Faith (split from How atheists often misunderstand and misuse the theory of evolution)

[swansont]

2 hours ago, dimreepr said:

Fair enough; scienceism = people who put their faith in science; I count myself among their numbers.

That includes a lot of people who don't really understand the science, bc we don't speak the language properly; the great thinkers evolve our thinking, sometimes against the prevailing/dogmatic understanding.

Ditto religions.

I'm not sure how else one could interpret that word, in the context of my post. 

Which definition of faith are you using?

trust/confidence in something 1. despite there being no evidence, or 2. because there is lots of evidence?

[dimreepr]

23 hours ago, swansont said:

Which definition of faith are you using?

trust/confidence in something 1. despite there being no evidence, or 2. because there is lots of evidence?

The one that fits the persons ability and intelligence on the spectrum of faith, you are certain of your position bc what you've built can be seen to be working, no faith needed, but you're an outlier; the outlier at the other end of the scale is a baby.

All I'm saying is that most of us are dotted around the middle, whatever ism we follow, requires a fair bit of faith.

 

For me, this statement applies to everyone on the spectrum equally. 

On 10/2/2024 at 2:21 PM, swansont said:

trust/confidence in something 1. despite there being no evidence, or 2. because there is lots of evidence?

There's no evidence that science will continue to evolve, tomorrow.

[dimreepr]

I'm happy to acknowledge your right to neg my post, but without a reasoned argument, I really don't care; but thanks for participating... 🤒

[Harrot]

I dont think faith is something that can be more or less.

There is no value to faith between some kind of limits; this would be "belief", not "faith".

Because, in my opinion, faith is a fact, not a skill.

There IS faith when "Someone want something related to God's will <=> it occur."

It occur or it does not occur, there is no quantity involved. The fact is or it is not.

Or course if someone want too much or too less of something, it can happens that it does not occur, but it is not because it can't, due to the "weakness" of the faith, (like some Jedi trying to bend reality to his will  😄) , but it is because it is not related to God's will.

God want it more or less and the faith need to correspond to his will, thats all.

So "faith" is some kind of "being an actor in the name of God".

 

 

[dimreepr]

19 minutes ago, Harrot said:

I dont think faith is something that can be more or less.

There is no value to faith between some kind of limits; this would be "belief", not "faith".

Because, in my opinion, faith is a fact, not a skill.

There IS faith when "

omeone want something related to God's will <=> it occur."

It occur or it does not occur, there is no quantity involved. The fact is or it is not.

Or course if someone want too much or too less of something, it can happens that it does not occur, but it is not because it can't, due to the "weakness" of the faith, (like some Jedi trying to bend reality to his will  😄) , but it is because it is not related to God's will.

God want it more or less and the faith need to correspond to his will, thats all.

So "faith" is some kind of "being an actor in the name of God".

 

 

Why do you have faith in these word's?

19 minutes ago, Harrot said:

I dont think faith is something that can be more or less.

"It's wrong to call a banana a fruit, it's very wrong to claim its a car"... 

Edited yesterday at 01:07 PM by dimreepr

[Harrot]

23 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

Why do you have faith in these word's?

"It's wrong to call a banana a fruit, it's very wrong to call it a car"... 

On 10/3/2024 at 3:33 PM, dimreepr said:

All I'm saying is that most of us are dotted around the middle, whatever ism we follow, requires a fair bit of faith.

 

Yes it is wrong to use words instead of others or we end up loosing some concepts.  It is not because lot of people is doing a mistakes that it become right to do so. Therefore i try here to explain that faith is not belief. The two words are not here for aesthetic purpose, they really mean something else.

 

Quote

Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. This is what the ancients were commended for. By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible. Hebrews 11:1 – 3

He replied, “Because you have so little faith. Truly I tell you, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you.” Matthew 17:20

You see, here per example (i show it just here for some reference purpose, not for proselitism) it is said that faith is... faith and that this is not a question of quantity. Saying that you could have "as little faith as a mustard seed", so little as nothing,  is to be understand as "you can have as small faith as it could be", faith is faith,  so only THE FACT FAITH is required,  with no consideration of any quantity, to do the biggest thing that could be done (like here moving a mountain).

It is straightforward to understand, isn't it ?

 

 

Edited yesterday at 01:22 PM by Harrot

[dimreepr]

10 minutes ago, Harrot said:

It is straightforward to understand, isn't it ?

Not if it's not what you want to believe... 

[swansont]

3 hours ago, dimreepr said:

I'm happy to acknowledge your right to neg my post, but without a reasoned argument, I really don't care; but thanks for participating... 🤒

Maybe it’s because you didn’t answer the question. Worse, your response is self-referential, so it’s not even helpful.