We have no resonsibility for the past?

[garytse86]

We have no resonsibility for the past? What do you think about this topic?

[YT2095]

your statment implies a veiw from a present perspective and so past tense events are unchangable.

we do have responsibility for the NOW.

 

other than that, it`s a bold statement of the Obvious

[atinymonkey]

Well, try arguing that in a court of law. It'd be funny........

[Sayonara]

It could be argued that someone who was the forward focal point of a predestination paradox was just as responsible for prior events as those people involved in the paradox who preceded them.

[atinymonkey]

atinymonkey said in post #3 :

Well, try arguing that in a court of law. It'd be funny........

 

[aman]

I didn't do it, at least I didn't get caught. Somebody else is responsible. That still doesn't mean we aren't all stuck with fixin the whatever.

Just aman

[Dudde]

personally, depending on how far back you're talking, we aren't responsible for the past. but it still affects us all, and we still have to clean up after it

 

maybe the past should try and be a little more responsible

[blike]

I feel we're responsible for actions we (as in yourself, not collective 'we') have or havn't taken in the past. But I dont' feel it goes beyond that.

 

I did not make your great great grandfather a slave, don't take it out on me.

[neo_maya]

blike said in post #8 :

I feel we're responsible for actions we (as in yourself, not collective 'we') have or havn't taken in the past. But I dont' feel it goes beyond that.

 

I did not make your great great grandfather a slave, don't take it out on me.

 

 

- Every action has its equal and opposite reaction - Someone has to pay.

[neo_maya]

" Du guna Dottar, Chou Guna Zuzar"

 

- It means - "If u do something bad, u r gonna pay twice the price."

 

(Actually it means u do something (good or evil), ur prize will be doubled).

[Glider]

neo_maya said in post #9 :

- Every action has its equal and opposite reaction - Someone has to pay.

 

Who?

 

Who will you choose to pay for something over which they had no influence or control, principally due to the fact they never even existed?

 

Where's the justice in holding somebody responsible for acts/situations over which they had no control or influence, nor were even alive to witness?

 

Whilst people today have a responsibility to learn from the past (to ensure the crappier bits aren't repeated), attempts to hold them accountable for things that happened before they were born can only result in bad feeling all round and an increased probability that the crappier bits of the past are repeated.

[neo_maya]

Glider said in post #11 :

 

Who?

 

Who will you choose to pay for something over which they had no influence or control, principally due to the fact they never even existed?

 

 

I don't know, I don't wanna know. There are some things that go beyond any logical explanation and they don't need any. U can't feel it until u r the one who suffered. I had just the right example for u but I am not gonna give u that one. And I will certainly not give any explanation for my feelings.

 

I know, my opinion just doesn't sound right and it isn't.

 

Sorry, if I offended u. That was not my intention at all.

 

No hard feelings, Let's just forget what I said, and if anyone wants - he or she can tell me and I will edit my post - or if someone can tell me how, I will also delete my posts.

[YT2095]

it sounds a bit like you`re refering to `Karma`

the saying I often use is : "What goes around comes around, 3 fold" for both good and/or bad things. but I think that`s just largely a personal beleif system coupled with wishfull thinking on occasion

I`m not sure, but I think it maybe the Buddists that beleive in something similar with regards reincarnation, kill a ant and in the next life you`ll come back as one type of thing.

I don`t think what the bible says in parts about the sins of the fathers being visited upon thier children (or something similar), is a good justice system at all, I think that`s a perfectly rotten way to do things. personal responsibility and accountablity seem the best method

[DarkApostle]

First off, in my experience action means everything. No matter what it is action thats causes change in this univerese, obviously. However how can one be held responsible for something another has done? To me that's just an excuse and when it comes to excuses there are non there is only reason.

 

While we exist in a time frame (on an agreement level) we understand that it is time which records and keeps record, reality of action is unforgiving. Just as I read in the earthquake thread, the movements of one are felt by another at a later time, so it is with action. Some actions are felt upon impact others at a later time.

[Dudde]

I fail to see the relevence of buddhism in this conversation?

they believe that you're reincarnated, and that you are reborn depending on how you acted in your previous life, and that things come back at you whether good or bad

 

something like that, ask my mom, she'll be happy to jam it in your nose ()

 

in any case, those in the present should do whatever necessary to accomodate for the rising population to help everyone gain at least some degree of happiness. That means using your best behavior and indoor voices.

 

and when you get out of line, you should be given to me, for torture purposes....I could really make a living out of that...good thing I'm not buddhist, cause I'd be in heavy snizzin' trouble if that happened

[Skye]

Intent and duty of care play a role too. You might not have meant to run down the 5 year old. But you should have stopped when you realised you did.

[daisy]

Personally I don't believe that the sins of the fathers should be visited on the children...or whatever the correct quotation is. I am most decidedly NOT responsible for any actions my parents/grandparents made.....but I may feel ashamed of them if I were the offspring of a Nazi. That would not, however, make me responsible for the suffering they caused. And it's exactly as Glider says....who would you make pay?

[YT2095]

Most decent people pay. we OWE it to ourselves and others to make every effort not to repeat these things again, and it`s such a small a price really. I can partly understand (though not agree with) the concept of `Hell`, because when such people as the nazis seemingly apear to get away with it, there must be some personal consolation in beleiving that they`ll spend eternity in a bad place.

[DarkApostle]

YT2095 said in post #18 :

Most decent people pay. we OWE it to ourselves and others to make every effort not to repeat these things again, and it`s such a small a price really. I can partly understand (though not agree with) the concept of `Hell`, because when such people as the nazis seemingly apear to get away with it, there must be some personal consolation in beleiving that they`ll spend eternity in a bad place.

 

I agree with you for the most part, learn from others mistakes. Often you will find people falling into the cycles of stupidity and continue to make the same mistakes others have. It is important to never forget mistakes to learn from them Here and Now , for here and now is what's important.

 

Death is a great nothingness, once you die, you're dead for the most part. I personally don't agree with the concept of life through death. This would defete the purpose of wisdom.

[Dudde]

YT2095 said in post #18 :

I can partly understand (though not agree with) the concept of `Hell`, because when such people as the nazis seemingly apear to get away with it, there must be some personal consolation in beleiving that they`ll spend eternity in a bad place.

 

I don't think wishing an eternity of damnation on someone is the sort of forgiveness the Christian/etc. God is talking about..

[DarkApostle]

YT2095 said in post #18 :

Most decent people pay. we OWE it to ourselves and others to make every effort not to repeat these things again, and it`s such a small a price really. I can partly understand (though not agree with) the concept of `Hell`, because when such people as the nazis seemingly apear to get away with it, there must be some personal consolation in beleiving that they`ll spend eternity in a bad place.

 

I would like to argue that the Nazis did not get away with their mistakes. They were stripped of their power, they did die in the end. They did not get away with anything. More importantly, they were not duplicated which also shows a sign of being conquered.

[YT2095]

and so do you HONESTLY think that they got all they deserved for the millions upon millions of attrocities they commited?

Hmmm... I don`t think so! and there`s still some out there free, and don`t think for a second that nazism is over, they don`t ALL speak German ya know.

I`m not a "christian", but if there was a "hell" they can all go there!

I`m leaving this thread now, it`s not an area I wish to get roped into, I love Science, THAT`S why I`m here

[atinymonkey]

DarkApostle said in post #21 :

They did not get away with anything. More importantly, they were not duplicated which also shows a sign of being conquered.

 

The 3rd Reich is not likely to be the last one. America has drawn quite a few comparisons between the Roman Empire and it’s own regime, and the Roman regime was the 1st Reich. Not that I'm saying Americans are Nazis, more like the Romans, but those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

[Dudde]

pfft

we all know America is screwed

 

just look at who we have for president?

it can only go down from there

[alt_f13]

Hey guess what!

 

Eagles - US, Nazi Germany, Rome...and mexico for some reason.

 

All hail Pax Americana.