JohnDBarrow Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 WE SHOULD NOT TACKLE THE ENERGY PROBLEM BECAUSE IT IS EASY. WE SHOULD TACKLE IT BECAUSE IT IS HARD. President John F. Kennedy said something similar about man's going to the moon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 This post should land in the Trash Can, not because it’s ridiculous, but because it’s a waste of bandwidth with no actual discussion points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 8 Author Share Posted July 8 (edited) ENERGY is that nasty E word everybody here seems gunshy about talking about. So, there really is no energy problem? Ok, discussion points: what can be done about the global energy crisis? Edited July 8 by JohnDBarrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 ! Moderator Note There is no need to SHOUT and iNow’s critique is spot-on. Do better. Just now, JohnDBarrow said: ENERGY is that nasty E word everybody here seems gunshy about talking about. So, there really is no energy problem? Is that what they said? You need to be far more specific about what you think the problem(s) is/are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exchemist Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 48 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: ENERGY is that nasty E word everybody here seems gunshy about talking about. So, there really is no energy problem? Ok, discussion points: what can be done about the global energy crisis? First, what energy “crisis” have you in mind”? Different people may understand different things by that word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 8 Author Share Posted July 8 (edited) 5 hours ago, swansont said: ! Moderator Note There is no need to SHOUT and iNow’s critique is spot-on. Do better. Is that what they said? You need to be far more specific about what you think the problem(s) is/are. Sorry, I thought the energy problem would be patently obvious to most people here. If you don't think there is an energy problem, perhaps you haven't seen your electric or gasoline bill lately. Ok, according to this video, a "global energy crisis is coming". Who here agrees or disagrees? Edited July 8 by JohnDBarrow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 15 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: Sorry, I thought the energy problem would be patently obvious to most people here. If you don't think there is an energy problem, perhaps you haven't seen your electric or gasoline bill lately. Ok, according to this video, a "global energy crisis is coming". Who here agrees or disagrees? ! Moderator Note You need to post the discussion points. Just posting a video is insufficient. Stop being lazy and actually make your point, in writing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exchemist Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 (edited) 20 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: Sorry, I thought the energy problem would be patently obvious to most people here. If you don't think there is an energy problem, perhaps you haven't seen your electric or gasoline bill lately. Ok, according to this video, a "global energy crisis is coming". Who here agrees or disagrees? [snip] You still have not described what energy crisis you refer to. There is plenty of energy available today, at affordable cost. There is a looming crisis due to climate change, from the burning of fossil fuels specifically. That is a climate change crisis, rather than an energy crisis per se. Is that what you are taking about? Or something else? And no, I'm not going to watch some YouTube video. The forum rules say discussion should be made possible on the basis of the words posted, without having to refer to external material. So it is for you, please, to explain in your own words what crisis you are referring to. Then we can have a discussion about it: first whether we agree there is indeed such a crisis; and second, if so, what to do about it. OK? Edited July 8 by exchemist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 8 Author Share Posted July 8 4 hours ago, exchemist said: First, what energy “crisis” have you in mind”? Different people may understand different things by that word. My understanding of Energy Crises: -high gasoline prices -high electric bills -limited supply of energy resources -some forms of energy are supposedly dangerous or unhealthy: nuclear energy might pose a cancer risk, EV batteries might be a serious fire hazard -fossil fuels won't last forever -power outages -pollution from some forms of energy as fossil fuels -there might someday not be enough energy to keep a modern industrialized civilization afloat -every form of energy as an alternative to fossil fuels supposedly has shortcomings, there is no perfect form or source of manmade energy as far as I know If I suggest escalating global nuclear power, people (including some here) will always have negative things to say about it. If I throw out wind power, solar power, biofuels, hydroelectric power or hydrogen, there will be negative remarks made by some about each and every one of those too. Most folks (the drill, baby, drill crowd) are so in love with fossil fuels but few fossil fuels fans realize that that fossil fuels can't possibly last forever at the rate man uses them. When solar energy was mentioned to my grandfather back in the the 1970's he remarked, "You can't pump the sun!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endy0816 Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 Not the same price everywhere. More due to a region's combination of infrastructure, international energy market and local economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 8 Author Share Posted July 8 (edited) 14 minutes ago, exchemist said: You still have not described what energy crisis you refer to. There is plenty of energy available today, at affordable cost. There is a looming crisis due to climate change, from the burning of fossil fuels specifically. That is a climate change crisis, rather than an energy crisis per se. Is that what you are taking about? Or something else? And no, I'm not going to watch some YouTube video. The forum rules say discussion should be made possible on the basis of the words posted, without having to refer to external material. So it is for you, please, to explain in your own words what crisis you are referring to. Then we can have a discussion about it: first whether we agree there is indeed such a crisis; and second, if so, what to do about it. OK? Ok, will there be plenty of affordable energy for many years to come? The CRISIS might even be that there won't be (enough if any) future energy for people years from now. Do you personally feel there is any kind of energy crisis? As far as I can tell, every form of energy has pros and cons: agree or disagree? I personally have a problem with gasoline's being in exceess of $3.00 per gallon where I live and that my June electric bill was $130 for a mere 940 KWH used. Does anybody here have any present or future ENERGY concerns of any kind? Concerns about obtaining energy today and tomorrow. Concerns about affording energy today and tomorrow. Concerns about any negative consequences of using any form or manmade method of producing energy today and tomorrow. What are the pros and cons of: -EV's? -nuclear? -wind? -sea tide energy? -river (hydroelectric dam) power? -solar? -hydrogen? -fossil fuels? -geothermal energy? -synthetic fuels? -biofuels? How can man use energy in such ways that the postives outweigh any negatives? -biofuels? Edited July 8 by JohnDBarrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exchemist Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 (edited) 18 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: My understanding of Energy Crises: -high gasoline prices -high electric bills -limited supply of energy resources -some forms of energy are supposedly dangerous or unhealthy: nuclear energy might pose a cancer risk, EV batteries might be a serious fire hazard -fossil fuels won't last forever -power outages -pollution from some forms of energy as fossil fuels -there might someday not be enough energy to keep a modern industrialized civilization afloat -every form of energy as an alternative to fossil fuels supposedly has shortcomings, there is no perfect form or source of manmade energy as far as I know If I suggest escalating global nuclear power, people (including some here) will always have negative things to say about it. If I throw out wind power, solar power, biofuels, hydroelectric power or hydrogen, there will be negative remarks made by some about each and every one of those too. Most folks (the drill, baby, drill crowd) are so in love with fossil fuels but few fossil fuels fans realize that that fossil fuels can't possibly last forever at the rate man uses them. When solar energy was mentioned to my grandfather back in the the 1970's he remarked, "You can't pump the sun!" This list contains many questionable elements and does not indicate a crisis in energy supply, as you seem to assume it does. There is plenty of energy available at affordable cost today. Economies are not in worldwide recession due to energy supply or its cost. As @Endy0816 points out, there are regional constraints on supply, cost and distribution. Those do not constitute a crisis, except possibly in some specific locations, requiring local solutions. 14 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: Ok, will there be plenty of affordable energy for many years to come? Do you personally feel there is any kind of energy crisis of any kind? Asd far as I can tell, every form of energy has pros and cons: agree or disagree? I personally have a problem with gasoline's being in exceess of $3.00 oper gallon where I live and that my June electric bill was $130 for a mere 940 KWH used. There is a climate crisis, requiring a rapid transition away from the use of fossil fuels for energy. What you pay for your gasoline is well below what we all have paid for it in Europe for decades now. (Current UK price is ~£1.5 per litre, i.e. ~ $7/USg.) So if that is your idea of a "crisis", you have led a sheltered life - and need to drive a less thirsty vehicle. American society is notoriously energy-hungry - even worse than W Europe - and we all need to use less to help the energy transition. But framing this as a "crisis" is wrong use of the word and is unhelpful. We can all use less, and we can all use more carbon-free energy. It's just a matter of political will - always difficult in a democracy, since voters prefer the status quo until they are really convinced. Edited July 8 by exchemist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: My understanding of Energy Crises: -high gasoline prices US gas prices are quite a bit lower than they were ~10-12 years ago, adjusted for inflation, when they were around $5 a gallon https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/articles/fotw-1238-may-16-2022-average-nationwide-monthly-gasoline-price-was-highest There was a dip in 2020 when nobody was driving because of COVID lockdowns Currently about $3.50 per gallon for regular according to https://gasprices.aaa.com 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: -limited supply of energy resources Energy is always a limited respurce 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: -some forms of energy are supposedly dangerous or unhealthy: nuclear energy might pose a cancer risk, EV batteries might be a serious fire hazard Always going to be the case 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: -fossil fuels won't last forever -power outages -pollution from some forms of energy as fossil fuels Always going to be true. You mentioned a crisis. 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: -there might someday not be enough energy to keep a modern industrialized civilization afloat Do you have an analysis to back this up? I’ve seen calculations about how much area would be needed for solar to provide all our electricity, and it’s not all that big. 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: -every form of energy as an alternative to fossil fuels supposedly has shortcomings, there is no perfect form or source of manmade energy as far as I know Yes, unicorns don’t exist, either. 39 minutes ago, JohnDBarrow said: If I suggest escalating global nuclear power, people (including some here) will always have negative things to say about it. If I throw out wind power, solar power, biofuels, hydroelectric power or hydrogen, there will be negative remarks made by some about each and every one of those too. Most folks (the drill, baby, drill crowd) are so in love with fossil fuels but few fossil fuels fans realize that that fossil fuels can't possibly last forever at the rate man uses them. When solar energy was mentioned to my grandfather back in the the 1970's he remarked, "You can't pump the sun!" That’s not an energy problem, as such. That’s a perception problem. Maybe we could have more analysis and less fear mongering? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 9 Author Share Posted July 9 5 hours ago, swansont said: US gas prices are quite a bit lower than they were ~10-12 years ago, adjusted for inflation, when they were around $5 a gallon https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/articles/fotw-1238-may-16-2022-average-nationwide-monthly-gasoline-price-was-highest There was a dip in 2020 when nobody was driving because of COVID lockdowns Currently about $3.50 per gallon for regular according to https://gasprices.aaa.com Energy is always a limited respurce Always going to be the case Always going to be true. You mentioned a crisis. Do you have an analysis to back this up? I’ve seen calculations about how much area would be needed for solar to provide all our electricity, and it’s not all that big. Yes, unicorns don’t exist, either. That’s not an energy problem, as such. That’s a perception problem. Maybe we could have more analysis and less fear mongering? Ok, then what have people in the scientific community taught us about energy? Let's hear YOUR analyses of the current total global energy situation and what the future means to humanity in terms of energy. What are the known facts regarding energy on earth and man's reliance upon it, not the emotions? After all, the human body itself cannot live without some form of energy. Energy is life. Period. I know some folks here hate video postings, but this video poses the question regarding running out of fossil fuels in the near future: What might happen if all fossil fuels totally ran out from planet Earth 50 years from now? -3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 1 hour ago, JohnDBarrow said: what have people in the scientific community taught us about energy? That it equals mass times the speed of light squared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exchemist Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 (edited) 2 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: Ok, then what have people in the scientific community taught us about energy? Let's hear YOUR analyses of the current total global energy situation and what the future means to humanity in terms of energy. What are the known facts regarding energy on earth and man's reliance upon it, not the emotions? After all, the human body itself cannot live without some form of energy. Energy is life. Period. I know some folks here hate video postings, but this video poses the question regarding running out of fossil fuels in the near future: [snip] What might happen if all fossil fuels totally ran out from planet Earth 50 years from now? I do wish you would stop posting hysterical propaganda videos. It is sheer crap to say the world is going to run out of fossil fuel. The problem fossil fuel suppliers face today is of resources they own becoming worth less due to the energy transition away from their use. Solar and wind energy are already cheaper than that from fossil fuel, potentially leaving them with “stranded” assets: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41558-022-01356-y People like the Saudis are very worried their income will dry up, even though they have plenty of oil in the ground still. As for the energy situation 50 years from now, we won’t be using much fossil fuel at all, not because it has run out, but because we will have chosen to stop using it. There seems to be a political/ industrial fossil fuel lobby, in the US particularly, that is currently employing a FUD (Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt) strategy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear,_uncertainty,_and_doubt to undermine and slow down the energy transition. In your previous thread you posted videos seeking to undermine confidence in electric vehicles. In the present thread you post videos trying to whip up fears that we urgently need more fossil fuel. Am I wrong to suspect an agenda in your posting behaviour? Or have you perhaps been suckered by these people? Edited July 9 by exchemist 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 9 Author Share Posted July 9 (edited) 1 hour ago, exchemist said: I do wish you would stop posting hysterical propaganda videos. It is sheer crap to say the world is going to run out of fossil fuel. The problem fossil fuel suppliers face today is of resources they own becoming worth less due to the energy transition away from their use. Solar and wind energy are already cheaper than that from fossil fuel, potentially leaving them with “stranded” assets: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41558-022-01356-y People like the Saudis are very worried their income will dry up, even though they have plenty of oil in the ground still. As for the energy situation 50 years from now, we won’t be using much fossil fuel at all, not because it has run out, but because we will have chosen to stop using it. There seems to be a political/ industrial fossil fuel lobby, in the US particularly, that is currently employing a FUD (Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt) strategy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear,_uncertainty,_and_doubt to undermine and slow down the energy transition. In your previous thread you posted videos seeking to undermine confidence in electric vehicles. In the present thread you post videos trying to whip up fears that we urgently need more fossil fuel. Am I wrong to suspect an agenda in your posting behaviour? Or have you perhaps been suckered by these people? Well, I've heard people bad-mouth electric automobiles too. What are we going to use to charge them one day without fossil fuels involved anywhere in the energy chain? Nukes? Wind? Solar? Hydroelectric? Sea tides? Biofuels including wood? Hydrogen? A squirrel running in a squirrel cage to charge the batteries? If I were to buy an electric car in Iowa right now and plug it in at home, the power to charge it would be off the local grid which has generators run by fossil fuels. There is no place to plug in an electric automobile in my apartment complex anyway. I have an all-gas-powered '95 Toyota Corolla which gets 30 MPG highway still. The purchase price of an EV is out of the question for me. I use 10% Ethanol at the pump. 15% will ruin the fuel lines. My fears aren't that we need more fossil fuels. My fears WERE that fossil fuels won't last forever. My fears are that there might not ever be any fossil fuels alternatives that are feasible. Modern industrial society will someday fold. It's back the bible life of shepherds again, maybe? Every alternative to fossil fuels put on the open table for discussion is going to be criticized by some people. There are many naysayers. Edited July 9 by JohnDBarrow -1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exchemist Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 (edited) 1 hour ago, JohnDBarrow said: Well, I've heard people bad-mouth electric automobiles too. What are we going to use to charge them one day without fossil fuels involved anywhere in the energy chain? Nukes? Wind? Solar? Hydroelectric? Sea tides? Biofuels including wood? Hydrogen? A squirrel running in a squirrel cage to charge the batteries? If I were to buy an electric car in Iowa right now and plug it in at home, the power to charge it would be off the local grid which has generators run by fossil fuels. There is no place to plug in an electric automobile in my apartment complex anyway. I have an all-gas-powered '95 Toyota Corolla which gets 30 MPG highway still. The purchase price of an EV is out of the question for me. I use 10% Ethanol at the pump. 15% will ruin the fuel lines. My fears aren't that we need more fossil fuels. My fears WERE that fossil fuels won't last forever. My fears are that there might not ever be any fossil fuels alternatives that are feasible. Modern industrial society will someday fold. It's back the bible life of shepherds again, maybe? Every alternative to fossil fuels put on the open table for discussion is going to be criticized by some people. There are many naysayers. Drop the hysteria, can't you? What's this stupid shit about squirrels, suddenly? Calm down, for Christ's sake. In the UK, >40% of our electricity last year was already coming from renewable sources: https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/energy-explained/how-much-uks-energy-renewable and this goes up every year. I don't have the figure for the USA but there is no reason why it also can't get a high proportion from renewables. It is true that because renewable sources (wind, solar, tidal) are intermittent, one needs some base load capacity from a constant source. Nuclear can - and does - do that. There is interesting work going on on small modular nukes, which could cut the costs considerably. We might indeed also need to run a small amount of gas generation, for peak shaving when there is no sun or wind (what is known in the business as "dunkelflaute" conditions), but it won't be much and current gas reserves will last for a very long time at that rate. Battery technology also advances rapidly - there is considerable interest now in a sodium battery system which would reduce dependence on lithium, and so on. There is also a lot that can be done to alter the demand pattern, e.g. by smart tariffs and smart controllers in the home, to encourage consumption by industry and households when renewable supply is plentiful, e.g. when you run your kitchen appliances, or even when you draw power for heating. We are just at the beginning of exploring that. It's a dynamic world and new options spring up all the time. There is no need to get in a panic and start wittering about effing squirrels.😀 What car you personally happen to run today is neither here nor there. The switch to renewable electricity is already here and well advanced. You just have either not noticed, because you have not read about these things, or you are part of a silly rearguard action to try to slow it down because you are terrified of minor changes to the way you live. I don't know which. I accept that in rural communities (Iowa is pretty sparsely populated, isn't it?) these changes will come later than for those of us who live in cities. But don't make the error of extrapolating your particular circumstances to the whole of humanity. Most of the world is not like Iowa. Though I notice you say you live an apartment complex, not a remote farmstead. You can charge an EV at home just by getting a plug installed. Costs a few dollars. We've got them in some of the lamp posts in my street now, and more appear every year. I really think that if you are genuine, i.e. not some troll trying to push a pro-fossil fuel agenda by advertising alarmist videos, you ought to do a bit of reading on the internet on the subject. I've already provided a few pointers. But I'm in London, not Iowa, so the amount of help I can give you is limited. Look up the US renewable electricity percentage, and the plans for expansion, on a government utility website (not some crappy disinformation site, of which are many). Find out how you can charge an EV at home, by looking at a manufacturer's website. And so on. This stuff is all around us already. It is not some bobble hat wearer's fantasy, it's real and it's here. Edited July 9 by exchemist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sensei Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 (edited) If your definition of an "energy crisis" is similar to Wikipedia, i.e. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_crisis Energy crisis indeed happens every a couple years, on a small scale, in different countries. We can see them on charts as peaks in oil, gas and coil prices. Countries that lack natural resources, mainly fossil fuels, are particularly susceptible to this. The key is dependence on other countries and their willingness (or not) in delivery the goods. Rising coal, oil and gas prices on world markets cause secondary waves in completely different areas of such a country's economy. COVID-19, War in Ukraine, Israel vs Palestinian conflict, conflict in Yemen, all them causes more or less visible disruptions in transportation and production of oil and gas, and transport of other goods. Modern food production costs rise with the price of fuel, transportation costs rise too. This leads to a loss of customers and can result in the bankruptcy of otherwise good companies. Edited July 9 by Sensei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 14 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: Ok, then what have people in the scientific community taught us about energy? Let's hear YOUR analyses of the current total global energy situation and what the future means to humanity in terms of energy. What are the known facts regarding energy on earth and man's reliance upon it, not the emotions? After all, the human body itself cannot live without some form of energy. Energy is life. Period. That's not how this works. You can't show up, stir up shit, and then tell someone else to do the analysis. 14 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: I know some folks here hate video postings It's more nuanced than that, but the main point here is that the rules say "Videos and pictures should be accompanied by enough text to set the tone for the discussion, and should not be posted alone." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sensei Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 19 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: Sorry, I thought the energy problem would be patently obvious to most people here. If you don't think there is an energy problem, perhaps you haven't seen your electric or gasoline bill lately. The problem is that you started this thread in a childish way.. for such paraphrasing you need to have enough reputation points. On 7/8/2024 at 5:03 PM, JohnDBarrow said: President John F. Kennedy said something similar about man's going to the moon. Going to the Moon was a far easier.. Sometimes fighting with physics and engineering issues is easier than fighting everyone on the planet, politicians, businessmen from coal, oil & gas industry, employees from oil & gas industry, miners, farmers, people loving fossil fuel driven cars (even if they have never seen or driven an electric car), etc. etc. 19 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: Ok, according to this video, a "global energy crisis is coming". Who here agrees or disagrees? Good video. 13m. Summed up the energy industry. On 7/8/2024 at 5:24 PM, JohnDBarrow said: Ok, discussion points: what can be done about the global energy crisis? To stop being a selfish bastard would be a good start.. People (and countries with net exports of these commodities) who want to maintain the status quo in the coal, oil and gas industries, directly or indirectly, are the biggest blockers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Après_moi,_le_déluge Quote "Après moi, le déluge" (pronounced [apʁɛ mwa lə delyʒ]; lit. 'After me, the flood') is a French expression attributed to King Louis XV of France, or in the form "Après nous, le déluge" (pronounced [apʁɛ nu lə delyʒ]; lit. 'After us, the flood') to Madame de Pompadour, his favourite.[1] It is generally regarded as a nihilistic expression of indifference to whatever happens after one is gone.[2] Its meaning is translated by Brewer in the forms "When I am dead the deluge may come for aught I care", and "Ruin, if you like, when we are dead and gone."[3] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterkin Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 (edited) On 7/8/2024 at 11:24 AM, JohnDBarrow said: Ok, discussion points: what can be done about the global energy crisis? Change the way we generate energy and the way we use it. But many people can't think in terms of change, diversification, efficiency, refitting, downscaling, localizing or simplifying. They can only think in terms of wanting more, and every want almost immediately turns into a need and the need immediately becomes urgent and crucial. No human person actually needs a skyscraper, a fighter jet or a container megasghip. ....but the economomeeee!.... So, as long as those people are in power in too much of the world, we'll have another crisis and another, each bigger than the last, and then, by one means or another we roast to death by the millions. Just as with a pandemic, If we were to put intelligent people dedicated to solving the problem in charge, more of us would survive. Edited July 9 by Peterkin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 21 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: high electric bills I skipped this one earlier. US residential electricity bills have been basically flat for the last decade, when adjusted for inflation. (There has been a couple percent decline over that span) https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=61903 That would include any increased usage from having to run the AC more. Almost all US new planned generation is carbon-free https://www.whitehouse.gov/cea/written-materials/2024/04/11/the-next-phase-of-electricity-decarbonization-planned-power-capacity-is-nearly-all-zero-carbon/ None of this happened overnight, nor are zero-carbon goals going to be met tomorrow, but there was no reasonable expectation that it would be. We’re in the middle of an energy revolution. Technology isn’t the problem. Though soggy panties might be clouding the judgement of some. Impediments are political, so solving that problem means voting for people who will work toward solutions rather than against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDBarrow Posted July 9 Author Share Posted July 9 What I am looking for is for the answer to the question: How can Man best use and manage energy from this day onward into the future? If you were to have YOUR way, how would our species use and manage energy? It sounds like energy is one of those things that involve many compromises. As far as wind and solar go, can't the electricity produced from these be stored in batteries for those times the wind is not blowing and the sun is not shining? I made the squirrel remark to be sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Fabian Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 @JohnDBarrow - Too broad for one topic, too many topics for one discussion. A lot of discussions of energy happen here, which you can contribute to, but no single discussion can cover it all. Most recently broad focus and narrow focus - The most recent "energy crisis" (as described widely by media, rather than the endless partisan political messaging) was an EU gas supply reliability problem for the supposed element of the energy system deemed most reliable. It sent fossil fuel prices globally into economy damaging territory and gave producers apart from Russian windfall profits, and not for the sake of the health of any economy or any greater good would they reduce those prices. The EU countries mostly redoubled commitment to RE after, no matter the efforts to paint the crisis as a failure of RE and failure to support and expand gas supply. Is that the sort of crisis you want to discus Or about climate and commitments to zero emissions? 18 hours ago, JohnDBarrow said: What might happen if all fossil fuels totally ran out from planet Earth 50 years from now? We would have a huge climate problem - a much huger climate problem - if we use them to depletion. But it is not possible to use them to depletion, just use them to uneconomical - quicker to uneconomical should the externalised costs like health, environment and climate impacts ever be made more explicit through carbon taxes and levies. Quicker too even without those due to energy R&D and entrepreneurship delivering Renewable Energy that is cost competitive, even with fossil fuels enjoying perpetual amnesty on climate accountability. Some uses will persist longer, some will be reduced - and should be given how serious destabilizing the planet's climate is. Some of those resource will still be important for lubricants, chemical feedstocks, apart from fuels. The relative costs of energy and relationship between changes to incomes, taxes, profit levels and inflation is enough to keep battalions of economics occupied. I don't see any new energy crisis that isn't already being given a lot of consideration and debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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