Trump administration is crippling science.

[CharonY]

Within the first week of this administration, they are starting a muzzling program, where federal researchers are not allowed in engage in "external communication". These would include the CDC and NIH (avian influenza, anyone?). This would also pause systems that are needed to evaluate research grants.

But good news, a pause has also been ordered on all federal grants and loans. So there wouldn't be any grants to disburse, anyway. This applies to many other federal programs, including food programs and housing. But for the context in research, some see it is a strong indication that the administration seeks to control narratives by crippling critical resarch.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2025/01/28/us/trump-news-executive-orders?smid=url-share

 

[TheVat]

But egg prices are dropping.   Someday.   Trump will talk with the birds.  Bird flu will be over in a week.  Nobody wins when they play chicken with Trump!  

[CharonY]

I mean, if there is no testing and no regulation to cull infected birds, we might get some suspiciously cheap chicken nuggets eventually.

[exchemist]

12 minutes ago, CharonY said:

I mean, if there is no testing and no regulation to cull infected birds, we might get some suspiciously cheap chicken nuggets eventually.

But the farmers will be up in arms. And Trump needs the rural vote. I can't see how this can work for him, except in the very short term. It's bound to bite him in the arse eventually, surely?

And research will go on in other countries which will become available to the US public, so attempting to control the narrative on things like epidemics is pretty well doomed, I would think. Things have moved on since Stalin. 

[pzkpfw]

2 hours ago, TheVat said:

.. Trump will talk with the birds.  Bird flu will be over in a week.  ... 

It rained after his visit to CA, and people are crediting him for it. This cult of personality is getting (even more) scary.

[CharonY]

1 hour ago, exchemist said:

But the farmers will be up in arms. And Trump needs the rural vote. I can't see how this can work for him, except in the very short term. It's bound to bite him in the arse eventually, surely?

I don't think they will be. There are farmers who believe that avian influenza is a federal ploy to steal their farms. And now with their guy in place they will be safe (by not testing).

The issue is also that avian influenza is a reportable disease. But if no one is testing....

[iNow]

6 hours ago, exchemist said:

Things have moved on since Stalin. 

What’s old is new again

[Peterkin]

6 hours ago, exchemist said:

And Trump needs the rural vote.

He already got it. His beautiful Christians will never have to vote again.

He's not worried about 'eventually' or the next election. His legacy of causing maximum harm to the maximum number of people is already assured.

[exchemist]

2 hours ago, Peterkin said:

He already got it. His beautiful Christians will never have to vote again.

He's not worried about 'eventually' or the next election. His legacy of causing maximum harm to the maximum number of people is already assured.

You are right, I am still adjusting to authoritarian rule. He doesn’t need to worry about votes any more. 

[Peterkin]

9 hours ago, exchemist said:

You are right, I am still adjusting to authoritarian rule. He doesn’t need to worry about votes any more. 

 

You know he's replacing government workers with people loyal to him - or who, at least, know better than to ask 'Why'?

This cabal is hell-bent on crippling not only science, but health care, education, agriculture, justice and and abolish civil rights. Their agenda was announced through microphones, on posters, in social media posts. And yet most Americans are still unaware of or denying what they let themselves - and the world - in for.

[exchemist]

1 hour ago, Peterkin said:

 

You know he's replacing government workers with people loyal to him - or who, at least, know better than to ask 'Why'?

This cabal is hell-bent on crippling not only science, but health care, education, agriculture, justice and and abolish civil rights. Their agenda was announced through microphones, on posters, in social media posts. And yet most Americans are still unaware of or denying what they let themselves - and the world - in for.

Yup he's getting his placemen into the military, the security agencies and the Dept of "Justice" - and exacting vengeance on people who have crossed him, to make the rest fear retribution if they step out of line. He has also used fear to bring the large media organisations largely to heel, or at least get them to adopt a position of studied - and safe -  neutrality. These are the classic steps taken by a dictator who takes power by means of an election - a soft coup. 

I think he'll now stay in power until he dies or becomes incapacitated. Then we'll see if, as in the USSR, the system will have become well enough entrenched to be self-perpetuating. A lot may depend on how well the Repubicans can gerrymander the electoral arrangements. 

Edited yesterday at 04:57 PM by exchemist

[Peterkin]

44 minutes ago, exchemist said:

I think he'll now stay in power until he dies or becomes incapacitated. Then we'll see if, as in the USSR, the system will have become well enough entrenched to be self-perpetuating. A lot may depend on how well the Repubicans can gerrymander the electoral arrangements. 

He'll stay in power as long as he's useful to Musk and Vance - which may well be as long as he lives. But the dismantling of American institutions and law - including election arrangements - will continue without him.  

....unless, of course....

[CharonY]

Apparently the order has been rescinded after a temporary block by a judge. But they have vowed to purge spending on "woke" agenda. Fits right into authoritarian playbook. Eliminate knowledge not aligned with ones ideology.

 

[J.C.MacSwell]

C'mon folks, it will be "best ever" by any reasonable measure. Maybe not by any explicitly defined measure (that would tend toward scientific, or at least integrity, and who wants that?), but certainly by any reasonable one. He's already done more in a week than Biden managed in 4 years, if JD Vance is to be believed, and I see no reasonable reason to doubt him.

And of course the avian flew, what else are birds expected to do?

Reminds me Trump hasn't threatened the Canary Islands yet, but there's always next week.

(Do it Trump...you know you want to...send Barron...it will be fun for him)

[Peterkin]

11 minutes ago, J.C.MacSwell said:

Reminds me Trump hasn't threatened the Canary Islands yet, but there's always next week.

They speak Spanish? Ban on the vaccines and medicine, and big tariff on the transformers, unless Spain authorizes 50,000 Hispanic deportees to the islands.  

 

[J.C.MacSwell]

9 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

They speak Spanish? Ban on the vaccines and medicine, and big tariff on the transformers, unless Spain authorizes 50,000 Hispanic deportees to the islands.  

 

The Canaries might not be able to sustain them (The Canaries were actually named after dogs...but even if a just a small portion of the 50,000 were actual illegal aliens they'd have the canine population there devoured within a week!)

Not saying the new administration wouldn't find merit in your plan.

[CharonY]

Argh. I cannot tell if it is satire or a memo from the administration.

[TheVat]

This administration parodies itself.

[iNow]

12 hours ago, Peterkin said:

Their agenda was announced through microphones, on posters, in social media posts. And yet most Americans are still unaware of or denying what they let themselves - and the world - in for.

It’s not “most” Americans, and fora sizable number of those who voted for him it’s not that they’re unaware. In fact, they’ve been primed to desire exactly this and to celebrate it 

1 hour ago, TheVat said:

This administration parodies itself.

Well we are a representative democracy and he’s accurately representing many of our neighbors 

[Peterkin]

9 hours ago, iNow said:

It’s not “most” Americans, and fora sizable number of those who voted for him it’s not that they’re unaware. In fact, they’ve been primed to desire exactly this and to celebrate it 

A sizeable number of those who voted for the persecution of everyone they don't approve of are celebrating now, and surely the Proud Boys are, but they don't know that they effectively ended any semblance of democracy and doe process in America. And of course, they have no idea of the material hardship that will rebound on themselves as a result of this administration's actions. Besides, they voted for Trump, not for the cabal surrounding him. And no, they don't and never did understand the economic, social and legal consequences. I don't know what percent, but many are single-issue voters who ignore everything except their own concern with immigrants, or the teaching of evolution, or abortion, or gun control. I'm also quite sure that a great many men simply voted against women's power, choosing not to think about about all that other stuff.

But, after that spate of hateful edicts in the first week, I'm still seeing a lot of arguments from people far smarter than the average Trump voter, about how the president's powers are limited by the Constitution, and there are laws, etc, etc. On a couple of forums, I'm even seeing arguments like "Nothing will really change". 

 

 

 

9 hours ago, iNow said:

Well we are a representative democracy

That has never been a very accurate description, but there's no point debating that now that it's no longer applicable at all. 

[iNow]

25 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

they don't and never did understand the economic, social and legal consequences

I'm sympathetic to the point you're making, but there is simply no way you can assert this with any credibility. You don't know, yet act as if you're certain. 

[CharonY]

1 hour ago, Peterkin said:

But, after that spate of hateful edicts in the first week, I'm still seeing a lot of arguments from people far smarter than the average Trump voter, about how the president's powers are limited by the Constitution, and there are laws, etc, etc. On a couple of forums, I'm even seeing arguments like "Nothing will really change". 

That seems like just being partially misinformed but not entirely surprising. During the first presidency I was wondering how much of an impact having an idiot as a leader would have in the first place. I.e., how resilient the system is as a whole. While there were cruelties against certain groups, which in itself could be considered a failure, the system mostly kept chugging on. Some folks got the short end of the stick, for sure, but it wasn't as if lack of leadership made the system collapse. The real weaknesses for everyone came (in my mind) during unexpected crises, such as the COVID-19 pandemic, for which system did not exist or were dismantled.

It seems to me that the folks missed the latter part plus the fact that they now have a plan to dismantle the system itself, based on Project 2025. I.e., they only remembered the first part of the presidency.

[Peterkin]

1 hour ago, iNow said:

You don't know, yet act as if you're certain. 

I've been listening carefully to people who do know about economics, law and electoral process. And I've read the executive orders and memoranda and have a pretty good idea where they each lead and where the whole is headed. I'm only 50% certain of the outcome I anticipate - but the other 50% is less rosy.

 

26 minutes ago, CharonY said:

It seems to me that the folks missed the latter part plus the fact that they now have a plan to dismantle the system itself, based on Project 2025. I.e., they only remembered the first part of the presidency.

Selective amnesia is only part of it. The worse part is that they still have not realized that Trump has nothing left to lose - not another election, not another lawsuit, not the Supreme court, not the press, not the future, and no political opposition : they'll al soon be bankrupt, in jail or murdered. All the mechanisms have been put in place, the GOP is well and truly whipped into compliance. He's free to do anything he wants and has much more effective helpers than last time.   

[iNow]

I see it as likely that "opposition" will be "accidentally" caught up in the immigration raids and shipped off to places like Guantanamo off the books / under the guise of border control. 

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-says-he-will-instruct-homeland-security-pentagon-prepare-migrant-facility-2025-01-29/

Quote

President Donald Trump said on Wednesday he will order the Pentagon and the Department of Homeland Security to prepare a migrant detention facility at Guantanamo Bay for as many as 30,000 migrants.