Hijack from The finches of Darwin were all the same species, but Darwin thought they would be interlinked different species

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

On 8/15/2020 at 8:54 AM, Maestro99 said:

Nobody ever witnessed the Transformation of a fish into a Walking Amphibic creature. Why did your precious Makroevolution suddenly stop? Where are the many inbetween species which must be found in the geological structures?

Charles Darwin was a smart man for his time but for modern science his theories are not plausible anymore.

Yes, he has a good point. At the time that Darwin discovered those finches, they thought that a cell was just an empty space that made up a body, not the complex mechanism we know it is today.

May I also add that the beaks had differences of less than a centimeter, only about 18.92 millimeters.

Earnst Haekel's embryo evolution was a fraud. He just drew the pictures without evidence, and they're not even accurate. They don't show real pictures, that's because there are no pictures, it can't be proven, but still it's shown in science textbooks. They even know they're wrong, but they still do.

Then there's Nebraska man. A whole in-between species made up because of a pig tooth.

The Java man, they found a monkey skull cap and a human thigh bone close to each other and called it Java man, a "new species".

 

Carbon dating can't tell how old the earth is, it's incredibly inaccurate, it once showed a 3 year old bone to be thousands of years old, and animals that have different carbon dating for different parts. There are some large animals that were carbon dated and they got different dates for different parts of the body.

[StringJunky]

24 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

Yes, he has a good point. At the time that Darwin discovered those finches, they thought that a cell was just an empty space that made up a body, not the complex mechanism we know it is today.

May I also add that the beaks had differences of less than a centimeter, only about 18.92 millimeters.

Earnst Haekel's embryo evolution was a fraud. He just drew the pictures without evidence, and they're not even accurate. They don't show real pictures, that's because there are no pictures, it can't be proven, but still it's shown in science textbooks. They even know they're wrong, but they still do.

Then there's Nebraska man. A whole in-between species made up because of a pig tooth.

The Java man, they found a monkey skull cap and a human thigh bone close to each other and called it Java man, a "new species".

 

Carbon dating can't tell how old the earth is, it's incredibly inaccurate, it once showed a 3 year old bone to be thousands of years old, and animals that have different carbon dating for different parts. There are some large animals that were carbon dated and they got different dates for different parts of the body.

To cut to the chase: you prefer the idea of an invisible sky fairy putting us together instantly as is with just a thought?

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

The chart of evolution, the one with monkeys progressing from monkeys to humans, just shows both made up species and monkeys drawn as standing up.

18 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

To cut to the chase: you prefer the idea of an invisible sky fairy putting us together instantly as is with just a thought?

What? You are the one who believes that every complex living creature that's made perfectly all happened by chance after a big bang. Can you fit the entire universe into a period-sized space, I would like to see you try.

18 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

To cut to the chase: you prefer the idea of an invisible sky fairy putting us together instantly as is with just a thought?

Every simple machine has a designer. Not to mention complex machines. There was a study that tried to make a cell by recreating the "early-Earth's" atmosphere, but all they made was toxic gasses, like you, and a few amino acids, but to make a cell, you would need those to form proteins, then the proteins to form a cell. This study was also designed by humans.

18 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

To cut to the chase: you prefer the idea of an invisible sky fairy putting us together instantly as is with just a thought?

Also, God isn't a fairy. There are recorded historical documents of what we believe. You only have made up monkey/human species and guesses on how the earth began, we have multiple documents on the events of Jesus's life.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Ocho Cinco Jr

[StringJunky]

20 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

The chart of evolution, the one with monkeys progressing from monkeys to humans, just shows both made up species and monkeys drawn as standing up.

What? You are the one who believes that every complex living creature that's made perfectly all happened by chance after a big bang. Can you fit the entire universe into a period-sized space, I would like to see you try.

 I am not totally and permanently committed to any idea if new evidence suggests otherwise. When one has a belief, it means one is necessarily intransigent to new thoughts. I'm not going to argue with those commonly expressed misconceptions you just posted as it would be a waste of my time, since you believe something, do you not?

Edited June 7, 2022 by StringJunky

[sethoflagos]

31 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

Every simple machine has a designer.

What is your understanding of the word 'machine'? 

Stars are machines. In that they convert mass into electromagnetic radiation.

And yet they seem to self assemble from merely a locally higher than average abundance of hydrogen. No apparent intervention by any 'designer' here.

[StringJunky]

32 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

Also, God isn't a fairy. There are recorded historical documents of what we believe. You only have made up monkey/human species and guesses on how the earth began, we have multiple documents on the events of Jesus's life.

i think it's best you discuss your ideas in a forum where people are more receptive to your preferred version of the Universe and Earth's history. A literal religious interpretation and scientific conversation put together are like oil and water.

[exchemist]

2 hours ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

Yes, he has a good point. At the time that Darwin discovered those finches, they thought that a cell was just an empty space that made up a body, not the complex mechanism we know it is today.

May I also add that the beaks had differences of less than a centimeter, only about 18.92 millimeters.

Earnst Haekel's embryo evolution was a fraud. He just drew the pictures without evidence, and they're not even accurate. They don't show real pictures, that's because there are no pictures, it can't be proven, but still it's shown in science textbooks. They even know they're wrong, but they still do.

Then there's Nebraska man. A whole in-between species made up because of a pig tooth.

The Java man, they found a monkey skull cap and a human thigh bone close to each other and called it Java man, a "new species".

 

Carbon dating can't tell how old the earth is, it's incredibly inaccurate, it once showed a 3 year old bone to be thousands of years old, and animals that have different carbon dating for different parts. There are some large animals that were carbon dated and they got different dates for different parts of the body.

Your ignorance is showing. Nobody uses carbon dating for objects more than a few thousand years old. 

I won’t bother with your other statements. Posting this level of junk on a science forum is pointless. 

[mistermack]

8 hours ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

we have multiple documents on the events of Jesus's life.

We have multiple documents on the events of Harry Potter's life, and the miracles he performed. 

A document is just a written-down thought. If you accept all thoughts just because somebody wrote it, you're basically a mug, wide open to any loony theory. And in fact, all of the documents that you refer to were written by people who never met Jesus. 

The one exception is St. Paul, who met Jesus "in a vision". 

Your documents are worthless as evidence. 

[swansont]

!

Moderator Note

Discussion of religion in a science thread is a hijack; I've moved this to speculations in case people want to follow up on the nonsense posted in the OP

Unsubstantiated claims carry no weight; if you don't follow scientific rigor this will end up in the trash

 

 

Such as "May I also add that the beaks had differences of less than a centimeter, only about 18.92 millimeters."

18.92 mm is almost 2 cm, so this makes no sense. And that's a lot for a beak of a bird that are between 10 and 20 cm in length. If the beak itself were a cm or 2, even a couple of mm difference would be a large variation

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin's_finches

"Carbon dating can't tell how old the earth is, it's incredibly inaccurate, it once showed a 3 year old bone to be thousands of years old, and animals that have different carbon dating for different parts. There are some large animals that were carbon dated and they got different dates for different parts of the body."

Nobody uses carbon dating to show the age of the earth; all this shows is how little you actually understand about it

And if you're going to cite examples you will need to link to where you found the claim, because the source may have fabricated it (not uncommon) or it may be taken out of context so that the meaning is distorted (also not uncommon). Unfortunately a lot of people claiming evolution is wrong do not hesitate to lie about the evidence, so simply pulling material from somewhere is problematic. 

 

 

 

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

On 8/15/2020 at 9:28 AM, Strange said:

Evolution very obviously happens in nature and is witnessed all the time. It has been known about for thousands of years. It is daft to deny that.

What Wallace and Darwin did is propose an explanation for how evolution happens. That explanation has been shown to be correct. 

"Finch" is not a species. The birds known as finches are made up of several genera and hundreds of species.

There is no species called "DOG".

Both microevolution and macroevolution occur. That is an observable fact. New species arise from evolution. That is an observable fact.

The theory of evolution (and genetics) explain how and why this happens.

You can keep denying it, but the evidence is strongly against you.

Why do you keep focussing on Darwin and ignoring the evidence?

 

And who said whales walk on land? If you are resorting to stupid fallacies like this, you don't have much of an argument.

 

Yes it has. The world is a truly amazing place. You should take your nose out of that Book and learn about.

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/when-whales-walked-on-four-legs.html

Apparently the natural history museum says whales walked on land.

"Evolution has been clearly witnessed and observed." When, may I ask has it been witnessed or observed?

Yes, the world is amazing and works like clockwork, perfectly. It's just amazing that could happen by accident I say sarcastically.😏 The most amazing machines have designers though. FYI, people who read and study learn more, so you get your head in that book.

I don't understand why the finches would be different species if the differences between the beaks were less than a quarter of a centimeter.

The evidence is always against YOU. You just always say, "look at the science." What do you think the Christian scientists do?

On 8/15/2020 at 9:13 AM, Phi for All said:

We can see that dolphins and whales still, to this day, have pelvic bones where legs had developed, which is strong evidence they walked on land. Other factors also support this. So far, your only argument is your incredulity (which is basically you saying "Since I can't believe this happened, it didn't"). All of your arguments so far have been refuted many, MANY times by many people. Even the Pope acknowledges that evolution is a fact. You have no support for your arguments, and this is a science discussion forum.

Those bones have been found to be important for mating, not for legs.

[iNow]

15 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

What do you think the Christian scientists do?

They probably troll through threads like this to neg rep a bunch of people 2 years after they made their post. #NecroNegs

[StringJunky]

Run out of reactions to reverse all the unjustified negs.

[iNow]

I took care of a bunch, too

[StringJunky]

39 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

Yes, the world is amazing and works like clockwork, perfectly. It's just amazing that could happen by accident I say sarcastically.😏 The most amazing machines have designers though. FYI, people who read and study learn more, so you get your head in that book.

FYI Arete is an expert geneticist, he teaches it at university-level.

It's not totally random. Certain natural processes are fully deterministic . That means their behaviour is predictable, but the random or accidental part is when that predictable behaviour will occur. For instance, if two single reactable molecules are put in an enclosed space, at some point they will collide and form a new predictable compound, but we don't know when. Multiply that with an exponential number of reactable particles over an exponential amount of time, we get evolution, whereby these discrete reactions accumulate into discrete systems, increasing in complexity to what we have today.

 @iNow  cool

Edited June 8, 2022 by StringJunky

[sethoflagos]

1 hour ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

"Evolution has been clearly witnessed and observed." When, may I ask has it been witnessed or observed?

Over the last couple of years, earth's entire population has witnessed and observed the real-time evolution of coronavirus. 

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

22 hours ago, sethoflagos said:

Over the last couple of years, earth's entire population has witnessed and observed the real-time evolution of coronavirus. 

VIRUSES AREN'T ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

23 hours ago, StringJunky said:

FYI Arete is an expert geneticist, he teaches it at university-level.

I agree with Arete.

On 6/7/2022 at 10:13 PM, iNow said:

They probably troll through threads like this to neg rep a bunch of people 2 years after they made their post. #NecroNegs

I'm not trolling.

[iNow]

You might not be doing it as your primary intent…

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

1 minute ago, iNow said:

You might not be doing it as your primary intent…

I'm not even trying to troll. I'm just stating my beliefs and if you don't want to believe me, you don't have to.

[iNow]

Just now, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

if you don't want to believe me, you don't have to.

I wasn’t exactly awaiting your permission. On another note, if you don’t want to eat bananas, you don’t have to. This has a weight roughly equivalent to your statement quoted here. 

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

7 minutes ago, iNow said:

On another note, if you don’t want to eat bananas, you don’t have to. This has a weight roughly equivalent to your statement quoted here. 

What? I'm just stating that I'm not going around saying that everyone has to believe me.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Ocho Cinco Jr

[iNow]

9 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

I'm just stating that I'm not going around saying that everyone has to believe me.

Best I can tell, that was never a possibility worthy of either concern or consideration. 

[StringJunky]

1 minute ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

What? I'm just saying that I'm not going around telling you that everyone has to believe me.

In science beliefs are worthless because it requires evidence and logical rigor for anyones thoughts or ideas to pass its scrutiny and be generally accepted. Religion and God is not falsifiable, which means there is no test we can perform, or even concieve of one, to verify the veracity of religious ideas.  There are good scientists that have religious beliefs, but they don't mix them up. Their respective functions in peoples lives are different and for the most part irreconcilable. There is nothing to gain for the two modes of thought to cross swords.

.

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

Everything that I have stated has been facts, not beliefs. If I were to go into my religion and not only science, I would have a lot more to say.

Just an off topic statement; not all religions are the same, not even Catholicism and Christianity. All of them have very different beliefs.

[iNow]

9 minutes ago, Ocho Cinco Jr said:

Just an off topic statement; not all religions are the same, not even Catholicism and Christianity. All of them have very different beliefs.

Same is true within religions. Ask 10 people what god is and you’ll get 10 different answers in reply, mostly because all those who believe in god(s) tend to conjure them in their own image. 

[Ocho Cinco Jr]

17 minutes ago, iNow said:

Same is true within religions. Ask 10 people what god is and you’ll get 10 different answers in reply, mostly because all those who believe in god(s) tend to conjure them in their own image. 

That is the first thing you have said that I agree with.