Jordan Peterson's ideas on politis

[Peterkin]

Seriously? A rude university professor started the French Revolution, the Bolshevik Revolution and the Holocaust? I can only stand so much hyperbole. Deal me out.

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Peterkin

[MigL]

4 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

After or for? Name three of each, with credible citations. Okay, name one. 

But you've already made up your mind that any I name, have lost their jobs for being ignorant bigots, not just for being labelled ignorant bigots.
That is your problem; that you misinterpret a different opinion as being ignorant and bigoted.
People are allowed to have their own personal opinion, not one foisted on them by someone else. IOW, you get to see reality as you observe it yourself, not what someone else wants you to see.
( for the 37th time )

[zapatos]

6 minutes ago, MigL said:

The French Revolution, the October ( actually November ) Revolution of the Bolsheviks and the Nazi 'night of broken glass', involved all of those things.
How did the 'adversarial system' work out for those societies ?

Three democracies! (although Putin has been a bad influence)

 

 

[MigL]

7 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

Deal me out.

You haven't been playing with a full deck for a while.
Did you read Zap's post, where he made comparisons to M McConnell and Supreme Court nominations ?
Or are your blinders on all the time ?

[zapatos]

1 minute ago, MigL said:

Did you read Zap's post, where he made comparisons to M McConnell and Supreme Court nominations ?

Was there something wrong with that post?

 

[MigL]

3 minutes ago, zapatos said:

Three democracies! (although Putin has been a bad influence)

With how many victims ?
( but we both know this is off topic. Revolutions are never a good way to solve society's problems )

[zapatos]

Just now, MigL said:

With how many victims ?

Lots. Why?

 

[MigL]

Just now, zapatos said:

Was there something wrong with that post?

Not at all.
But you did mention that the 'adversarial system' works best, and I provided some examples where it didn't.
Would you be happier with the American Civil War ?

[zapatos]

1 minute ago, MigL said:

Not at all.
But you did mention that the 'adversarial system' works best, and I provided some examples where it didn't.
Would you be happier with the American Civil War ?

You misunderstood what I said.

I didn't say "the adversarial system works best". I said the Kathleen Stock story (and the extended brouhaha surrounding society working out how to handle gender) was an example of "the adversarial system AT its best". I would say your examples were the adversarial system at its worst.

[koti]

This 49 minute interview with Kathleen Stock done by another lesbian activist was eye opening to me. I was aware of some of the issues they are discussing but I did not realise the incredible level and grotesqueness of the actual mess. Professor Stock and professor Peterson should do a talk together, I’m sure they would find a mutual understanding on fundamental issues and could have a fruitful exchange of ideas on the issues they disagree on. 
 

 

[StringJunky]

For them,  transgenderism is an extreme ideology. The irony is that they are promoting an ideology themselves that gender is binary. The interviewer "...campaigns against male violence and extreme transgenderism".  How can transgenderism be 'extreme'? It either is or isn't.

Edited November 7, 2021 by StringJunky

[koti]

22 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

For them,  transgenderism is an extreme ideology. The irony is that they are promoting an ideology themselves that gender is binary. The interviewer "...campaigns against male violence and extreme transgenderism".  How can transgenderism be 'extreme'? It either is or isn't.

If you’ve watched the interview, listened to the witch hunt stories she told and it still isn’t clear what „extreme transgenderism” is   I’m not able to explain.

[StringJunky]

10 minutes ago, koti said:

If you’ve watched the interview, listened to the witch hunt stories she told and it still isn’t clear what „extreme transgenderism” is   I’m not able to explain.

How people are pursuing it to be heard may be extreme but the status itself is no more an ideology than their lesbianism. Basically, it appears that there is a schism being formed within the LGBTQ banner.

Edited November 7, 2021 by StringJunky

[MigL]

42 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

For them,  transgenderism is an extreme ideology. The irony is that they are promoting an ideology themselves that gender is binary. The interviewer "...campaigns against male violence and extreme transgenderism".  How can transgenderism be 'extreme'? It either is or isn't.

The difference is that only one side tries to shut the other side's opinions down with claims of ignorance, bigotism, shutting down lectures/talks, and getting the opposing opinion fired.
So which one is extreme ???

[koti]

5 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

How people are pursuing it to be heard may be extreme but the status itself is no more an ideology than their lesbianism. Basically, it appears that there is a schism being formed within the LGBTQ banner.

Like my gay neighbour said the other day, everything that the gay community was fighting for in the last few decades is being undermined right now. Call it schism, division or whatever, its a grotesque mess on so many levels. 

[StringJunky]

5 minutes ago, koti said:

Like my gay neighbour said the other day, everything that the gay community was fighting for in the last few decades is being undermined right now. Call it schism, division or whatever, its a grotesque mess on so many levels. 

It will probably get worse before it gets better. Don't forget, these minorities are labelled under the same banner and have been since I can remember.... and now some of each are vocally falling out, regressing back into the traditional male-female divide.

[zapatos]

30 minutes ago, koti said:

Like my gay neighbour said the other day, everything that the gay community was fighting for in the last few decades is being undermined right now.

Perhaps I've misunderstood but I was under the impression that it was transgender rights where all the heat was now, not so much gay rights. 

[StringJunky]

7 minutes ago, zapatos said:

Perhaps I've misunderstood but I was under the impression that it was transgender rights where all the heat was now, not so much gay rights. 

In his country they still have some way to go in just accepting gays... his PiS govt is anti, so it's  likely a hot button issue for him and his compatriots.

Edited November 7, 2021 by StringJunky

[zapatos]

2 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

In his country they still have some way to go in just accepting gays... his PiS govt is anti, so it's  likely a hot button issue for him and his compatriots.

Ah, I see. Thanks.

[koti]

53 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

…regressing back into the traditional male-female divide.

It’s not about that Stringy, its about forcing people into things, about witch hunts, people loosing their jobs and being ostracised, some driven to suicide by their own community (the Dave Chappelle story which no one wants to believe here) some driven out of their work like Kathleen Stock. The fact that this happened to a lesbian philosophy professor who teaches feminism just adds to the grotesqueness. Imagine if she was a straight white male. 

Edited November 7, 2021 by koti

[iNow]

4 hours ago, MigL said:

The difference is that only one side tries to shut the other side's opinions down with claims of ignorance, bigotism, shutting down lectures/talks, and getting the opposing opinion fired.
So which one is extreme ???

Thank you for finally focusing on the REAL problem… reminding us all to ignore the pursuit of respect and acceptance for transgender pronouns and to instead direct our energies toward the REAL victims in all of this… those poor souls who refuse that acceptance and respect of pronouns and force transgenders individuals into inaccurate binary buckets. You’re a hero sir for standing up so passionately for them. 

3 hours ago, koti said:

some driven to suicide by their own community (the Dave Chappelle story which no one wants to believe here)

Who here doesn’t believe the story Chappelle shared? I seem to have missed that part of this thread and would appreciate a quote or retraction. 

[koti]

On 10/29/2021 at 12:47 AM, Peterkin said:

Is that an example of legal or job-related repercussions of pronoun usage?

And you've fact-checked it? And you found that it fits the criteria of establishment persecution of non-conformity?

 

On 10/29/2021 at 1:05 AM, CharonY said:

How is that related to 

Assuming that it actually happened as described, are you saying that because members of a given community behaved badly one should be free to discriminate against them? Or what is the argument here? 

 

24 minutes ago, iNow said:

Who here doesn’t believe the story Chappelle shared? I seem to have missed that part of this thread and would appreciate a quote or retraction. 

Doesn't believe, doesn't give a shit, whatever.

[iNow]

I find myself wondering if you have ever been formally diagnosed with reading comprehension problems

[MigL]

2 hours ago, iNow said:

You’re a hero sir for standing up so passionately for them. 

Thank you INow.
I didn't realize you held me in such high esteem.

Or should I go see a doctor to diagnose my reading comprehension problems ?
😄 😄

[iNow]

45 minutes ago, MigL said:

Thank you INow.
I didn't realize you held me in such high esteem.

I very much do, which is part of why this conversation matters so much to me