Do trees dry quicker standing up?

[geordief]

As I have trees in my field that I use as firewood,I have started a new technique  of cutting through  the bark  a little above ground  level  so that they die standing up rather than by  felling them as I normally do.

Can I anticipate that they will dry more quickly than otherwise?

 

Will the water  already in the timber tend to sink  under the action of gravity?

 

I understand that it is capillary action that feeds the upper branches in the first place (when alive)but I do not know if there is anything like a reverse path for that water as the tree dies and slowly dries out.

[Peterkin]

Firewood dries fastest when cut up and split, for maximum air circulation. OTOH, you don't want it drying out too much: wood that's been piled outdoors for two years burns so fast, we have to keep stoking the stove continuously, rather than be able to damp it down for a long smoulder. The best firewood we get is maple that's been cut up to 18"X10" max and seasoned from 6 months to a year.

If you want it for carving wood, the seasoning time is shorter, average an 6 weeks: when completely dry, it's too hard for hand-carving, but better for power carving; carve when green and it dries unevenly, and cracks. 

For cabinetry, the optimal method of seasoning is to saw the green debarked lumber (sawmills normally spray their logs with water) into boards along the grain, stack them on an even surface with slats between layers to allow air circulation, and seal the cut ends. They should dry for one full year or longer, during which time, it's a good idea to restack the boards in a different orientation, to stop warping.

We have some dead elms still standing after a couple of years, and they're hard as steel. They'd make a good raft or scaffolding, but a devil to cut. The other danger to standing dead trees is bird and insect damage. If the termites move in, you might not get any use out of the wood. 

[TheVat]

Girdling, as it's called, is an ancient technique to thin forests using less heavy equipment than felling.  The tops of many species, when girdled, will dry faster, but not the trunks. (And tops can be hard to get to, for harvesting firewood) And some species still absorb water in their trunks after girdling.  Bear in mind that the xylem, which is hard to cut all the way through in girdling, can still carry water.  Girdling just breaks the phloem and cambium, typically.  Generally, splitting and stacking in a sunny spot is your best method.  

[zapatos]

One of the primary functions of bark, just like skin, is to keep water inside. It can take a couple of years for bark to begin sloughing off a standing tree.

The more heartwood you expose to the air the faster it will dry.

[iNow]

Fell, split, stack. There’s a reason this is how it’s been done for centuries. Air flow across inner fibers that have been exposed will result in fastest results (absent some kiln drying process)

[StringJunky]

The roots are capillaries; until they are severed they will lift water.

[geordief]

1 hour ago, TheVat said:

Girdling, as it's called, is an ancient technique to thin forests using less heavy equipment than felling.  The tops of many species, when girdled, will dry faster, but not the trunks. (And tops can be hard to get to, for harvesting firewood) And some species still absorb

 

in their trunks after girdling.  Bear in mind that the xylem, which is hard to cut all the way through in girdling, can still carry water.  Girdling just breaks the phloem and cambium, typically.  Generally, splitting and stacking in a sunny spot is your best method.  

I had the idea because (and I just use a bowsaw) some trees are difficult to get a good place to start a cut and also they often just fall on their neighbour and I have to make a second or third attempt to bring them to ground.I thought I would do this and attend to them later when they might be lighter and easier to handle.

 

I have noticed that  standing dead trees in my field are often very dry and for me the dryer the better

I have made quite  a deep "girdle" so I will see how it works.

8 minutes ago, StringJunky said:

The roots are capillaries; until they are severed they will lift water.

What,even up past the cut I have  all around  the trunk?(about 3' off the ground) 

Would a deeper cut make a difference?

Edited October 8, 2022 by geordief

[zapatos]

25 minutes ago, geordief said:

I had the idea because (and I just use a bowsaw) some trees are difficult to get a good place to start a cut and also they often just fall on their neighbour and I have to make a second or third attempt to bring them to ground.

Girdling typically cuts into the wood about 1 1/2 inches deep, and about 2 or more inches vertically. If you make a narrow cut with a bowsaw it may not be enough to keep the tree from healing itself before it dies.

Almost the entire trunk of the tree inside the bark contains vessels which are capable of transporting water. Over time the vessels closer to the center clog up and no longer transport water. This area is called the heartwood, and can usually be identified once the tree is cut as it often has a darker color. The outer portion of the trunk is the sapwood and this is where most of the water flows. So, the deeper you cut through the sapwood, the more you cut off the water flow. Once the leaves die there is really no outlet for water moving up the tree and the water flow stops.

[TheVat]

2 hours ago, geordief said:

I had the idea because (and I just use a bowsaw) some trees are difficult to get a good place to start a cut and also they often just fall on their neighbour and I have to make a second or third attempt to bring them to ground...

You must be pretty fit.  Bowsaws are hard work.  I've used one but never on stock more than three inches thick.  One way to make felling easier (aside from waiting for the timber to die and dry) is to lop off as many branches as possible, so that what falls is more a pole and less dendrite ish.  Easier to control the fall, less catching on neighbors.  You can find videos on the method for creating a "hinge" which directs the fall.  Wedges help a lot.  And charting in advance your own exit path.  If you stick with girdling (no jokes, I promise), then @zapatos has clarified the importance of cutting all the way through the xylem, to heartwood.  (second joke resisted!)

I am told by a fellow amateur lumberjack (he's okay) that some oaks really hoard trunk water, so girdling them might mean a longer wait.  Really, with oak, it may be time to think about a chainsaw.  If polluting two cycle engines are objected to, there are some decent electrics out there now for smaller scale stuff.  I got along with a crappy little Black and Decker for years. 

[geordief]

 

2 hours ago, TheVat said:

You must be pretty fit.  Bowsaws are hard work.  I've used one but never on stock more than three inches thick.  One way to make felling easier (aside from waiting for the timber to die and dry) is to lop off as many branches as possible, so that what falls is more a pole and less dendrite ish.  Easier to control the fall, less catching on neighbors.  You can find videos on the method for creating a "hinge" which directs the fall.  Wedges help a lot.  And charting in advance your own exit path.  If you stick with girdling (no jokes, I promise), then @zapatos has clarified the importance of cutting all the way through the xylem, to heartwood.  (second joke resisted!)

I am told by a fellow amateur lumberjack (he's okay) that some oaks really hoard trunk water, so girdling them might mean a longer wait.  Really, with oak, it may be time to think about a chainsaw.  If polluting two cycle engines are objected to, there are some decent electrics out there now for smaller scale stuff.  I got along with a crappy little Black and Decker for years. 

I think chainsaws are dangerous (as are bowsaws-I have cut right through  the nail  once and my doc said he never got  to see any  injuries  from professionals) but they also damage the nerves in the hands I think and are also unpleasant to use.

 

And they are not that much faster than a bowsaw if you spend half your time sharpening the chain and refilling the petrol and the oil like I used to.

 

If the trunks are too big I just leave them to grow on  and go for smaller trees .

 

If you know which way the tree is leaning you can take down quite big trees as the cut eventually  opens and  the tree goes under it's own weight.

 

I don't know if you read "Where the  Crawdads sing"(now a film) but ,listening to myself I sound to myself a bit like the protagonist in that story 😀

 

And yes ,the escape path is the first thing  to organise.

Edited October 8, 2022 by geordief

[zapatos]

2 hours ago, TheVat said:

If polluting two cycle engines are objected to, there are some decent electrics out there now for smaller scale stuff.  I got along with a crappy little Black and Decker for years. 

I have a couple of Stihl gas powered chain saws but last year I bought a chain saw that runs on a Li-ion battery. I am shocked how well it works. It maintains maximum power until it just stops. I can fell, limb and section a 20' (or so) tree on one battery charge. It cuts a little slower but other than that it works like a charm.

[Ken Fabian]

Going by my own experience capillary action appears able to maintain high moisture levels in standing trees (Eucalypts mostly around here, in Eastern Australia) for many years after they died. Sawing standing dead trees into firewood still seems to require some additional time stacked to dry fully. Preferably they have been dead long enough that bark and sapwood are rotted/eaten away, but before the termites make much impact on the heartwood. That the wood hasn't been lying on the ground means less dirt and grit and makes it easier on the chainsaw, but I tend to use what is around and accept shorter intervals between sharpening.

It also seems like simply drying green wood doesn't produce the best firewood and guides for Australian landholders providing their own often recommend a period of a few years of 'green' wood being kept deliberately damp, allowing bark and sapwood to rot away and saps to leach away before drying. Not using sapwood and leaching out of saps can be important because they can cause dangerous build up in chimneys/flues, especially with open fireplaces. It seems to be less important with modern enclosed wood heaters, that achieve higher temperatures and burning efficiency, ie can tolerate wood cut green and fast dried with sapwood still present.

Some of the longest lasting, most termite resistant Eucalyptus timber seems to season best when left standing - least splitting or checking - with the downside of being hardest to saw when seasoned. More usually, commercially, the wood is milled green and stacked to air dry or else kiln dried.

We still use some firewood but increasingly we use reverse cycle air-con (air source heat pump) for heating.

[TheVat]

21 hours ago, zapatos said:

I have a couple of Stihl gas powered chain saws but last year I bought a chain saw that runs on a Li-ion battery. I am shocked how well it works. It maintains maximum power until it just stops. I can fell, limb and section a 20' (or so) tree on one battery charge. It cuts a little slower but other than that it works like a charm.

(bolding mine) Hehe!  Those sound nice, especially where one ventures far into the trees where an extension cord won't reach.  I've got a cordless mower, but it's got NiMH batteries, which don't do so well in capacity as Li-ion.