studiot Posted January 21, 2022 Posted January 21, 2022 15 minutes ago, Arthur Smith said: Pasteur first noticed sodium aluminium tartrate formed crystals of two sorts which, when sorted by eye and redissolved, the solutions were either dextrotatory or levorotatory, leading to the idea that molecules could form enantiomers, spacially opposite mirror reflections. But hang on, here's an article about Japp: http://www.scielo.org.za/pdf/sajs/v103n1-2/06.pdf OK, vitalism. Chirality arises from some fundamental law or is just an accident? That's a great story, the Dorothy L Sayers plot an all Actually an off topic aside but Buckingham's book is a great read, including examples of where chirality matters a great deal, eg the Thalidomide story. Also actually my question was about chemical kinetics, not chemical chirality. I am observing that a particular sequence of chemical events brought about Life, but there could be other ones or other occurrences of the same sequence. Chemical kinetics is based on statistics and a proper statistical analysis of these various alternatives would bring greater insight.
Arthur Smith Posted January 21, 2022 Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, studiot said: Actually an off topic aside but Buckingham's book is a great read, including examples of where chirality matters a great deal, eg the Thalidomide story. Also actually my question was about chemical kinetics, not chemical chirality. I am observing that a particular sequence of chemical events brought about Life, but there could be other ones or other occurrences of the same sequence. Chemical kinetics is based on statistics and a proper statistical analysis of these various alternatives would bring greater insight. Well, not sure about the connection to thalidomide (there is a Kékulé ring in there). The thalidomide tragedy certainly highlighted the lack of drug regulation. The molecule exists in two enantiomers and I presume the drug was administered as a racemic mixture. Are you suggesting all the therapeutic worth was in one enantiomer and all the disastrous side effects in the other? When I consider origin of life, I consider opportunity and emergence. Given scenario A, what emerges? There is no "bringing about" force. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Found it. [Planetary Dreams: The Quest to Discover Life Beyond Earth] Shapiro's take on RNA world is understandable from his viewpoint as a chemist. But that is a sideshow to the main theme which is advocating a search for the second data point, life elsewhere. The Second Data Point. Maybe a topic for another thread. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Shapiro_(chemist) A discussion elsewhere on origin of life. Mikkel Rasmussen has assembled a plethora of articles and there is ensuing discussion. https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/raw-materials-for-life/13951 https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/landmark-achievement-in-rna-world-experiments/13956 Edited January 21, 2022 by Arthur Smith
studiot Posted January 22, 2022 Posted January 22, 2022 15 hours ago, Arthur Smith said: Well, not sure about the connection to thalidomide (there is a Kékulé ring in there). The thalidomide tragedy certainly highlighted the lack of drug regulation. The molecule exists in two enantiomers and I presume the drug was administered as a racemic mixture. Are you suggesting all the therapeutic worth was in one enantiomer and all the disastrous side effects in the other? When I consider origin of life, I consider opportunity and emergence. Given scenario A, what emerges? There is no "bringing about" force. How is this a reply to my question ? 17 hours ago, studiot said: Also actually my question was about chemical kinetics, not chemical chirality.
Arthur Smith Posted January 22, 2022 Posted January 22, 2022 (edited) What about chemical kinetics? Not sure what you want to know. 19 hours ago, studiot said: I am observing that a particular sequence of chemical events brought about Life, but there could be other ones or other occurrences of the same sequence. Chemical kinetics is based on statistics and a proper statistical analysis of these various alternatives would bring greater insight. There isn't a question there. (Horizontal line) @studiot And my comment about chirality was in response to your question about Japp's theory of chirality, for which I haven't been able to find a clear statement. I'd still like to establish what that is, if only to draw a line under it. Shapiro's book is very much in line with the thread topic and wasn't directed at you particularly. Forum software insists on merging replies which is why I've been adding horizontal lines. Edited January 22, 2022 by Arthur Smith
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