Spoken Into Existence

[Crocduck]

On 1/10/2023 at 5:48 PM, Trurl said:

Well in evolution if a cell is designing an evolved self isn’t there instructions or nucleus that is designing this evolution? Something has to take place to “design” something new. What else would cause such a unique and specific change?

 

Also why are plants considered living? Do they have a conscious that moves their bodies to light? Or is the plant just made out of reactions to its environment?

I just made some delicious ribs.  A recipe that was passed down over time.  The first hero's in creating good recipes were those that died because they tried something new (maybe had some bad berries or some toxic animal created by god) and the ancestors learned over time there was something in that recipe killing their loved ones (according to some...god designed).    they learned over time to avoid death and suffering by trial and error.  Not a good design IMO.

[joigus]

On 12/14/2022 at 5:15 AM, Trurl said:

My question is if we ever create a conscious intelligence (like A.I. or computer learning) would you reevaluate your ideas on creationism?

No. If AI were able to "create" a herd of antelope or a coral reef, plus the long-term incremental changes in the fossil record that led to them, I may change my mind. Then we would have gone full circle in the generation of intelligence by intelligence, which is only the first step that it would take to convince me.

IOW: Evolution is obvious once you understand its principles and let the facts sink in. And it is impossible to grasp if you have a very concrete, atavistic prejudice that obstructs your understanding, by ignoring the facts and misunderstanding its principles.

[Trurl]

Ok, but with evolution can you be creative? Does life matter when we are not in control of it?

I ask this because I watched a lecture on the Matrix Trilogy. The whole series was about free will and if it exists. You have new beings who are machines and a new world the Matrix.

Well depending on our definition we know creativity exists. Man defined it. But with evolution would we be in control or just completely a process? One psychologist defines creativity as a process. He interviewed creative types and they repeat they were not in control of the experience.

And the same psychologist said that spiritual experiences had similarities to creative experiences.

So is evolution random? Man has spent his life looking for patterns and explanations. He even questions if there is true randomness. Is man built for the world or was the world built for man?

[iNow]

26 minutes ago, Trurl said:

with evolution can you be creative? Does life matter when we are not in control of it?

Yes

26 minutes ago, Trurl said:

So is evolution random?

Not fully

27 minutes ago, Trurl said:

Is man built for the world or was the world built for man?

False premise. Neither were built. 

[Trurl]

Back to the creativity aspect. I listened to a podcast where a man said what worried him about Chat gpt was that it does what we do as humans.

So why would a high school student want to write a research paper and spend hours finding sources when gpt can do it in 5 seconds.

So even if you do not believe computers can become conscious, it appears they can take the fun out of the things people do.

[iNow]

49 minutes ago, Trurl said:

a man said what worried him about Chat gpt was that it does what we do as humans.

It doesn’t, though. It’s NOT creative. It uses prediction engines to guess what comes next in a string of words. 

50 minutes ago, Trurl said:

why would a high school student want to write a research paper and spend hours finding sources when gpt can do it in 5 seconds.

Why, indeed. Students NEVER wanted to do that. Now they have an even easier way around it than paying the nerdy immigrant kid who plays D&D to do it for them.

Its time to find better ways of measuring pupil progress and capacity and potential.

 

52 minutes ago, Trurl said:

even if you do not believe computers can become conscious, it appears they can take the fun out of the things people do.

You call spending hours researching and writing papers “fun?”

[Trurl]

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It doesn’t, though. It’s NOT creative. It uses prediction engines to guess what comes next in a string of words. 

I don’t mean gpt is creative. I mean it takes from the special aspects of human work.

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paying the nerdy immigrant kid

That sounds like something Trump said in high school.

 

And papers are generally not fun. And they are assigned too often.