Hydrogen Car

[radiohead]

What is up?

 

Me and a friend of mine are going to be attempting to turn his car into a hydrogen fueled car. The way we see it, it would actually help the ecosystem because it would be releasing much needed oxygen into the atmosphere instead of CO2 (I think?). If we succeed we will be entering it in for scholarships and the like.

 

We are both going into a field of some kind of Physics. I know he wants Theoretical, I dunno what I am doing though. Anyway, does anyone have any suggestions on some ways to do this? Has anyone had any experience in trying to make one and have any tips?

 

Thanks for any help.

 

 

EDIT: First, we will be working with lawn mowers, then go karts, and if they work out, THEN we will try it on his car....

[ydoaPs]

http://www.switch2hydrogen.com/

[radiohead]

No, we are planning on using water as "gas" and separating teh Hydrogen from teh oxygen through electricity, emitting teh oxygen and burning teh hydrogen. No tanks like that.

[ydoaPs]

might as well just make the whole thing electrical

[Lance]

You're trying to break a few laws of physics. It won't work.

[CPL.Luke]

when you burn hydrogen it combines with oxygen. essentially you'll be putting in more energy than you get out

[x__heavenly__x]

who cares, we have a lot of oxygen and hydrogen to spare,rite?

[insane_alien]

no he means that the energy you use to split water (you might as well just keep it liquid its more efficient for storage) will overwhelm any energy you get from burning the hydrogen. if you use oxygen from the air to burn hydrogen then the combustion will be more inefficent than burning the hydrogen with the oxygen produced. the air is not pure O2 so you need to cram in more to burn the hydrogen.

[Dak]

I dont suppose that their is a catalyst for

 

2H₂O --> 2H₂ + O₂

 

?

 

If so, could that make the system work by lowering the activation energy of the splitting of H₂O and what-not?

[insane_alien]

not really no.

 

water is split like this:

 

2H20 <---> 2H+ + 2OH- then a voltage is applied to electrolys the dissolved ions into

 

2H+ + 2OH- ---> 2H2 + O2

 

as far as i know there are no catalyst for the first reaction but i will look into it.

[Dak]

This is streatching my memory a bit, but dont acids form H₂O:H⁺ ?

 

What would happen if you added that to peroxide? Would it be:

 

2H₂O:H⁺ + H₂O₂ --> 4H₂O + heat?

 

In which case a catalyst for the formation of peroxide or the h-3-o thingy might also work (?) if they exist.

[swansont]

I dont suppose that their is a catalyst for

 

2H₂O --> 2H₂ + O₂

 

?

 

If so' date=' could that make the system work by lowering the activation energy of the splitting of H[sub']2[/sub]O and what-not?

 

It's not a matter of activation energy. The amount of energy released in the combustion is the minimum that has to be added, no matter what route you take. There's no getting around this - that's not what a catalyst does.

[Dak]

Stoopid inconvenient Hess related gubbins

 

Curse you first law of thermodynamics; you win again

[insane_alien]

yes acids form hydronium(sp?) which is H3O+ which is a hydrogen ion attached by a dative bond to the water molecule but for the purposes of explaining it including the hydronium would only serve to complicate the thng more than necessary

[vrus]

Firstly, if you want to electolyse water, extract H2 gas from it, then combust it, your process will be quite inefficient. By burning Hydrogen in a car's engine, you won't produce Oxygen, but rather water. Thirdly, a petrol or diesel car's engine is designed for that fuel only, taking into consideration the flash point, ingnition point, etc. If you use H2 gas as fuel in a petrol car's engine, you will have knocking and improper functioning. You might as well build your own engine.

 

If you add a Grp. I metal, i.e - Sodium, Lithium, Potassium to water, you make alkali and Hydrogen. The H2 production is much faster. You could also add something like Mg to HCl and get H2 from that.

 

I remember seeing something about a bunch of people making a hydrogen run car. They used solar panels for electricity to electrolyse water.

 

Fuel Cells are way better though.