Reactions to President Bush's address

[cosine]

They did? Getting kicked out of the Phillippines was part of a plan? A diversion perhaps? The only "plan" was to defeat the enemy. To hold his advance until sufficient forces could be trained' date=' equipped and brought to bear to defeat him on the battlefield. That sounds to me pretty much what Bush is saying.

 

I didn't see any reference to congressmen in the transcript, could you point out where I missed it? It would seem logical however, that anyone with a "defeatist" or "we can't win, we might as well give up" attitude is not exactly aiding the effort of their nation.

 

I must admit, I simply took the Merry Christmas, Happy Hanuka as brevity. Say those two and you've probably covered 80% of the population. (I don't know what the demographics of the US actually are, I'm just taking a punt here. ) The other option is to drone on for 20 minutes naming every single possibility in the hopes that you haven't left someone out.

 

The Christmas/Holidays Debate.

 

We have this debate down here too. Most Aussies view it as a complete waste of time. I've yet to hear a Muslim, Jew, Buddhist or anyone from any other religion complain about "Merry Christmas", or for that matter "Happy Easter", the other time when this foolishness appears. It always seems to be someone from an Anglo-Saxon background noiseing off about possibly "offending the minorities". Guess what, they don't care.

 

Minorities celebrate their observances without any protest or interference from the Christian (supposedly) majority and they let the Christians celebrate theirs. To be frank, the only times I have ever heard the representative of any minority speak on this subject is to say just that. "We don't care, it doesn't bother us."

 

I hope that's a typo. ( I'm sure it is.)[/quote']

First of all, you have completely missed the idea of the happy holidays debate. Here, it is actually "Happy Holidays" that is the term in common use. That would have taken the President of all Americans less than 20 seconds to say!

 

Oh yeah, and your knowledge of World War II is lacking. This may help:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_War_II_conferences

 

Certain highlights of planning accompanied with the dates of their planning:

Discussed reasons for North African Campaign over cross-channel invasion April 12-17, 1942

Plan Italian Campaign, plan cross channel invasion in 1944 January 14-24, 1943

D-day was scheduled April 17-24, 1943

First meeting of the Big 3, plan the final strategy for the war against Nazi Germany and its allies, set date for Operation Overlord November 28th - December 1, 1943

 

Although I'm sure you were aware of all that, and whatever you wrote was just a typo.

[ecoli]

oh yeah, thought I'd add this cartoon to the Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays bs. From walt Handelsman via Newsday

 

[entwined]

Certain highlights of planning accompanied with the dates of their planning:

Discussed reasons for North African Campaign over cross-channel invasion April 12-17' date=' 1942

Plan Italian Campaign, plan cross channel invasion in 1944 January 14-24, 1943

D-day was scheduled April 17-24, 1943

First meeting of the Big 3, plan the final strategy for the war against Nazi Germany and its allies, set date for Operation Overlord November 28th - December 1, 1943

 

Although I'm sure you were aware of all that, and whatever you wrote was just a typo.[/quote']

 

I think you will find that the bulk (if not all) of the planning during WWII was not announced to the general public before the fact.

 

So, how do you equate todays lack of an announcement - to the world at large - of a military tactical plan, complete with a timetable, to "not having a plan?"

[john5746]

I think you will find that the bulk (if not all) of the planning during WWII was not announced to the general public before the fact.

 

So' date=' how do you equate todays lack of an announcement - to the world at large - of a military tactical plan, complete with a timetable, to "not having a plan?" [/quote']

 

The WAR ended quite a while ago. You remember Bush claiming victory? It was well done, some mistakes, but that is War.

 

Now, one major objective is to train troops. This isn't a secret invasion or covert operation. It should be manageable to some degree. Is it uncertain? Yes. Does that stop people from planning and having goals? I hope not. Can they share some of these goals? I think they have mentioned some goals from time to time, but nothing far-reaching.

 

Will it take 5 years to train and equip a force necessary for Iraq to take care of themselves? If yes, then say it.

 

I don't think anyone can set a timetable for military operations, because they are mainly fighting fires. They will be doing this after we leave. That is the point, our leaving is not contingent on everything in Iraq being A-OK. They need to be equipped to kick butt themselves, including their neighbors. We can help with the neighbor part, but they need to at least take care of themselves.

[entwined]

The WAR ended quite a while ago. You remember Bush claiming victory? It was well done' date=' some mistakes, but that is War.

 

Now, one major objective is to train troops. This isn't a secret invasion or covert operation. It should be manageable to some degree. Is it uncertain? Yes. Does that stop people from planning and having goals? I hope not. Can they share some of these goals? I think they have mentioned some goals from time to time, but nothing far-reaching.

 

Will it take 5 years to train and equip a force necessary for Iraq to take care of themselves? If yes, then say it.

 

I don't think anyone can set a timetable for military operations, because they are mainly fighting fires. They will be doing this after we leave. That is the point, our leaving is not contingent on everything in Iraq being A-OK. They need to be equipped to kick butt themselves, including their neighbors. We can help with the neighbor part, but they need to at least take care of themselves.[/quote']

 

I think that that is what is meant when the administration says, "as the Iraqis stand up we will stand down."

 

There has been no dearth information of that kind regarding when we will leave Iraq, but every time the administration explains that, the liberals say "well, what does that mean?"

 

The answer is, of course, that it means exactly what it says it means - as Iraqi's stand up, we will stand down and leave. It is the insistence on some sort of time table that is unacceptable.

 

Edited to add:

I would say for the benefit of those who want to know when, that it will be no less than 1 year, and no more than 5 years until Iraq is in a position to defend itself from all enemys foreign and domestic..That means from the insurgents and from their neighbors.

[bascule]

Why? Did you think the Republicans were "better" than the Democrats?

 

It seems moot to respond as you appear to be Permanently Banned, but having a video on http://MoveOn.org is a hell of a lot different than having it on http://dnc.org. http://MoveOn.org is no more representative of the Democrats as a whole than http://NationalVanguard.org is of the Republicans (i.e. you're committing a composition fallacy)

 

This video was on the front page of http://GOP.com, which is representative of the Republicans as a whole.

[JohnB]

First of all, you have completely missed the idea of the happy holidays debate. Here, it is actually "Happy Holidays" that is the term in common use.

Ah. My apologies, while we have a similar debate down here, it is "Merry Christmas" that is standard and the push is for "Happy Holidays". It appears both our nations have a similar debate but from differing directions. On that basis, it probably would have been better for him to say "Happy Holidays".

 

Concerning the list, yes I was aware of the conferences. Unfortunately they were pretty much of the type "We've done this, what will we do next" In other words they are "a piece at a time" response to the fortunes of war. There was no overarching plan that these fit in to. Which was my point.

 

If using the list of conferences shows that there was a "plan" in WW II, then surely the conferences that have been going on concerning Iraq would show that there is also a "plan" there. Whether or not the public is privy to any knowledge of these conferences or what they discuss is a moot point.

 

Anyway mate, Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays, whichever you prefer. If you're out on the road watch out for the idiots that drink and drive.

[cosine]

Ah. My apologies' date=' while we have a similar debate down here, it is "Merry Christmas" that is standard and the push is for "Happy Holidays". It appears both our nations have a similar debate but from differing directions. On that basis, it probably would have been better for him to say "Happy Holidays".

 

Concerning the list, yes I was aware of the conferences. Unfortunately they were pretty much of the type "We've done this, what will we do next" In other words they are "a piece at a time" response to the fortunes of war. There was no overarching plan that these fit in to. Which was my point.

 

If using the list of conferences shows that there was a "plan" in WW II, then surely the conferences that have been going on concerning Iraq would show that there is also a "plan" there. Whether or not the public is privy to any knowledge of these conferences or what they discuss is a moot point.

 

Anyway mate, Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays, whichever you prefer. If you're out on the road watch out for the idiots that drink and drive.[/quote']

 

Yeah, I don't know if we could even continue a debate on this until after any news of any conferences would ever become public knowledge... I don't know how public the WWII conferences were.

 

On that note, you have some happy and safe holidays too. Unfortunantly drunk driving is a global phenomenon! (Except Saudi Arabia maybe, where alcohol is prohibited.)