Breast sagging natural vs with a bra

[annie24]

Hey does anyone have any ideas on working out the impact of a bra on the volume of sagging breasts? Obviously when they are not in a bra, sagging breasts volume will be smaller than if they are in a bra (and how much they are sagging)...but does anyone know of any formulas or science to anticipate volume change? Thanks!

[Moontanman]

https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/you-asked/does-wearing-bra-make-your-breasts-sag

Quote

Published studies have found that breast size and age are the primary predisposing factors to breast ptosis (the medical term for sagging). One study of eleven young women published in 1990 found that after three months of wearing a “well-fitted” bra, their breasts hung down more.

 

[exchemist]

2 hours ago, annie24 said:

Hey does anyone have any ideas on working out the impact of a bra on the volume of sagging breasts? Obviously when they are not in a bra, sagging breasts volume will be smaller than if they are in a bra (and how much they are sagging)...but does anyone know of any formulas or science to anticipate volume change? Thanks!

Why would whether they are in a bra or not affect volume? I would expect the volume to be the same, but just the shape to be different.

[Phi for All]

27 minutes ago, exchemist said:

Why would whether they are in a bra or not affect volume? I would expect the volume to be the same, but just the shape to be different.

If I put my bowling ball in its bag, I still call it my bowling ball, but I need more volume to store it. But then it would be fairly easy to make a formula that anticipates how much more volume a bra adds to a breast, so perhaps that's not what the OP meant.

[exchemist]

45 minutes ago, Phi for All said:

If I put my bowling ball in its bag, I still call it my bowling ball, but I need more volume to store it. But then it would be fairly easy to make a formula that anticipates how much more volume a bra adds to a breast, so perhaps that's not what the OP meant.

Or perhaps the poster meant not volume but bust measurement. That would presumably be a bit less without support.

[Peterkin]

The volume has no reason to change when the shape changes. Try this with a pound of ground beef: shape it into a tower, a ball, a cone, then squash it flat. 

Chest measurement would vary according to the shape of the bra cups: a Vaudeville style cone sticks out farther than a Spandex sport bra. Without a bra, there is huge variation. A 17-year-old breast is the same, or nearly the same whether supported or not. A 70-year-old one sags dramatically and a nursing breast is very different from its size before pregnancy. If you remove a naturally shaped unpadded cup, the degree of sag affects the change in measurement. 

[TheVat]

I'm learning so much about biochemistry!

[annie24]

2 hours ago, Peterkin said:

The volume has no reason to change when the shape changes. Try this with a pound of ground beef: shape it into a tower, a ball, a cone, then squash it flat. 

Chest measurement would vary according to the shape of the bra cups: a Vaudeville style cone sticks out farther than a Spandex sport bra. Without a bra, there is huge variation. A 17-year-old breast is the same, or nearly the same whether supported or not. A 70-year-old one sags dramatically and a nursing breast is very different from its size before pregnancy. If you remove a naturally shaped unpadded cup, the degree of sag affects the change in measurement. 

Thank you everyone! So if a naturally shaped padded cup is present - shape change doesn't matter because it fits to the shape of the padding? Is that right? 

[Peterkin]

2 hours ago, annie24 said:

So if a naturally shaped padded cup is present

The volume of flesh still doesn't change, but the thickness of the padding adds to the chest measurement.

[TheVat]

When clothing reduces the volume of any body part, that's the definition of intensely uncomfortable.  Women used to get ill, and even pass out, from the constricting effect of corsets.  And those only persisted during the Victorian era due to a pudgy monarch who wore them and started a fashion fad that created that somewhat grotesque aesthetic of the wasp waist.  IIRC, in the period after Victoria's death in 1903, accompanied by general momentum in the women's rights movement, there was a massive casting off of corsets.  My spouse mentions Laura Ingalls Wilder (of the Little House on the Prairie books) hating the corset her mother wanted her to wear at all times (even while sleeping) and stealthily slipping it off when she was in bed.

 

[MigL]

Can't believe I'm actually weighing in on this, but ...

A breast is mostly fat, glands and blood vessels encased in skin.
That volume is somewhat fixed, and will only change depending on fat levels and hormone changes; not on the wearing of a bra or not.
However, in men and women, the breasts are supported by muscles, and those adapt to stresses.
Wearing a bra lessens the weight supported by those muscles, which would then atrophy and lead to more pronounced sagging.

I don't imagine the effect is very large, but over a 30 year span, it might be.
I recommend incline dumbell flies 🙂 .

Edited April 1 by MigL

[exchemist]

9 hours ago, annie24 said:

Thank you everyone! So if a naturally shaped padded cup is present - shape change doesn't matter because it fits to the shape of the padding? Is that right? 

What? No.

What we are saying is a bra that supports the breast will change the shape of the breast but not its volume. That’s all.

3 hours ago, MigL said:

Can't believe I'm actually weighing in on this, but ...

A breast is mostly fat, glands and blood vessels encased in skin.
That volume is somewhat fixed, and will only change depending on fat levels and hormone changes; not on the wearing of a bra or not.
However, in men and women, the breasts are supported by muscles, and those adapt to stresses.
Wearing a bra lessens the weight supported by those muscles, which would then atrophy and lead to more pronounced sagging.

I don't imagine the effect is very large, but over a 30 year span, it might be.
I recommend incline dumbell flies 🙂 .

I’ve come across what you say here about muscles supporting the breast before. I’ve always struggled a bit with it. What muscles are those? My impression has been that breasts are fairly inert, changing shape as they do when a woman lies down, or stands up, or bends over. So I’m a bit suspicious about muscle tone affecting their shape.  But it’s not something I have ever got round to discussing with a woman - and I have never gone out with a physiotherapist who might have been an authority on the topic. 
 

A quick  search threw up this reference, which is in line with my scepticism about any role for muscles in affecting breast shape: https://www.livestrong.com/article/525163-the-results-of-exercise-on-the-female-breast/

 

Edited April 1 by exchemist

[TheVat]

8 hours ago, exchemist said:

My impression has been that breasts are fairly inert, changing shape as they do when a woman lies down, or stands up, or bends over.

It's remarkable how many men have, as dedicated practitioners of the scientific method, gathered such impressions through careful and diligent observation.  A notable example of "citizen science."

I have wondered, as the demographic shift happens in developed countries and family sizes grow considerably smaller, if average breast volume will decrease.  Or would the selective effect of a smaller functional role for breasts be counteracted by sexual selection?  Part of broader questions about selective pressures for sexual dimorphism decreasing as male/female social roles are less differentiated, I guess.  

I've never cared much about breast size, personally, and never really understood the obsession some have.  Seems kind of puerile.  

11 hours ago, MigL said:

Can't believe I'm actually weighing in on this, but ...

No pun intended, right?

Edited April 1 by TheVat
will i ever learn to type??

[exchemist]

2 hours ago, TheVat said:

It's remarkable how many men have, as dedicated practitioners of the scientific method, gathered such impressions through careful and diligent observation.  A notable example of "citizen science."

I have wondered, as the demographic shift happens in developed countries and family sizes grow considerably smaller, if average breast volume will decrease.  Or would the selective effect of a smaller functional role for breasts be counteracted by sexual selection?  Part of broader questions about selective pressures for sexual dimorphism decreasing as male/female social roles are less differentiated, I guess.  

I've never cared much about breast size, personally, and never really understood the obsession some have.  Seems kind of puerile.  

No pun intended, right?

I have only had the opportunity to research a small sample ( 12) in the course of a longish life, but in spite of the considerable variety of shapes and sizes I have never observed any musculature in breasts, even though I belonged to a rowing club for over 30 years and married a rower.

(I did once try to weigh them though. This arose from a discussion of the old-fashioned appreciative remark “Blimey, you don’t get many of them to the pound!”  - a reference to how one used to buy fruit at the greengrocer. She was a nurse, so was happy, in fact highly amused,  to enter into the spirit of the exercise. In her case about a lb each so it was true, for her.)

[Moontanman]

2 minutes ago, exchemist said:

I have only had the opportunity to research a small sample ( 12) in the course of a longish life, but in spite of the considerable variety of shapes and sizes I have never observed any musculature in breasts, even though I belonged to a rowing club for over 30 years and married a rower.

(I did once try to weigh them though. This arose from a discussion of the old-fashioned appreciative remark “Blimey, you don’t get many of them to the pound!”  - a reference to how one used to buy fruit at the greengrocer. She was a nurse, so was happy, in fact highly amused,  to enter into the spirit of the exercise. In her case about a lb each so it was true, for her.)

I think I'd have to have some hands on investigation into this phenomenon to be sure! 

[exchemist]

11 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

I think I'd have to have some hands on investigation into this phenomenon to be sure! 

That’s what I did. She got on the scales and I put my hand under one breast, lifted it to the point at which the tension appeared to be gone from the upper slope, and noted the decrease in scale reading. Then ditto with the other. Not very accurate perhaps but gave us an idea. She had quite a generous,  though not excessive, bust. Most of my other girlfriends had smaller breasts and a less earthy sense of humour, so the subject never came up with them. 😀

[MigL]

Seems that breasts bring out  the child in all of us males ...

[Moontanman]

28 minutes ago, MigL said:

Seems that breasts bring out  the child in all of us males ...

🍼😁🍼 boobas!