Products of this reaction?

[rakuenso]

NaOCl + CH3OOH + Fe + H2O -> Fe2O3 + ???

[insane_alien]

already it unbalanced

[YT2095]

methyl hydroperoxide, toilet bleach and Iron.

erm... are you SURE?

[woelen]

NaOCl + CH3OOH + Fe + H2O -> KABOOM

[rakuenso]

Bleach + vinegar(acetic acid) + Iron -> ?

 

 

The reason I'm asking this is because one of my chem friends claim that you can make large amounts of Fe2O3 with this

[budullewraagh]

"Bleach + vinegar(acetic acid) + Iron -> ?"

 

nooooooo the organic is peroxymethanoic acid

 

are you sure it's CH3OOH?

im reasonably sure that you end up with Fe2O3, NaCl and CH3OH

[rakuenso]

hmm well what's the type of vinegar that contains exclusively acetic acid and water? and how would i obtain high concentrations of it from ordinary vinegar?

 

 

oops I mean CH3COOH

[budullewraagh]

then you end up with NaCl+Fe2O3+CH3COOH

[rakuenso]

is CH3COOH released as a gas? since I'm pretty sure some form of gas is released from this equation.

[akcapr]

u can concentrate vinegsr by means of freezing

[rakuenso]

can you elaborate?

[woelen]

CH3COOH instead of CH3OOH....ah, now the reaction makes sense....

 

You'll get CH3COONa (sodium acetate), Fe2O3 and most likely also quite some Cl2 (so you MUST do this outside).

 

The reaction, however, is not clean at all. You'll get a really terrible mess of all kinds of compounds. Fe(3+) forms complexes with acetate, you'll get chlorine in the mix (acid + bleach gives chlorine). Don't expect this mix to be really useful.

 

If you really want nice Fe2O3, then I would suggest you to take iron wool and immerse this in water and add some bleach to that (without the acetic acid). If you leave that overnight, then most of the iron wool is oxidized.

 

 

Getting concentrated acid from vinegar can be done by distillation, but it is not that easy. Getiing pure acetic acid will be hard, because the boiling point of acetic acid (118 C) and water are quite close to each other. But by boiling away half the liquid of household cleaning vinegar you can double its concentration without too much trouble.

 

Another source for concentrated acetic acid may be photographers (acid stop bath, sold as 80% acetic acid or as 28% acetic acid). If you play with acetic acid, so not simply regard this as a 'stronger vinegar'. This stuff must be handled with respect and in fact is quite corrosive and has a very pungent vapor.

[raivo]

Geting high conc acetic acid is even harder than woelen said here. I have tried this and no, boiling it to half volume does not double its conc. To get 70% acetic acid from 30% i had to boil it to less than one fifth of initial volume. Freezing also does not work because freezing point of 30% acetic acid for example is so low that -18C does nothing to it. 80% acetic acid can be frozen but even then liquid phase is mostly absorbed by solid so you do not get acceptable separation. Useable way is to distill waterfree sodium acetate with conc. sulfuric acid. Sulfuric acid has to be near 100% because almost all the water it has distills over into your acetic acid.

 

So its one of those chemicals you have to buy somewhere.

[YT2095]

I`m with you 100% there, I`ve tried this boiling and freezing proc, I`ve never had any luck with it either, the sodium acetate Does work though.