Might Makes Right & that is the Truth

[RamaRaksha]

My interest is religion and I was told by an African-American co-worker, a "friend", I had mistakenly thought, that I was headed to hell!

Simply based on my belief - religion or lack of it - "Works don't matter" He says

It struck me that all this religion did was to replace the words "skin color" with "religion" and my black co-worker now fully embraced Racist ideas of division and hate

Amazing, isn't it? Here was this black person who, I do not doubt, endured Racism and Discrimination based on nothing but skin color - To Racists that's all that mattered, his skin color. Who he was as a person - HIS WORKS - did not matter

That was the same abuse that Jews faced under the Nazis - who they were as people did not matter - what they did in life did not matter. One factor alone, their religion, condemned them to gas chambers. Just like the Racist, the Nazi did not see a human being  - one who had a family, loved ones. These people were Doctors, Scientists(luckily Einstein escaped), Teachers, Businessmen and of course Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Children, even babies! But none of that mattered to the Nazis

And here was a black person OPENLY mouthing the SAME hate! To his "God", who I am does not matter, all that mattered was whether I was a supporter or not. Me, my loved ones, children, babies, women, entire families to be set apart & dumped into gas chambers in hell!

It is crazy to think that in the Free world, "God" is none other than a Putin, a Saddam - "believe in me, support me & be rewarded or else!"

While Nazis and Racist have been condemned, religious division and hate is OPENLY PREACHED!

All religion has done is to change the word Putin to God, skin color to religion and my black "friend" now became a willing Nazi, a willing Racist & there are millions like him who hold the same views 

Tell them they share the same views of Racists and they would be shocked!

In the 21st century! Might Makes Right because not one Moral or Educated person has ever spoken up against such ideas! NOT ONE!

[zapatos]

What is it you wish to discuss? This sounds more like a blog post.

[Phi for All]

!

Moderator Note

This is a science discussion forum. It's not a pulpit or a soapbox for your grievances. Pick part of this rant and decide what you want others to join you in discussing. And please avoid generalizations and assertions you can't support, like your last sentence. Do better, please.

 

[Peterkin]

And that ^^^, too!

 

You have a problem with religion - OK. It seems to be particularly with Christianity - OK.

You also have a problem with politics and and race and how the world is organized,  but I can't work out what that is.

Could you maybe sort out your problems and present them coherently, one at a time, for discussion?

Edited February 15, 2022 by Peterkin

[MyCall]

This is pretty confusing. The title of your post is intricating. Unfortunately I can not react, since your question is unclear.

[Peterkin]

What, please means "intricating"?

[zapatos]

It's called a "typo".

[Peterkin]

2 hours ago, zapatos said:

It's called a "typo".

If you know that, perhaps you also know its definition.

Edited September 11, 2022 by Peterkin

[iNow]

Intriguing 

[Peterkin]

2 hours ago, iNow said:

Intriguing 

Really? And is it? 

[NTuft]

5 hours ago, Peterkin said:

What, please means "intricating"?

from a search, the present participle of intricate.
I do not think it is confusing or intricating, but a semi-professional sophistry exercise, pinned to the board here for entymology study.

[Peterkin]

3 minutes ago, NTuft said:

from a search, the present participle of intricate.
I do not think it is confusing or intricating, but a semi-professional sophistry exercise, pinned to the board here for entymology study.

That would have been more intriguating.

[exchemist]

2 hours ago, NTuft said:

from a search, the present participle of intricate.
I do not think it is confusing or intricating, but a semi-professional sophistry exercise, pinned to the board here for entymology study.

Ballocks. Participles belong to verbs. There is no verb to intricate, or to be intricated.

[mistermack]

In answer to the OP, I don't find it at all surprising. Black people can be racist too. In fact, it's racist to argue that they can't.

Everyone of any colour is born with racist tendencies. It takes a lot of indoctrination to get people to abandon it. We have a constant drip drip throughout our lives, of those in charge telling us how bad it is to judge people on superficial differences, like skin colour or sexuality. I personally think that's a good thing to do, not all indoctrination is bad. And I would argue that we should add religion to the long list. It is in a lot of instances.

But of course, many religions are hemmed in by their own doctrine. If it was written thousands of years ago that unbelievers will roast in hell, then you are obliged to believe that, because " It's written ". So the OP's friend can pass the buck, and put the blame for his semi racism on the scriptures. 

Of course, that opens the door for people to find a few words in scriptures to justify killing unbelievers. 

Genetically, we are programmed to do that, because we evolved from a territorial ape ancestor who fought and killed it's neighbours for millions of years, to survive. Those who didn't have that instinct probably got killed and eaten, so we don't have their genes today. 

[dimreepr]

2 minutes ago, mistermack said:

In answer to the OP, I don't find it at all surprising. Black people can be racist too. In fact, it's racist to argue that they can't.

Ohh, the irony... How deep are you going to dig this hole???

[iNow]

Nobody (worth our time or attention) argues that a person with increased melanin content in their skin cannot be racist. That’s a man made of straw from the outset. 

[zapatos]

1 hour ago, mistermack said:

Black people can be racist too. In fact, it's racist to argue that they can't.

Seems like you are begging the question. 

1 hour ago, mistermack said:

Everyone of any colour is born with racist tendencies.

Citation please.

[iNow]

19 minutes ago, zapatos said:

Citation please.

He’s using a very loose definition of racism in an attempt to conflate an infants ability to distinguish colors and patterns to be the same as “racist”

[mistermack]

2 hours ago, iNow said:

Nobody (worth our time or attention) argues that a person with increased melanin content in their skin cannot be racist. That’s a man made of straw from the outset. 

Nobody is arguing that. But the OP is expressing amazement that a black person should behave about religion in the same way that racists do about race. That's what I responded to, as I made clear in my post. 

 

1 hour ago, iNow said:

He’s using a very loose definition of racism in an attempt to conflate an infants ability to distinguish colors and patterns to be the same as “racist”

What complete rot. I'm responding to the fact that racism has been a constant feature of mankind's behaviour, for millenia. Or did I dream that the USA was built up on the backs of black slaves, who could be bought and sold at will? Or that it's less than a lifetime ago that there were seperate entrances for the races in the USA, and seperate drinking fountains? Or that white US cops are still more prone to kill a black than a white? In spite that is, of huge efforts by educationalists and media to preach equality. 

If there was no preaching of equality and tolerance in schools and the media, I think it's perfectly obvious that racism would be rife. You can't ignore the past.

As I said, I believe that we have racist genes, and tolerance genes, and millions of others. The racist ones helped our ancestors survive. They lived in extended family groups who had to be aggressively territorial to survive, just as chimpanzees do today. 

[iNow]

It may be hidden amidst all the self righteousness and moral outrage so maybe I just missed it, but I see nothing there which addresses the point I made. 

6 minutes ago, mistermack said:

As I said, I believe that we have racist genes, and tolerance genes, and millions of others. The racist ones helped our ancestors survive.

Yes, and I notice you have still failed to provide a citation for that despite a direct request to please do so. 

[mistermack]

5 minutes ago, iNow said:

Yes, and I notice you have still failed to provide a citation for that despite a direct request to please do so. 

Do you then think that humans have no inherent racist tendency? I'd like to see your citation for that. 

[iNow]

9 minutes ago, mistermack said:

Do you then think that humans have no inherent racist tendency? I'd like to see your citation for that. 

Thank you for sharing. Now, will you please address the request for supporting evidence for the claim you DID make and not continue evading by asking me for evidence of claims I did NOT make?

[mistermack]

2 minutes ago, iNow said:

Thank you for sharing. Now, will you please address the request for supporting evidence for the claim you DID make and not continue evading by asking me for evidence of claims I did NOT make?

No, I'm not going to research the bleedin obvious for you. If you disagree that humans have a racist tendency, say why. I've said why I think they do have and where I think it comes from. I've pointed to some racist instances, I could go on all day. If you think it just appears from nowhere, you need to justify that, in the same way that I have. I pointed to our evolutionary history, you've just parroted yourself. 

[swansont]

10 minutes ago, mistermack said:

No, I'm not going to research the bleedin obvious for you. If you disagree that humans have a racist tendency, say why

!

Moderator Note

The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim.

 

[mistermack]

2 minutes ago, swansont said:

!

Moderator Note

The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim.

 

I believe I did support my claim, with references to human evolution. It's a wide field. If you don't think human evolution was of a fiercely territorial nature, then you don't even have the basics and citations would mean nothing to you. However, here are a few : 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/004724847690035X  

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1364661321001522   

https://www.vox.com/2014/4/28/5661186/evolution-war-cause 

I think you have to be pretty blind NOT to detect any aggressive racist or territorial tendency in human nature, but if you can't work it out for yourself, then the evidence is abundant. Google is great for finding stuff out. I can recommend it.