So it took two pounds of baloney to find the theoretical physics community's raw nerve

[Glancer]

Okay, I'll treat the physics community like a human being.  The only reason why I get on your nerve is because I don't like what you're researching.  We are (the Earth) are trying to get back on track for the race to interstellar space exploration.  We literally need any hint we can find to get quantum gravity.  If that means we have to lovingly remind the physics community that they need to be aligned with us on this goal, then by gosh, we will poke every nerve they have <that's a joke>.  You have no idea how often jokes are used to ease tensions between the many races and planets.  If you can't take a joke, you are encouraged to learn.  There are more jokes in the universe than photons.

This is why the aliens avoid making contact.  What happens if the aliens make a joke and the human gets mad?  Are you going to aim your nuclear missiles at us?  So, now it is revealed to the source of our concern.  If you can't take a joke, then maybe nobody bothered to explain to you what it is.

Jokes our how we learn to get along with each other.  If someone gets mad at a joke, it means there is something hurting there, and we focus our care and concern.  That is how jokes work.

In contrast, what swansont does is he hears a joke, but doesn't return a joke.  I mean, seriously, how can you not laugh at a name like swansont?  I mean, do swans even get colds?

So basically, the aliens are here to advise the science community, that we will avoid making communication with you if we think you will be hostile towards us.  It shouldn't take a physics forum moderator to figure that out.  We don't have resources to live out your little Star Trek fantasies where we just flying around the galaxy and blows things up on my neighbor's planet.  It's hard to get the "warp drive juice", the Element 115 or whatever you call the idea.  I don't even know what the substance really is, maybe it's not even an element.  It's the basic idea or concept that it takes "fuel" of a kind to visit you on Earth.  We're not going to come to Earth so you can point your boom sticks at us.  We'll visit our friends, and then we'll go.  But while we're here, we'll scan your planet for universities and great learning is taking place; and attempt to visit.  So what does a university looks like on the brain wave scanner?  And who doesn't know what their gender is?  What kind of an education system doesn't teach their children about gender?  As I recall, wasn't there a UFO that landed at an elementary school in Africa?  All of the kids watched the flying saucer and described the event to public officials.  So when you ask:  why don't UFOs land at universities?  The answer is:  we found the highest potential for learning on the planet Earth. 

Edited August 6, 2022 by Glancer

[Phi for All]

!

Moderator Note

Moved from The Sandbox to The Lounge.

 

[Glancer]

Be advised that we will slip in little mis-directs in our jokes.  Watch that the joke might flatter you when you were expecting an insult.

1 minute ago, Phi for All said:

!

Moderator Note

Moved from The Sandbox to The Lounge.

 

Are you still angry about last night?  I mean, about the baloney?

Does anyone think that my version of the truth is a little pointy?  I mean, I try to make jokes.  But they don't seem to get them. 

[Phi for All]

1 minute ago, Glancer said:

Are you still angry about last night?  I mean, about the baloney?

!

Moderator Note

The Sandbox is for testing LaTex and other visual techniques. 

 

Angry? About your baloney? It would have to be interesting first.

[Glancer]

10 minutes ago, Phi for All said:

!

Moderator Note

The Sandbox is for testing LaTex and other visual techniques. 

 

Angry? About your baloney? It would have to be interesting first.

You looked and you reacted about the bologna comment.  You got mad.  Then you closed the thread. 

But seriously, two pounds of bologna is very expensive these days.  That could be $20 in some places.  You should be pleased that I think someone's opinion is worth that much!

The aliens are asking that we met them in the vibration of truth, wisdom, compassion.  Wave functions like to conform to the potential energy of their suroundings just as if it were a mathematical solution trying to be solved in the presence of a potential energy configuration.  Well, not to get too technical, but you can direct your consciousness to exist within a certain vibration of consciousness.  Let all intentions flow from a common point of truth, wisdom and compassion, if you are willing to meet us there.

Edited August 6, 2022 by Glancer

[Moontanman]

53 minutes ago, Glancer said:

Okay, I'll treat the physics community like a human being.  The only reason why I get on your nerve is because I don't like what you're researching.  We are (the Earth) are trying to get back on track for the race to interstellar space exploration.  We literally need any hint we can find to get quantum gravity.  If that means we have to lovingly remind the physics community that they need to be aligned with us on this goal, then by gosh, we will poke every nerve they have <that's a joke>.  You have no idea how often jokes are used to ease tensions between the many races and planets.  If you can't take a joke, you are encouraged to learn.  There are more jokes in the universe than photons.

This is why the aliens avoid making contact.  What happens if the aliens make a joke and the human gets mad?  Are you going to aim your nuclear missiles at us?  So, now it is revealed to the source of our concern.  If you can't take a joke, then maybe nobody bothered to explain to you what it is.

Jokes our how we learn to get along with each other.  If someone gets mad at a joke, it means there is something hurting there, and we focus our care and concern.  That is how jokes work.

In contrast, what swansont does is he hears a joke, but doesn't return a joke.  I mean, seriously, how can you not laugh at a name like swansont?  I mean, do swans even get colds?

So basically, the aliens are here to advise the science community, that we will avoid making communication with you if we think you will be hostile towards us.  It shouldn't take a physics forum moderator to figure that out.  We don't have resources to live out your little Star Trek fantasies where we just flying around the galaxy and blows things up on my neighbor's planet.  It's hard to get the "warp drive juice", the Element 115 or whatever you call the idea.  I don't even know what the substance really is, maybe it's not even an element.  It's the basic idea or concept that it takes "fuel" of a kind to visit you on Earth.  We're not going to come to Earth so you can point your boom sticks at us.  We'll visit our friends, and then we'll go.  But while we're here, we'll scan your planet for universities and great learning is taking place; and attempt to visit.  So what does a university looks like on the brain wave scanner?  And who doesn't know what their gender is?  What kind of an education system doesn't teach their children about gender?  As I recall, wasn't there a UFO that landed at an elementary school in Africa?  All of the kids watched the flying saucer and described the event to public officials.  So when you ask:  why don't UFOs land at universities?  The answer is:  we found the highest potential for learning on the planet Earth. 

Damn, and everyone thinks I'm full of shit. 

[Glancer]

2 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

Damn, and everyone thinks I'm full of shit. 

They are wrong about a lot of stuff.

[Moontanman]

2 minutes ago, Glancer said:

They are wrong about a lot of stuff.

Um no, actually this site is pretty good at pointing out when people are wrong as well as confirming when they are correct. You can learn quite a bit by being wrong but you have to own it. 

[Glancer]

10 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

Um no, actually this site is pretty good at pointing out when people are wrong as well as confirming when they are correct. You can learn quite a bit by being wrong but you have to own it. 

I don't think they know what is right and what is wrong.  They rely too much on mathematical equations and not enough on experimental data.  They even ignore experimental data.  If you think they are right, then you also rely too much on math and not enough on experimental data.

You would think that someone, out of all of those tens of thousands of string theory and loop quantum gravity papers written based on all that math.  You would think that one person would have noticed that superstrings and quantum loops can't be what spacetime is made of.  Spacetime expands at the speed of light.  Superstrings and quantum loops are like Cheerio loops stuck to a mesh.  They don't behave like an expanding universe.

This is an example of the kind of flawed thinking that cannot be relied upon to lead the way to interstellar travel.  You are too anchored to black holes which are too heavy to move.  What gives?

9 minutes ago, Glancer said:

You can learn quite a bit by being wrong but you have to own it.

You can learn even more by being right and following the best models you can find.

When did this place become such a ghost town?

Edited August 6, 2022 by Glancer

[Phi for All]

2 hours ago, Glancer said:

You looked and you reacted about the bologna comment.  You got mad.  Then you closed the thread. 

This fantasy probably makes you feel better, but it's not the way it works here. Your post/thread was reported and reviewed, and because I hadn't been an active participant, it fell to me to close the thread. My reaction was to the poor job you did trying to persuade the other members of your points versus the adamancy with which you made them. You have a horrible signal-to-noise ratio as a discussion participant. Your posts are very blog-like, as if you don't expect your science to be challenged by reasoning people.

The rest of your comment made me yawn. I don't find you interesting, sorry. I wouldn't need to if you made sense or did anything to help me dispel my own ignorance, but you don't. So far, big PITA to the volunteer staff, nothing interesting to me as a member.

[Markus Hanke]

2 hours ago, Glancer said:

They don't behave like an expanding universe.

How do you know that they don’t?

[studiot]

3 hours ago, Glancer said:

We are (the Earth) are trying to get back on track for the race to interstellar space exploration.

 

Speak for yourself and the handful of other like minded people.

The rest of the seven and three-quarter billion people on the planet have more pressing concerns.

 

[swansont]

3 hours ago, Glancer said:

In contrast, what swansont does is he hears a joke, but doesn't return a joke.  I mean, seriously, how can you not laugh at a name like swansont?  I mean, do swans even get colds?

What does my user name have to with swans getting colds?

Swanson is my last name, first name starts with t. Last name + first initial Is a pretty common protocol.

I will admit that making fun of someone’s name is common, though…in grade school. 

[Glancer]

1 hour ago, studiot said:

Speak for yourself and the handful of other like minded people.

The rest of the seven and three-quarter billion people on the planet have more pressing concerns.

I am speaking for everyone else of like mind; all 7 billion of us.  We all want to explore.  There are no solutions down here.

1 hour ago, Markus Hanke said:

How do you know that they don’t?

Loop quantum gravity is based on the idea of a ringlet mesh.  Ringlet meshes don't expand. Superstrings are just vibrating 11 dimensional strings (although no experiment has verified the existence of 11 dimensions.).  Strings just vibrate.  They don't expand either.

1 hour ago, Phi for All said:

This fantasy probably makes you feel better, but it's not the way it works here. Your post/thread was reported and reviewed, and because I hadn't been an active participant, it fell to me to close the thread. My reaction was to the poor job you did trying to persuade the other members of your points versus the adamancy with which you made them. You have a horrible signal-to-noise ratio as a discussion participant. Your posts are very blog-like, as if you don't expect your science to be challenged by reasoning people.

The rest of your comment made me yawn. I don't find you interesting, sorry. I wouldn't need to if you made sense or did anything to help me dispel my own ignorance, but you don't. So far, big PITA to the volunteer staff, nothing interesting to me as a member.

You are like the dirt on a cable that is losing signal because of the dirt.  The dirt doesn't understand what the signal is.  The signal was correct.  The universe and all of its life is actually pretty happy.  It's the people like yourself, down on Earth, who are too miserable, bitter, vindictive; it is people like you who don't want anyone to laugh because life is so serious.  Unhappy civilizations die off.  I pray to whatever intelligence will hear my prayers that people like you... learn to not take life so seriously.

The biggest problem here on Earth is that there are people who don't want to laugh, don't think it's appropriate to make a joke.  They are taught that there is no afterlife or that life is limited, or that God doesn't exist or is otherwise out to get them.  There kind of physics theorist philosophy is extremely damaging to the health of a civilization. 

You should take pity on yourselves, as humans, and burn all your philosophy books.  You should wear "I love Jesus" shirts.  Or even "I love sacred crystals!  They make me happy!"

The lack of imagination in your physics theories is the proof that your philosophies are not helping you.

Seriously, what does it take to teach a human civilization that being miserable all the time is not healthy.  It's no way to go through life.  Just because you don't agree with your early religions (who were not willing to suffer a party pooper) doesn't mean you can't get along with people now whom you don't agree with. 

From the bottom of my heart, I hope you find a good wholesome reason to laugh, laugh like you were 6 years old again.

Everything I've said in the thread that was closed is consistent with thinking the way aliens think.  We should try to laugh more.  We should be less sensitive.  Maybe not work so hard and be so serious about everything. 

2 hours ago, Phi for All said:

This fantasy probably makes you feel better, but it's not the way it works here. Your post/thread was reported and reviewed, and because I hadn't been an active participant, it fell to me to close the thread. My reaction was to the poor job you did trying to persuade the other members of your points versus the adamancy with which you made them. You have a horrible signal-to-noise ratio as a discussion participant. Your posts are very blog-like, as if you don't expect your science to be challenged by reasoning people.

The rest of your comment made me yawn. I don't find you interesting, sorry. I wouldn't need to if you made sense or did anything to help me dispel my own ignorance, but you don't. So far, big PITA to the volunteer staff, nothing interesting to me as a member.

What I posted was an honest assessment of what aliens think of the humans like yourself, the atheist academic physics theorists who have thousands of awful TOE's and Quantum Gravity theory that are all experimentally useless.  I think that deep down,  you have given in to your cynicism and this is how you will live out your life.

[iNow]

Yawn. Add another to the hundreds of forgettable threads from forgettable trollish people. 

[Glancer]

Seriously.  I do think that the surviviablity of the human race is in danger because people like this are allowed to go "un-offended".  It's like motorists who have no intention to hit anyone, but then some attention seeking person stands in the middle of the road because their feelings are hurt and they need all the motorists to pay attention to them.  We have no wish to offend you.  Just don't act all high and mighty with your lame theories and then be prejudiced and hostile toward people who think that God did it. 

Admit that your theories are baloney, they don't work, and they are built upon a false premise, a no Intelligent Design premise.

Edited August 6, 2022 by Glancer

[iNow]

You’re clearly unmolested by enlightenment 

[MigL]

Can we ban this jackass already.
I'm getting tired of the idiocy.

[iNow]

51 minutes ago, MigL said:

Can we ban this jackass already.
I'm getting tired of the idiocy.

I don’t know what his problem is, but I bet it’s hard to pronounce. 

[Markus Hanke]

9 hours ago, Glancer said:

Loop quantum gravity is based on the idea of a ringlet mesh.  Ringlet meshes don't expand.

First of all, spacetime isn’t some kind of physical substance that “expands” in the literal sense, like bread in the oven. Rather, it is a network of causality relations - the set of all points in space at all moments in time, and how they are related to one another. When we speak of “expansion”, then what we mean is that measurements of distance depend on time, ie they change in a certain well defined way according to when they are performed. This is an extremely useful and accurate model, but shouldn’t be reified into something like a physical “substance”.

LQG deals with something called “Wilson loops”. These are mathematical objects that are solutions, simply speaking, to an equation that treats spacetime as a quantum state. These loops are not themselves “chunks” of space and time - rather, they form networks called spin foams, which, in the semi classical limit, may become curved spacetimes with a positive cosmological constant. So yes, they do actually describe an expanding spacetime.

The point here is that there would be a lower limit to how small intervals of space and time can be - you can’t infinitely subdivide it. Again, this is a mathematical model - like a map of the world. But it’s something that one could, at least in principle, test experimentally, given enough energy.

9 hours ago, Glancer said:

Superstrings are just vibrating 11 dimensional strings

No. They are 1-dimensional objects that live in a background spacetime with 3 macroscopic spatial dimensions, 1 dimension of time, and 7 compactified dimensions.

9 hours ago, Glancer said:

Strings just vibrate.  They don't expand either.

Of course not. It’s the spacetime they live in that expands, not the strings themselves.

9 hours ago, Glancer said:

They are taught that there is no afterlife or that life is limited, or that God doesn't exist or is otherwise out to get them. 

Physics has nothing to say on any of these issues.

[Glancer]

24 minutes ago, Markus Hanke said:

irst of all, spacetime isn’t some kind of physical substance that “expands” in the literal sense, like bread in the oven. Rather, it is a network of causality relations - the set of all points in space at all moments in time, and how they are related to one another. When we speak of “expansion”, then what we mean is that measurements of distance depend on time, ie they change in a certain well defined way according to when they are performed. This is an extremely useful and accurate model, but shouldn’t be reified into something like a physical “substance”.

OMG!  Everything you claim to know about big bang expansion is completely corrupted with nonsense. 

I would be happy to explain my Expanding Graviton theory after your LQG theory is revealed to be a Frankenstein monster.

 

27 minutes ago, Markus Hanke said:

LQG deals with something called “Wilson loops”. These are mathematical objects that are solutions, simply speaking, to an equation that treats spacetime as a quantum state. These loops are not themselves “chunks” of space and time - rather, they form networks called spin foams, which, in the semi classical limit, may become curved spacetimes with a positive cosmological constant. So yes, they do actually describe an expanding spacetime.

Show me the experiment that proves that "wilson loops" are not some fantasy, some made up baloney.

 

30 minutes ago, Markus Hanke said:

No. They are 1-dimensional objects that live in a background spacetime with 3 macroscopic spatial dimensions, 1 dimension of time, and 7 compactified dimensions.

So you have this ackward model of 1D objects that are not even related to actual spacetime in some natural coherent way.  And you need 7 compactified dimensions that we should just take on faith, just so that your theory doesn't die of awkwardness.  

 

32 minutes ago, Markus Hanke said:

Physics has nothing to say on any of these issues.

The proposition that Intelligent Design is true means that the best and most efficient engineering capability will be employed to create the universe.  It will work like beautiful engineering design, not like some Frankenstein theory with 13 compactified dimensions.  Do you even realize where the word "compactified" comes from?  The word 'compactify" is used to describe fecal material that is too dense to be able to pass easily. 

[exchemist]

6 hours ago, iNow said:

I don’t know what his problem is, but I bet it’s hard to pronounce. 

Yes, it's curious. It rather looks to me as if he wants to get banned, perhaps (I speculate) in order to reinforce a worldview of victimisation by woke atheists, or some such Trumpy paranoia. At least, that's what comes across. Either that or he's just a random loony with "issues". Anyway, I expect he'll get his wish eventually.  

 

Edited August 7, 2022 by exchemist

[Glancer]

14 minutes ago, exchemist said:

Yes, it's curious. It rather looks to me as if he wants to get banned, perhaps (I speculate) in order to reinforce a worldview of victimisation by woke atheists, or some such Trumpy paranoia. At least, that's what comes across. Either that or he's just a random loony with "issues". Anyway, I expect he'll get his wish eventually.  

Let me tell you what I want.  I want you to abandon the garbage philosophies and "theories" that are based on common sense violating nonsense. 

QM and GR actually do make sense if you look at them without all the baggage.

[exchemist]

4 minutes ago, Glancer said:

Let me tell you what I want.  I want you to abandon the garbage philosophies and "theories" that are based on common sense violating nonsense. 

QM and GR actually do make sense if you look at them without all the baggage.

Yes of course they do - though people argue about how to interpret QM.  

By the way, "common sense" is a lousy guide to either QM or GR. Both were developed by rigorously following the observations, without preconceptions.   

[Glancer]

4 minutes ago, exchemist said:

By the way, "common sense" is a lousy guide to either QM or GR. Both were developed by rigorously following the observations, without preconceptions.   

The answer to what spacetime is made of is right in front of  you, but (and I don't want to hurt your feelings), there is a bunch of junk that has been dumped on top of Modern Physics (which is correct).  All the stuff about superstrings, LQG and MWI is total garbage told to you by a priesthood of mathematicians who just want to control you.

Modern physics, GR, SR, QM, particle physics, Standard model, are all correct. 

Superstrings and loops are garbage.  There is a problem built into those theories that completely falsifies them.

6 minutes ago, exchemist said:

By the way, "common sense" is a lousy guide to either QM or GR. Both were developed by rigorously following the observations, without preconceptions.   

There is only one way to interpret QM and GR.  You interpret them in a way that leads to a Quantum Gravity theory that, in turn, leads to warp field generators. 

Anything else is just shoving garbage into your brain.

If you had the intelligence, you would challenge my ideas; not deduct points from me like some feckless theorist with no imagination.

There is one necessary characteristic that a quantum gravity theory needs.  But you physics theorists can't seem to figure it out.  Even though established physics gives you lots and lots of clues.

We argue.  I punch holes in Loop Quantum Gravity, because I know what the "loops" should be replaced with.

But you guys can't have that conversation because your Common Sense was written over with LQG mathematical bulls*** that divides by zero more times than...

Look, I'm not trying to hurt your feelings.  I'm just trying to help you figure out what's wrong with your quantum gravity theory. 

I'm starting to get the impression that this is supposed to be a science forum, but nobody here really understands Loop Quantum Gravity enough to understand what is wrong with it and  how it doesn't fit with actual empirical observations.  Maybe you should be emailing whoever created it and tell THEM that something doesn't add up.

Edited August 7, 2022 by Glancer