geordief Posted March 28 Posted March 28 Suppose we have two frames of reference that only differ in that they are separated by a fixed distance And suppose each frame makes measurements of an object that is moving relatively to both at any speed between 0 and c. Is the concept of spacetime necessary for each frame to make that measurement and so that they agree in every case? I am asking this because it has been said (was it by Minkowski?) that our previous till then understanding of space and time must be replaced with a new amalgam of the two (spacetime) and I am wondering if this is because all frames of reference are relatively in motion in practice or whether the reason is deeper than that.
MigL Posted March 28 Posted March 28 Because of the finite speed of light ( information ), objects ( events ) are separated by time as well as distance. At small distances the time separation is trivial, so we can safely ignore it.
swansont Posted March 28 Posted March 28 26 minutes ago, geordief said: Suppose we have two frames of reference that only differ in that they are separated by a fixed distance This is only one frame. They must be moving with respect to each other to be different frames. 1
geordief Posted March 28 Author Posted March 28 1 hour ago, swansont said: This is only one frame. They must be moving with respect to each other to be different frames. Well OK ,but can I repeat the question with just that one frame and the fixed distance between the location of the taker of the measurements in the same frame? (I would have said "observer" but I suspect that might have different meanings ...) If you just have the one frame is there any way to find the concept of spacetime useful as opposed to the pre relativistic separation of it into space and time?
swansont Posted March 28 Posted March 28 7 hours ago, geordief said: Well OK ,but can I repeat the question with just that one frame and the fixed distance between the location of the taker of the measurements in the same frame? (I would have said "observer" but I suspect that might have different meanings ...) If you just have the one frame is there any way to find the concept of spacetime useful as opposed to the pre relativistic separation of it into space and time? Any time or length measurement will be the same, but there will be length contraction of the object, and it will experience time dilation. Two observers measuring the decay of muons, for example, will get the same answer for the half-life, but it won’t agree with the lab frame measurements. Without relativity you could not reconcile the discrepancy. 1
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