Parapsychology?

[starbug1]

good or bad?

[EvoN1020v]

I looked in the dictionary for "parapsychology". It said, "The study of the evidence for psychological phenomena, such as telepathy, clairvoyance, and psychokinesis, that are inexplicable by science".

 

I don't see any point of discussing this, if it's "inexplicable by science".

 

But to be frankly honest, I wish we do have teleporter, so I can travel to distant places very quickly.

[starbug1]

I looked in the dictionary for "parapsychology". It said' date=' "The study of the evidence for psychological phenomena, such as telepathy, clairvoyance, and psychokinesis, that are inexplicable by science".

[/quote']

 

And there are four forms. You have:

 

telekinesis - the supposed ability to move objects at a distance by mental power or other nonphysical means. a.k.a. psychokinesis

 

precognition - foreknowledge of an event, the foreknowledge of a paranormal kind, such as premonitions and fortune telling.

 

clairvoyance - the supposed faculty of perceiving things or events in the future or beyond normal sensory contact. a.k.a. sixth sense

 

telepathy - the direct transmission of thoughts or ideas from person to person without anything being spoken or written down. a.k.a. mind-reading.

 

All these are forms of ESP. Consider a world where we all had the innate ability of telepathy say. Would knowing what your friends are really thinking be good or bad?

 

If science could explain parapsychology, what would this mean? Obviously, science can't explain it, and parapsychology is a classified field that have true accounts everywhere. Telekinesis has been documented (although this may have been the result of brainwashing or technology). Near-death experiences are accounted for around the world. And science can't explain it all.

 

So I'm asking: good or bad?

[sunspot]

Paraphychology is unexplanable by science because the best minds in physics are relunctant to give it a whirl. All that leaves are scientists who are constrained by lack of resources, skepticism, and some good working physics theory.

[starbug1]

Paraphychology is unexplanable by science because the best minds in physics are relunctant to give it a whirl. All that leaves are scientists who are constrained by lack of resources, skepticism, and some good working physics theory.

 

Nonetheless...it is rather mysterious and somewhat confusing.

 

think experiment: If you could read minds (authentically) would you go crazy. If everybody could read minds, would this cause disatrous effects on the brain and psyche? No branch of psychology can comment scientifically on it, and I think it would have some peculiar effects.

 

If Psychokinesis were widespread, what would this do for war? Can anyone say X-men?

[SorceressPol]

Good. Not to mention we're already starting to do this stuff with technology. There's that guy I read in an article who has his brain hooked up to a computer, and he's essentially controlling the environment around him with his mind.

[starbug1]

Good. Not to mention we're already starting to do this stuff with technology. There's that guy I read in an article who has his brain hooked up to a computer, and he's essentially controlling the environment around him with his mind.

 

have a link?

[sunspot]

I believe much of para-psychology can be explain without physics. The estimate is that we use about 10% of the brain. The other 90% is not brain dead. It is fully functional but at an unconscious level.

 

The right side of the brain has been shown to be more spatial. This implies spatial memory organization. The left side is more rational (cause and affect) memory organization. Through subliminal experiences, these memories might be spatially integrated by the unconscious in the right side of the brain. Intuitions or hunches from the unconscious, may be output from the spatial memory and would make it easier to predict new or future things that fall under similar integrated categories.

 

For example, Nancy Reagan, President Reagan's wife was said to be someone who could meet a person and intuitively know something about them and their intensions. Many decades of parties, meeting thousands of people, as an actress, governors wife and first lady, her unconscious mind probably created distinct memory categories of people type. These categories would be triggered during a quick meeting and she could often intuitively know someone. This can be explained via intuitions associated with the spatial memory.

[SorceressPol]

have a link?

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/science/story/0,12996,1448908,00.html

[starbug1]

Nina Kulagina

 

This is exactly what I was talking about. Read and tell me if having such psychic powers as a common human attribute would be beneficial or detrimental to society. Would it be as cool as it was in Star Wars? would there be a good force and dark force? Or would it turn out like Ghostbusters and harness all the bad psychic energy and transform into a massive evil entity come to destroy the city?

 

 

 

 

Nina was always aware that she had psychic powers. She could mentally see things inside people’s pockets, and when she met sick people she could identify the disease they were suffering from, an image of the illness appearing in her mind. On one occasion when she was in a particularly angry mood, she was walking towards a cupboard in her apartment when a jug in the cupboard suddenly moved to the edge of the shelf, fell and smashed to pieces on the floor. After that, changes began to take place in her apartment. Lights went on and off; objects became animated and seemed somehow to be attracted to her. It was similar to having a poltergeist, but Nina knew the psychic power was coming from her, and discovered that, if she tried, she could control it.

 

In 1964, while in hospital recovering from a nervous breakdown, Nina spent a lot of time sewing. Doctors were amazed when they saw that she was able to reach into her sewing basket and choose any colour of thread she needed without looking at it. Local parapsychologists were contacted and the following year, when she had fully recovered, she agreed to take part in various experiments. Nina was tested and it was found that she could indeed ‘see’ colours with her fingertips, bringing to mind Rosa Kuleshova, a school teacher from the Ural Mountains, who also possessed this talent.

 

Nina would sit at a table and stare at a small object, such as a matchbox or a wineglass, and make it move without touching it. Apparently her powers did not come straight away, hours of preparation may be needed, which, as sceptics have pointed out, does not favour the setting up of strictly supervised demonstrations. In order to move things with mind power alone she found she had to clear all other thoughts from her head, and told investigators that when her concentration was successful, there was a sharp pain in her spine, and her eyesight blurred. Nina practiced hard, focusing her powers, and was soon able to move matchsticks, fountain pens and compass needles.

 

One of the first scientists to take an interest in her was Biologist Edward Naumov. In an early test he scattered a box of matches on a bench; Nina held her hands over them, trembling with the strain. Suddenly, all the matches moved together to the edge of the bench, then fell one by one to the floor.

 

Tell me how this can be explained.

 

Stories of this amazing woman began to reach the West through the international wire services in the spring of 1968. In the same year, films of Kulagina moving objects, ostensibly using only her mind, were shown at the First Moscow International Conference on Parapsychology and were also seen by some Western scientists.

 

For a brief time Western investigators were permitted to meet Russian mediums, witness Nina Kulagina for themselves and verify the reports of her PK abilities made by Soviet scientists. In1970 William A. McGary, one of a group from the United States investigating psychic phenomena in Russia, described a session in which Kulagina caused several small objects, including a wedding ring and the top of a condiment bottle, to move across a dining-room table. She also caused the wedding ring to rotate on an invisible axis on the table. Another of the American investigators, Gaither Pratt, of the University of Virginia, stated that the objects which Kulagina could move varied widely in material, shape and weight, and when they moved they progressed slowly and steadily, or occasionally in fits and starts. Precautions were taken to make sure that Kulagina wasn’t using a concealed magnet or threads, and films were taken of the experiments which confirm that no known force could explain the movements.

 

Dr. Zdenek Rejdak, a prominent Czech scientist connected with a Prague Military Institute, tested Kulagina personally and reported the results in Czech Pravda. He stated:

 

‘I visited the Kulagina family the evening of 26 February, 1968. Mr. Blazek, an editor friend was with me, also a physician, Dr. J.S. Zverev, and Dr. Sergeyev. Her husband, an engineer, was also present. Dr. Zverev gave Mrs. Kulagina a very thorough physical examination. Tests with special instruments failed to show any indication whatever of magnets or any other concealed object.

 

‘We checked the table thoroughly and also asked Mrs. Kulagina frequently to change position at the table. We passed a compass around her body and the chair and table with negative results. I asked her to wash her hands. After concentrating, she turned the compass needle more than ten times, then the entire compass and its case, a matchbox and some twenty matches at once. I placed a cigarette in front of her. She moved that too, at a glance. I shredded it afterwards and there was nothing inside it. In between each set of tests, she was again physically examined by the doctor.’

 

In one significant filmed Moscow test, set up by a group of well known physicists, several nonmagnetic objects including matches were placed inside a large Plexiglas cube. The cube was to prevent drafts of air, threads or wires; methods long favoured by sceptics as the means by which Kulagina performed her ‘tricks’. Her hands moved a few inches from the Plexiglas cover and the objects danced from side to side in the plastic container. In another filmed experiment, a ping-pong ball is seen levitating and hovering in the air for a few seconds, before falling back onto the table. In yet another she is shown both indoors and outside in a garden, where objects near her spin round or slide in different directions.

 

An additional and lesser known, ability of Kulagina was noted by physicist Dr. V.F. Shvetz. He observed that she was able to make the letters A or O appear on photo paper and sometimes could also transfer an outline of a picture she’d seen onto photo paper, recalling the ‘thoughtography’ talents of the controversial Ted Serios in America. Occasionally, unexplained burn marks appeared on Kulagina’s hands and, on several occasions, shocked scientists saw her clothes catch fire.

 

Towards the end of her life Kulagina demonstrated this power on TV, causing a bright red patch to appear on the arm of a European journalist.

 

I was skeptical at first until I saw the video. I was awestruck. Supposedly there are more accounts of this gift in other people, and I think there may be a woman living today who can accomplish some of the feats Nina has done.

 

The burning hand was also pretty cool. She could generate heat with her hands!

 

Doctor Leonid L. Vasiliev, a psychologist at Leningrad University, had pioneered ESP study in Russia at the Institute for Brain Research in Leningrad, and was one of the first to test Kulagina, continuing to do so right up until his death in 1966. His experiments with her were often filmed; in fact there are over 60 films of Nina in action. Unfortunately in many of these the picture quality is lacking, and it’s not always easy to see exactly what is going on. Another Soviet scientist, Dr. Genady Sergeyev, a well-known physiologist working in a Leningrad military laboratory, did several years of intensive laboratory research on Kulagina, and made special studies of the electrical potentials in Kulagina’s brain.

 

During observations he recorded exceptionally strong voltages and other unusual effects. In one series of experiments in Leningrad, recalling those of Dr. Shvetz, he and his colleagues placed undeveloped photo film in a black envelope. By staring at the envelope Kulagina was able to expose the film inside.

 

A Strange Mind Power Experiment

 

One of Kulagina’s strangest filmed experiments involved the effect of her powers on a raw egg floating in a tank of saline solution almost two metres away from her. Using intense concentration, she slowly separated the yolk from the white of the egg, and moved the two apart; if she focused her energies for long enough, she could put the egg back together again. But the most unusual experiment of all took place in the Leningrad laboratory on 10 March, 1970. Satisfied that Kulagina had the ability to move inanimate objects, scientists were curious to know whether Nina’s abilities extended to cells, tissues, and organs. Sergeyev was one of the many scientists in attendance when Kulagina attempted to use her energy to stop the beating of a frog's heart, floating in solution, and then re-activate it. She focused intently on the heart and summoned all her powers. First she made it beat faster – then slower, and, using intense will power, she stopped it. Apparently she could also disrupt human heart beats – on one occasion giving a hostile Leningrad psychiatrist a frightening first-hand experience of her power.

 

In one of the (silent) films shot of experiments with Kulagina in her Leningrad apartment she is seen seated at a large, round, white table, in front of a lace-curtain window. According to Russian scientists she had, on this occasion, already been physically examined by a medical doctor, who had x-rayed her to make sure there were no hidden magnets or anything else concealed on her person, nor any pieces of shrapnel lodged in her body from her war injury. She was found to be clean and the experiment begun.

 

The film crew, scientists – Naumov among them, and reporters, moved in for a close –up. Naumov placed a compass on a wristband, a vertical cigarette, a pen top, a small metal cylinder like a saltshaker, and a matchbox on the table in front of her. Kulagina began with the compass – apparently the easiest object to warm up on.

 

She held her fingers parallel to the table about six inches above the compass and started moving her hands in a circular motion. For a while nothing happened . . . then the needle quivered and slowly began to rotate counter clockwise, then the whole compass, case and all, began to spin.

 

The 'Impossibility' of PK abilities

 

Naturally, Kulagina was not without her critics, but sometimes it went beyond criticism. In the Moscow paper Pravda there was a vicious attack on Kulagina, demonizing her and calling her a fake and a cheat. It was said that she performed her tricks with the help of concealed magnets and threads, though how magnets could move nonmagnetic things like glass, eggs, apples and bread was not explained. Kulagina also proved that she could move any one or two objects from a group chosen by the investigator. This again speaks against fraud. In the end it was revealed that the author of the Pravda piece had never even seen Kulagina. He had decided that PK was impossible therefore she must be cheating.

 

At the same time as the Pravda article, a campaign of harassing phone calls began against Kulagina. It was unlikely that these were merely harmless crank calls - there were no telephone books in Russia at that time; to get somebody’s phone number involved lining up for hours at special address booths in the streets. Secondly, she was known to the public as Nelya Mikhailova, not by her real name of Nina Kulagina. So whoever was calling had to know her real name and her address. It seems likely that it had been well organised. But by whom? Was the KGB involved? The calls finally got so out of hand that the scientists decided to hide Kulagina in the country outside Leningrad.

 

Contrary to what some sceptics have claimed, Kulagina was not only tested in her own apartment and in hotel rooms, but also by eminent Soviet scientists in controlled laboratory conditions. They more than once stated that after watching Nina in action that they had found ‘no hidden threads, magnets, or other gimmicks.’ Chairman of Theoretical Physics at Moscow University, Dr. Ya. Terletsky declared on 17 March, 1968, in Moscow Pravda: ‘Mrs. Kulagina displays a new and unknown form of energy.’ The Mendeleyev Institute of Metrology also studied Nina, and announced in Moscow Pravda that she had moved aluminium pipes and matches under stringent test conditions, including surveillance on closed-circuit television. They could not explain how the objects had moved.

 

But there was a down side to all this. Kulagina’s powers had always taken a lot out of her. After one set of tests with Dr. Rejdak she was totally exhausted, and had almost no pulse. Her face was pale and drained and she could hardly move her body. She had lost almost four pounds in half an hour (many Western mediums, such as American Felicia Parise, have also described this weight loss during PK); it was as if she were converting the matter of her own body into energy. According to Dr. Zverev’s report, her heart-beat was irregular, there was high blood sugar, and her endocrine system was disturbed. All this was consistent with high stress. She had also lost the sensation of taste, suffered from pains in her arms and legs, couldn’t coordinate, and felt dizzy.

 

Her powers eventually led to a strain on her health culminating, in the late seventies, in a near fatal heart attack. Her doctors recommended that she reduce her activity, though she kept up some lab work until she died in 1990, around the time of the death of the Soviet Union itself. At her funeral, Soviets praised her as a ‘hero of Leningrad’ after her bravery during the nine-hundred-day siege of World War II. But many also lauded her for sacrifices of a different kind to her country, allowing scientists and doctors to examine and test her incessantly in their quest for an unknown and elusive energy. In the end this exhausted her, ruined her health, and probably hastened her death.

 

It may all seem a bit stretched. It's not though, I can atest to that. After researching this woman and seeing her in action, I've come to fully understand what Einstein was saying about "the potential of the human mind." Its just unfortunate that psychic powers aren't passed genetically like hemophilia.

[Idolator]

it needs no explanation. it is only hearsay.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0801878675/104-2272470-8510305?v=glance&n=283155

 

I'd point out that many magicians can do similar things.

[starbug1]

very true.

 

I was taught that parapsychology is and will never be considered a real practical science for two reasons:

 

1) results are inconsistent for each trial, so no truth can accurately be taken from collected data.

 

2) methods for practice are slipshod, and everyone uses a different method.

 

Is there anything else to add to this?

[herpguy]

3) No one knows how to even test this accurately. It needs to be looked at more often to even have an idea...

[Connor]

4) Nobody has ever displayed paranormal activity in any legitimate scientific investigation

 

 

parapsychology, bah

[starbug1]

4) Nobody has ever displayed paranormal activity in any legitimate scientific investigation

 

 

parapsychology' date=' bah[/quote']

 

can you back this up with any evidence or links?

[Idolator]

5) no convincing mechanism for psychic powers has ever been proposed.

[Sisyphus]

can you back this up with any evidence or links?

 

Hehe. If there was any legitimate scientific evidence for any of those things, they wouldn't be parapsychology, now would they? So, by definition, no, there's no evidence. That doesn't mean, however, that there isn't a thriving industry of kooks (both those who believe they have "psychic" powers and those who claim authority on the matter, like the "parapsychologists" in the story) and hoaxters (both those who carry out the hoaxes and those who shamelessly and irresponsibly lend credence to the nonsense by pretending there is a "controversy," like the Discovery Channel in recent years). File all this stuff right along with alien abduction stories and faith healing.

 

Recommended reading:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/sr=8-1/qid=1141640308/ref=pd_bbs_1/002-8997837-1686452?%5Fencoding=UTF8

[insane_alien]

psychokinesis(telekinesis) would be so cool. pity its a whole load of bull as far as it goes with us. Maybe some alien species could do it by manipulating electric fields or something.

[Anjruu]

"4) Nobody has ever displayed paranormal activity in any legitimate scientific investigation"

 

Well, that's a bit hard to prove. If it DID, it probably would not be publicized.

 

"5) no convincing mechanism for psychic powers has ever been proposed."

 

Well, pre-Einstein, no mechanism for gravity had been either. And pre-Newton, nobody had even considered the force downwards to be the same force that...etc.

 

I am not saying I believe in such a field, rather, I think that this could very well be a Copernicus or Avagadro situation. Nobody believed them either. I do not know enough about it to make an educated opinion. However, I do know that we do not know everything about the physical world. While, yes, there is such a thing as having a mind so "open that it falls out" as someone so pithily commented a while back, sometimes an open mind is very important.

 

Again, I think the likely-hood of this being real is almost negligible. But then again, I don't get quantum mechanics either.

[Connor]

Well' date=' that's a bit hard to prove. If it DID, it probably would not be publicized.

[/quote']

 

why not?

[Edtharan]

A good argument against the existance of parapsycological effects (telekinisis, precognition, etc) is that if these effects were real then evolution would have used them. An animal that could sence if it was going to be eaten (precognition) would then be able to change what it was going to do so that it wouldn't get eaten. Therefor all predators would stave. This hasn't occured so the evidence seems to be that these phenomina do not occure.

 

Also if the ability to communicate accross large distances by though alone (telepathy) then we would not have needed to be able to speak (telepathy would be quicker and could be done over long distances). Other animals would also have evolved this trait as they could then communicate (simple as it might be) without revealing themselves to preadtors (another good survival trait). As this is not the sistuation, then the conclusion must be drawn that this is also not poasable.

 

If any of the "psychic" phenomina existed, they would give such an advanteg to the animal that developed it, that spiecies would never be subject to predation or need for voalization for communication (ie: mobile phones would be useless ).

[Bettina]

Gallese contends that when we interact with someone, we do more than just observe the other person’s behavior. He believes we create internal representations of their actions, sensations and emotions within ourselves, as if we are the ones that are moving, sensing and feeling.

 

Many scientists believe that mirror neurons embody the predictions of simulation theory. "We share with others not only the way they normally act or subjectively experience emotions and sensations, but also the neural circuits enabling those same actions, emotions and sensations: the mirror neuron systems," Gallese told LiveScience.

 

I have two major problems in my life, both of which were the reasons I came to this forum looking for help. This is one of them.

 

Don't be too quick to judge and before you say anything, I am my biggest skeptic, but it continues to happen to me, and its a bummer.

 

http://www.livescience.com/humanbiology/050427_mind_readers.html

 

Bettina