past election and his insurrection inspiring popularity virtually assures his continued sway over Republican (conservative) politics. Stripped bare, I believe Trump's primary interest is power and his enormous potential sway over conservative politics is power.  With that power he could, for example, threaten the electability of Senators who support a conviction for his seditious efforts to overturn the results of a legitimate election.       

Edited January 21, 2021 by DrmDoc

[iNow]

8 hours ago, Janus said:

But anyone in the Republican party who really understands Trump also knows that Trump would expect to be the major candidate for that new party.  If you strip him of the ability to run for federal office again, you would remove his interest in forming the new party.  

The voters and republicans in state houses around the nation might not like that. Liz Cheney was unanimously censored by Wyoming for failing to represent them when voting in favor of impeachment last week. 

[iNow]

^ *censure

stoopid autocorrect. Promise I never type “ducking” either

[iNow]

On 1/21/2021 at 7:31 PM, iNow said:

The voters and republicans in state houses around the nation might not like that. Liz Cheney was unanimously censured by Wyoming for failing to represent them when voting in favor of impeachment last week. 

And now the Arizona GOPis moving forward with a censure of Doug Ducey, Cindy McCain, and Jeff Flake for not being sufficiently servile and obedient to Trump

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/23/us/politics/arizona-censure-flake-mccain-ducey.html

[StringJunky]

29 minutes ago, iNow said:

And now the Arizona GOPis moving forward with a censure of Doug Ducey, Cindy McCain, and Jeff Flake for not being sufficiently servile and obedient to Trump

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/23/us/politics/arizona-censure-flake-mccain-ducey.html

Looks like the GOP top brass need to impeach and ban Trump to get him out of their hair.

[iNow]

We now see the Oregon Republican party joining in the condemnation... the question is whether this does more to condemn themselves or the target of their ire.

 

Quote

Whereas history tells us that after George Washington appointed Major General Benedict Arnold to command West Point, Arnold conspired to surrender the fort to the British; and

Whereas the ten Republican House members, by voting to impeach President Trump, repeated history by conspiring to surrender our nation to Leftist forces seeking to establish a dictatorship void of all cherished freedoms and liberties....

Whereas there is growing evidence that the violence at the capitol was a “false flag” operation designed to discredit President Trump, his supporters, and all conservative Republicans; this provided the sham motivation to impeach President Trump in order to advance the Democrat goal of seizing total power, in a frightening parallel to the February 1933 burning of the German Reichstag....

That we condemn the betrayal by the following ten Republican members of Congress who voted in lockstep with Nancy Pelosi to support a second sham impeachment....

 

[Janus]

1 hour ago, iNow said:

We now see the Oregon Republican party joining in the condemnation... the question is whether this does more to condemn themselves or the target of their ire.

 

 

  How far the Oregon Republican party has fallen from the days of the likes of Tom McCall and Mark Hatfield.

[swansont]

Bring back the saner days of Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh and Jeff Gillooly/Tonya Harding.

[iNow]

27 minutes ago, Janus said:

How far the Oregon Republican party has fallen from the days of the likes of Tom McCall and Mark Hatfield.

The Republican Party at the federal level is broken. The slide into crazy we see at the state level shows no a sign of abating or slowing. Quite the opposite really 

[StringJunky]

2 hours ago, iNow said:

The Republican Party at the federal level is broken. The slide into crazy we see at the state level shows no a sign of abating or slowing. Quite the opposite really 

A cult of personality pervades the party atm. I thought the insurrection might pull the more sensible GOP members out of it but, it seems, political survival matters more than 'doing the right thing'.

[MigL]

4 hours ago, iNow said:

Whereas the ten Republican House members, by voting to impeach President Trump, repeated history by conspiring to surrender our nation to Leftist forces seeking to establish a dictatorship void of all cherished freedoms and liberties....

Wow !
And silly me thought it was D Trump who was trying to establish a dictatorship...

[J.C.MacSwell]

Doesn't sound that bad. They're comparing the 10 to Benedict Arnold. He finally came around and became one of the good guys...resided in Saint John New Brunswick for some time.

[iNow]

10 hours ago, StringJunky said:

A cult of personality pervades the party atm. I thought the insurrection might pull the more sensible GOP members out of it but, it seems, political survival matters more than 'doing the right thing'.

[CharonY]

On 1/27/2021 at 1:30 PM, StringJunky said:

A cult of personality pervades the party atm. I thought the insurrection might pull the more sensible GOP members out of it but, it seems, political survival matters more than 'doing the right thing'.

I think that shows how broken everything is. Violent insurrection with direct threat to GOP officials should have been the last straw. Instead, even slightly critical GOP officials are backtracking on all fronts. It is scary to think that for a particular segment there appears to be impossible to have any political consequences even for extreme actions anymore.

It seems to legitimize (right-wing) extremism and I am wondering what long-lasting damages that is going to do.

[StringJunky]

1 hour ago, CharonY said:

I think that shows how broken everything is. Violent insurrection with direct threat to GOP officials should have been the last straw. Instead, even slightly critical GOP officials are backtracking on all fronts. It is scary to think that for a particular segment there appears to be impossible to have any political consequences even for extreme actions anymore.

It seems to legitimize (right-wing) extremism and I am wondering what long-lasting damages that is going to do.

 I read they are worried about kickback for "disloyalty". It seems they are in a 'mob rules' situation. I've a feeling they are going to paint themselves into a corner.

Quote

In swing states and GOP bastions, state and local Republican committees are stocked with Trump supporters who remain loyal. Trump critics have been pushed out or marginalized. Party committees from Washington state to South Carolina have moved to punish many of the 10 House Republicans who supported Trump’s impeachment for egging on the deadly Jan. 6 raid of the U.S. Capitol.

Trump’s lock on the party apparatus is the result of a yearslong takeover of an institution he only loosely affiliated with before taking office. The effect amounts to a firewall protecting him and his far-right, nationalist politics from Republicans who argue the party needs a new direction if it wants to win elections.

“It’s come to the point where you have to be with him 100 percent of the time, or you’re the enemy,” said Dave Millage, a former Iowa lawmaker who was pushed out as Scott County GOP chairman after calling for Trump’s impeachment.

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-capitol-siege-trials-washington-impeachments-c83fe958e624c1ead5301407eb8a0347

 

Edited January 29, 2021 by StringJunky

[iNow]

35 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

AP Article: “It’s come to the point where you have to be with him 100 percent of the time, or you’re the enemy”

This, along with the rejection of truth, is how fascism thrives in democratic systems.

Truth is what challenges power... speaking truth to power, etc. When people stop caring about truth, all that remains is power and all that matters is loyalty / fealty to the godhead wielding it.  

[StringJunky]

42 minutes ago, iNow said:

This, along with the rejection of truth, is how fascism thrives in democratic systems.

Truth is what challenges power... speaking truth to power, etc. When people stop caring about truth, all that remains is power and all that matters is loyalty / fealty to the godhead wielding it.  

Look at the admiration he has expressed in the past for Putin, XI, Kim et al. I wouldn't be surprised if he would like to emulate them.

Edited January 29, 2021 by StringJunky

[CharonY]

41 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

Look at the admiration he has expressed in the past for Putin, XI, Kim et al. I wouldn't be surprised if he would like to emulate them.

Well and there are reports that Trump might have been groomed as a Russian asset since the 80s. https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-cultivating-trump-asset-40-years-says-ex-kgb-spy-2021-1

Quote

"He was an asset. It was not this grand, ingenious plan that we're going to develop this guy and 40 years later he'll be president," Unger told The Guardian.

Unger added: "Trump was the perfect target in a lot of ways: his vanity, narcissism made him a natural target to recruit. He was cultivated over a 40-year period, right up through his election."

Trump's 1987 book, "The Art of the Deal," described a visit to Moscow to discuss building "a large luxury hotel across the street from the Kremlin in partnership with the Soviet government."

In fact, Shvets said, Russian operatives used the trip to flatter Trump and told him he should go into politics. Shvets told The Guardian that KGB operatives were then stunned to discover that Trump had returned to the United States, mulled a run for office, and taken out a full-page ad in several newspapers that echoed anti-Western Russian talking points.

 

[iNow]

Current state of FBI arrests after the siege on the capitol

 

[BigR]

I have spent my study years in the 90ies, back then America was the leader in technology and politics.

Europe was in construction and the Internet was still young, I'm confident the US will recover from the Trump presidency.

 

[iNow]

Two of the Republican Senators who voted to convict Trump, Bill Cassidy (LA) and Richard Burr (NC), both of whom were extremely loyal to and supportive of Trump throughout his presidency, were IMMEDIATELY censured by local governments back in their home state as a result of their vote. 

[zapatos]

6 minutes ago, iNow said:

Two of the Republican Senators who voted to convict Trump, Bill Cassidy (LA) and Richard Burr (NC), both of whom were extremely loyal to and supportive of Trump throughout his presidency, were IMMEDIATELY censured by local governments back in their home state as a result of their vote. 

"Cancel" culture by those "woke" politicians!

[Prof Reza Sanaye]

On 1/6/2021 at 5:55 PM, MigL said:

I don't believe so.
The last couple of months of the President's even crazier behavior, with the election fraud claims and tampering, and the mess with Covid relief payouts, has fractured the Republican party, and looks to have given democrats control of the Senate; something they wouldn't have even imagines 2 months ago.

Democrats themselves are in bad need of reformation towards the Left. All throughout  this last presidential election, Democrats were able to show of themselves the greatest-ever recorded ability to quench the not-very-hidden desire inside their party to shed off those elements striving to return Democrats back to those policies that are not paid for by the Wall Street & by the Corporate America . .. . . .The present president  is not gonna go far in preventing the not-very-far-from-now total collapse of the extremely biased capitalistic system in the  US  of  A.