2024 Presidential Election: Who should replace Joe Biden?

[Peterkin]

24 minutes ago, swansont said:

Manufacturing controversy isn’t a failure of integrity?

No, it's not about profit; it's about control of the message.

I said nothing bout integrity. It didn't fail; it was squashed. Controversy doesn't need to be manufactured: it's always out there, waiting to be reported, and it would make exciting television, quite beneficial to profits. Whether it's presented fairly - or at all - depends on what the network owners and major sponsors allow to be aired. 

Edited July 29 by Peterkin

[iNow]

40 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

it's not about profit; it's about control of the message

False dichotomy 

[Peterkin]

1 hour ago, iNow said:

False dichotomy 

3 hours ago, swansont said:

almost like integrity has taken a back seat to profit.

Can't be helped. It was part of a conversation about integrity, profit and broadcasting. My contention being that integrity in reportage is not necessarily inimical to profitable broadcasting, but rather that there is third element in play: control of the message, which supersedes both news integrity and commercial interest.   

Edited July 29 by Peterkin

[swansont]

10 hours ago, Peterkin said:

Controversy doesn't need to be manufactured

And yet there are manufactured controversies. 

[Peterkin]

2 minutes ago, swansont said:

nd yet there are manufactured controversies. 

You are absolutely correct.

[iNow]

On 7/28/2024 at 4:39 PM, swansont said:

Saying that you won’t need to vote anymore

He doubled down and repeated this in an interview on Fox News today. Instead of backing away from this comment, he repeated this argument that if he’s elected, “the country will be fixed” and their votes won’t be needed.

 

[swansont]

35 minutes ago, iNow said:

He doubled down and repeated this in an interview on Fox News today. Instead of backing away from this comment, he repeated this argument that if he’s elected, “the country will be fixed” and their votes won’t be needed.

 

Much the same way you “fix” a pet

[StringJunky]

4 hours ago, iNow said:

He doubled down and repeated this in an interview on Fox News today. Instead of backing away from this comment, he repeated this argument that if he’s elected, “the country will be fixed” and their votes won’t be needed.

 

Taken in aggregate with his support of Project 2025 and other stuff, a duck is a duck.

[TheVat]

Amusingly, Trump has disavowed all of Project 2025 now, as I guess his handlers have noticed how poorly Americans are reacting to it.  IIRC his campaign manager recently issued a statement that no one connected with the Heritage Foundation document would be part of a Trump WH or administration.  The project director,  Paul Dans, just quit a day or two ago.  Even Stephen Miller seems to have slithered away from it.  

While Trump may not be that invested in the theocracy parts of the document, it remains pretty clear that he looooooves the consolidating all power in the executive branch part, ravaging NIH and NOAA, eviscerating the civil service, etc.  

[Phi for All]

The Slump brand certainly is taking a hit. Vance will end up being a hot potato, a liability if you keep him and an even worse liability if Slump drops him for Haley. And it seems like his wounded/not wounded ear gave Slump no bump, like nobody cared.

[swansont]

1 hour ago, TheVat said:

Amusingly, Trump has disavowed all of Project 2025 now, as I guess his handlers have noticed how poorly Americans are reacting to it.  IIRC his campaign manager recently issued a statement that no one connected with the Heritage Foundation document would be part of a Trump WH or administration.  The project director,  Paul Dans, just quit a day or two ago.  Even Stephen Miller seems to have slithered away from it.  

While Trump may not be that invested in the theocracy parts of the document, it remains pretty clear that he looooooves the consolidating all power in the executive branch part, ravaging NIH and NOAA, eviscerating the civil service, etc.  

He’s already made campaign promises based on it, and it’s not like he can stick to a script, so good luck avoiding all the hot-button issues.

[MSC]

1 hour ago, TheVat said:

Amusingly, Trump has disavowed all of Project 2025 now, as I guess his handlers have noticed how poorly Americans are reacting to it.  IIRC his campaign manager recently issued a statement that no one connected with the Heritage Foundation document would be part of a Trump WH or administration.  The project director,  Paul Dans, just quit a day or two ago.  Even Stephen Miller seems to have slithered away from it.  

Allegedly disavowed* But that was also the closest thing they had to a policy agenda/election manifesto. Now they just have to figure out a bunch of compelling lies about what they can falsely promise voters... Before immediately trying to enact project 2025 on day one. 

As for Stephen Miller he's an extremely long species of snake, like Trump. Sure his head might be far away from project 2025 but you can bet your ass, his slimy ass is still coiled firmly around it!

 

2 minutes ago, swansont said:

He’s already made campaign promises based on it, and it’s not like he can stick to a script, so good luck avoiding all the hot-button issues.

And that is the thing about Trump's MO, it isn't based on a narrative it's based on a network of so many lies that you can selectively respond to anything with "I did or didn't say x about y." It isn't to inform voters on what he stands for, it's to confuse them. Not just lies about himself but everything. Elon Musk does the same shit. 

It won't be long before he's openly saying he supports policies from Pro25 but omitting that is where they are from, he'll gradually push the boundaries until all his base and more are convinced crap from that toilet paper plan is something they've been advocating for, for years. 

Or someone will draft more ridiculous propaganda about what Democrats are planning so they can do some classic whataboutisms. "Oh forget about project 2025 what about the radical Democrats plan to abort every person under the age of five if they don't commit to transitioning into a sexually ambiguous communist that is 1/4 starfox!? Project evil Marxism for 3000 years!" 

The scary thing is; once a large enough portion of his supporters are convinced they want what is in the fine print, autocracy, dictatorship, monarchy whatever... At that point, the entire Democratic electoral process will be the target. MAGA Republicans will show up to polling stations sure enough but not to vote. Winning to them at that point won't be about getting votes, it will be about stopping them altogether. 

[iNow]

1 hour ago, TheVat said:

his campaign manager recently issued a statement that no one connected with the Heritage Foundation document would be part of a Trump WH or administration

Thank goodness lying is below Trump and team and is something they have far too much integrity to do 

[MigL]

37 minutes ago, MSC said:

Now they just have to figure out a bunch of compelling lies about what they can falsely promise voters

What about the rest of that wall ...
🙂 😄 🤣

[StringJunky]

What they'll possibly try to do now is to lose that mess in a bigger mess that'll they'll try to create, going forward. Trash the political landscape with strategic lies and uncertainties to level the increasingly asymmetric situation they now face, and then convince people they are the way of this mess. Sound familiar? Then, pull out Project 2025 again as a solution.

Edited July 31 by StringJunky

[J.C.MacSwell]

A long way to go but so far so good...

[TheVat]

The pun was inevitable.  Though I think the coconut tree story will wear itself out if that is becoming a big campaign meme.  

Anyway, I suppose it's a nice change for the coconut symbolism, which used to be a racist slur, "black on the outside, white on the inside."  In the US it was similar to "Oreo."  

[MSC]

14 hours ago, J.C.MacSwell said:

A long way to go but so far so good...

Although you'd think the inference of a king with the Camelot reference would appeal to these royalist ignoramuses... Whoops, I meant "Republican" ignoramuses. 

If anyone here does memes or satirical art, here's a pitch. Have Trump on a litter, wearing a crown, litter is carried by all of his stooge cronies, except every single one of them is the literal Rhinoceros version of themselves. All while pointing at a large mirror they've labeled "never trumpers" while screaming "Rinos!" Meanwhile JD Vance is being chased by the crazy cat lady from the Simpsons and junior is eating crayons and has peed himself. Go! Post it in the political humour page.

[iNow]

11 minutes ago, MSC said:

Go!

You only posted this a moment ago so I could surely refine it, but enjoy

 

[Alex_Krycek]

Trump's interview at the National Association of Black Journalists...wow. 

Just when you thought it couldn't get any worse.  

[TheVat]

Wow, indeed.  Almost like he is trying to lose.  I mean, swing states with large black populations: Michigan, Pennsylvania, Georgia.  Not that blacks were going to turn out for him anyway, but that kind of behavior galvanizes people to show up at the polls.  And you don't have to be black or liberal to be offended by that - my wife moves in a couple circles with a lot of conservatives and reports many of them were disgusted.   I, too, am hearing more people saying things like might sit this one out.

[J.C.MacSwell]

Lol, just give the nomination to Niki Haley already...this is getting too easy...

If you take Trump and the GOP since the last election and condense it...you've got the makings of a good Monty Python skit....

 

[Phi for All]

1 hour ago, TheVat said:

Wow, indeed.  Almost like he is trying to lose. 

I'd believe this if it was 2015. He never wanted to be president, he wanted to be the man Hillary Clinton stole the election from, so he and Steve Bannon could start their own outrage factories.

Now though, he has to know that losing means actual jail time. I think he was so flustered by Biden dropping out that he has nowhere to pivot to. His Biden strategies are worthless against Harris, and he's refusing to make nice with the folks he needs to win. 

It will be interesting to see Harris' VP pick. If Josh Shapiro can guarantee 19 electoral votes that Slump was counting on, I'd lean in that direction, even though I dislike Shapiro's Gaza stance and his traitorous backing of school vouchers.

[J.C.MacSwell]

15 hours ago, MSC said:

Although you'd think the inference of a king with the Camelot reference would appeal to these royalist ignoramuses... Whoops, I meant "Republican" ignoramuses. 

If anyone here does memes or satirical art, here's a pitch. Have Trump on a litter, wearing a crown, litter is carried by all of his stooge cronies, except every single one of them is the literal Rhinoceros version of themselves. All while pointing at a large mirror they've labeled "never trumpers" while screaming "Rinos!" Meanwhile JD Vance is being chased by the crazy cat lady from the Simpsons and junior is eating crayons and has peed himself. Go! Post it in the political humour page.

Cue Saturday Night Lives sequel to "I Don't Wanna' Go!"

"I Don't Wanna'Go Against Harris!"

[MSC]

2 hours ago, Phi for All said:

will be interesting to see Harris' VP pick. If Josh Shapiro can guarantee 19 electoral votes that Slump was counting on, I'd lean in that direction, even though I dislike Shapiro's Gaza stance and his traitorous backing of school vouchers.

I feel like I'd want Buttigieg to get the nom, but it won't happen most likely.

4 hours ago, TheVat said:

Wow, indeed.  Almost like he is trying to lose.  I mean, swing states with large black populations: Michigan, Pennsylvania, Georgia.  Not that blacks were going to turn out for him anyway, but that kind of behavior galvanizes people to show up at the polls.  And you don't have to be black or liberal to be offended by that - my wife moves in a couple circles with a lot of conservatives and reports many of them were disgusted.   I, too, am hearing more people saying things like might sit this one out.

I'm telling you, that narcissistic cowardice is gonna have him self sabotage to save his life from assassination. He's too paranoid not to, he doesn't trust his secret service detail and buys too much of his own deepstate propaganda not to self-sabotage at this point. 

As soon as the presidential equivalent of bone spurs manifests itself we'll see what we see. It's also hard to gauge what will even happen as Trump's ego wrestles with itself; stay in the race but maybe die, live but definitely lose? Could get a second wind or just deflate and deflate some more.