Naming Organics

[Invader_Gir]

Could someone help me with naming the attached organic molecule.

Sorry for the crappy diagrahm, but I did my best. Would the parent compound be Toluene? Would the name be 2-Hydroxy-3-Oxy-Oxytoluene? I have yet to take organic yet, so I have very basic knowledge of organic nomenclature. Thank you very much.

[silkworm]

This isn't toluene because it is not a substituted benzene.

 

The functional group naming hierarchy goes:

 

Carboxylic Acid>Anhydride>Ester>Alkanoyl Halide>Amide>Nitrile>Aldehyde>Ketone>Ether>Alcohol>Thiol>Amine

 

So it appears to me that you have... ...

 

I was going to name that for you but I got snagged. I'd keep it a little simpler if I were you since you haven't taken one yet.

[Invader_Gir]

It's ok if the name is over my head, could you please still tell me what the name is? And I may not have taken organic chemistry yet, but that doesn't mean I haven't read any books =P. Thanks

[silkworm]

What I'm saying is that's a tough one and you should probably look at other stuff.

 

But, and I'm only guessing here by IUPAC rules, the name is, 4-hydroxy 1,5-oxy 1,4-hexadiEn-3-one

 

I'm sure this isn't right. This one is really tricky for me. What screws me up is the oxygen para to the carbonyl. It's not benzene and I can't call it cyclohexadiene because that leaves out that oxygen.

 

Definitely not toluene, that's all I can be sure of.

[RyanJ]

I have not finished (Actually I have not started) the organic chemistry part of my chemistry course yet so I cna't answer this but I have a link that may help you...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IUPAC_nomenclature

 

Cheers & Good Luck,

 

Ryan Jones

[akcapr]

wouldnt you use para and stuff because otherwise you could just read of silkworms name and draw it as a straight chain. Youd need to show it is a ring.

[silkworm]

wouldnt you use para and stuff because otherwise you could just read of silkworms name and draw it as a straight chain. Youd need to show it is a ring.

 

You couldn't use the para stuff because it's not a carbon ring like benzene or cyclohexane. I bet the ring has a special name, and you can't call it cyclohexadiene because of that oxygen. I figure in my botched attempt at a name I implied it as cyclic because I said 1,5-oxy and not 1,5-dioxy. But that was just my best shot. I would like someone to explain this, it's a tough one.

[YT2095]

isn`t it usualy "Traditional" to work from the OH as an "OL" in the count? and then we`de have the 2 methyl and so forth?

so whatever the Ring was called would thatOL as the ending name or you could adopt the Hydroxy protocol, so if for instance it was Benzene, it would be either 1 hyroxy benzene or just plain old PhenOL.

 

btw, does this Chem actualy exist?

 

edit: just to add that my reply is no way meant as an answer, it`s largely for my own edification also, as I`m still doing Organic Chem 101 myself so to speak.

[Darkblade48]

Well, according to Chemdraw Ultra, the IUPAC name of this molecule is:

 

3-hydroxy-2-methyl-4H-pyran-4-one

[silkworm]

isn`t it usualy "Traditional" to work from the OH as an "OL" in the count? and then we`de have the 2 methyl and so forth?

so whatever the Ring was called would thatOL as the ending name or you could adopt the Hydroxy protocol' date=' so if for instance it was Benzene, it would be either 1 hyroxy benzene or just plain old PhenOL.[/quote']

 

It's based on the functional group of the molecule, which is based on the naming hierarchy I posted above. By the hierarchy, that molecule appears to be a ketone, which is also what darkblade48 came up with. If the molecule where an alcohol the name would end in 3-ol (the lower number because numbering the chain would start the other way). Because alcohol is not the functional group it is not the suffix and is designated by the hydroxy prefix. With phenol the alcohol is the functional group on the benzene ring, so it is an -ol.

 

You wouldn't have any methyl groups in that molecule (if it were a chain) because all Carbons can be included in the chain. However, this ring has a name so it is a substituted ring (pointed out by pyran-) and not a chain so it is a subsituted ring and does have a methyl group.

[Invader_Gir]

In response to YT: Yes this compound does exist. There was a presentation at my college a few weeks ago about how scent functions. The presenter had an array of different esters and things that had distinct smells. This one in particular caught my fancy, since it had the aroma of cotton candy. I was hoping to fix me up some, but whatever. Thanks for all the replies!

[BeYeu05]

You have a 5-Carbon chain, so the base would be penta-

 

Double C=C bond gets first priority, so there are dienes at 1,4

 

There is a ketone at Carbon 3 , so we have 3-one

 

There is an ester (??!!). We'll call it 1,5-oxy.

 

And finally, there is a methyl on carbon #5.

 

So it should be:

 

4-hydroxy-5-methyl-1,5-oxy-3(penta-1,4-dieneone).

[BeYeu05]

Or, as my professor would say call it, "BULLLLLLLLLLSHITTTT!!!"

 

=D

[silkworm]

You don't mean ester yuo mean ether, and you start the carbon count from based on the hierarchy of functional groups, so the carbon double bonded to oxygen would be carbon 1. Carbon 2 would be the one attached to the OH, but then the chain is interrupted at the methyl group. The ether that is part of this ring seriously disrupts the naming unless there is a special name for this ring that you can simply sub from.

 

This is what darkblade had in post # 9 of this thread:

 

Well, according to Chemdraw Ultra, the IUPAC name of this molecule is:

 

3-hydroxy-2-methyl-4H-pyran-4-one

 

Obviously this ring has a special name designated by the pyran- prefix. So then just naming the additions to the ring work.

 

Note: Esters have the form COOR. Or O=C-OR. The OR and the =O are attached the the same carbon. That is not present in this ring.

[BeYeu05]

Thanks, silkworm!

[YT2095]

the hierarchy of functional groups.

 

aha! being new(ish) to Orgo I never knew there was one, is there a list anywhere that I can have a look at with them in order of priority?

I`ve encountered similar "obsticles" pertaining to this in the past, a list I can learn by rote would save alot of hassle for me

[silkworm]

Wow, I would have posted earlier but I had no idea there was a post here.

 

I looked for a good list of a whole series of functional groups to give you a proper idea of how IUPAC does it, but a pretty girl is using my book and I don't trust my memory well enough to post the order of carboxylic acid derivates all the way down with any real certainty.

 

I can say this though, at the top are carboxylic acids and their derivatives and at the bottom are alkanes. As soon as I run across a list I'll post it here.

[Darkblade48]

Here's the order that I copied from Wikipedia

 

Functional group

Cations e.g. Ammonium

 

Thiocarboxylic acids

Selenocarboxylic acids

Sulfonic acids

Sulfinic acids

Sulfenic acids

 

Carboxylic acid derivatives

Esters

Acyl chlorides

Amides

Imides

Amidines

 

Nitriles

Isonitriles

 

Aldehydes

Thioaldehydes

 

Ketones

Thioketones

 

Alcohols

Thiols

Selenols

Tellurols

 

Hydroperoxides

 

Amines

Imines

Hydrazines

 

Ethers

Thioethers

Selenoethers

 

Peroxides

Disulfides