The math of music

[sunspot]

Music is applied mathematics. If we look at a single note from any audio source, it can be defined with three mathematical parameters; attack, sustain and release. During the attack, the math function of going from zero sound to sort of steady state. The attack of a piano note is a different wave function than say that from a violin. The sustain is how the note propagates. It can be uniform or can even fluctuate like the human voice. The decay, is the note decreasing in volume toward zero volume. This can happen abruptly or slowly decay linearly or using other math functions. Using a wide variety of math wave functions and these three parameters, one can make any sound type.

 

Beyond the single note, the musical scale is an octadecimial system of eight notes per scale. Each note on the scale sets the average frequency for the attack, sustain and the release. To get even more complicated, notes are often used as cords, where several notes are played together. When a band is playing, several sound types can overlap or even weave in and out to create even more complicated sound composites.

 

What is sort of interesting about the math of music is that it appears to create endless variations, especially the more sounds that come into play. I am always amazed that music doesn't run out of songs, but just when it appears all the music has been made, a new classic is born. But at the same time, there is no indication that a peak can be achieved. Although some of the Classical composers came close.

 

Music is sort of like a fountain of mathematics, but a finite fountain that can never quite reach the sky. The reason for this is that the theme of music is only a limited set of human experience, with the math of music setting the ambience for the limited scope. This puts a limit as to how high the fountain of math can pump but it also limites the flow rate so the fountain continues to pump for all times.

[RyanJ]

http://tones.wolfram.com/generate/ may provie interesting

 

I always wondered weather it would be possible to make a musical computer... it probably is

 

Cheers,

 

Ryan Jones

[sunspot]

The computer could generate endless variations of notes and combinations of these notes and periodically it would come up with something special. Have it play in the background until sometime nice appears. The humans may start with these riffs and turn them into songs.

[Dark Photon]

a computer can creat enougth pieces of music until it has a elegant symphony, but it will never be able to dectent or understand its elegance. a human could compose a peice of music, and understand its inner elegance and its reflection of the divine.

 

thats what seperates us from the machines

[aj47]

I remember seeing a similar computer in the milllenium dome which constantly generated random music, never repeating itself.

 

I'm sure if I listened long enough there might of been snippets of music that I liked, but the majority was just really cheesy and got on my nerves. I guess it was a lot like the dome itself in that way.

[Rocket Man]

a computer making music is like the proposition of having an infinite number of monkeys on type writers and finding the script for hamlet among the nonsense.

highly improbable to get some coherent music from a random tone generator.

however there may be certain algorithms that might make decent patterns.

[bascule]

a computer can creat enougth pieces of music until it has a elegant symphony, but it will never be able to dectent or understand its elegance.

 

I beg to differ. Strong AI can do not only that, but it could do it better than a human.

[the tree]

however there may be certain algorithms that might make decent patterns.

There are loads, and loads of algorythms that can be used to create how movements. Whilst keeping within one key, and following some simple patterns along with a certain degree of randomness, you can't really go wrong. Admittedly, it would be completely lacking in soul but so does a lot of amatuer arrangements.

[abskebabs]

I beg to differ. Strong AI can do not only that, but it could do it better than a human.

how are you so sure?

[Paracat]

I beg to differ. Strong AI can do not only that, but it could do it better than a human.

 

 

I think music touches the soul, not the mind.An AI , no matter how high the level is, is still a soulless machine.

 

you can ,however, recreate the "emotions" in a robot.but its still not the same.

[the tree]

I think music touches the soul, not the mind. An AI, no matter how high the level is, is still a soulless machine.

Is that a problem? Mam Tor is a "souless" hill but the view from it could certainly "touch the soul" if there is such a thing.

[tomgwyther]

There's a computer program I have, it's called 'band in a box,' you simply input the chord structure and it will write solo melody or even polyphonic melody line over the top.

It realy is quite impresive, an untrained ear cannot tell the difference between the computer and a real soloist.

 

Mind you, one has to input the chord structure manually and moreover; music is all about projecting the thoughts and feelings of the performer to the mind of the listener.

A computer has no feelings therefore it cannot produce 'true art'

It has no life experience or emotional bagage or emotional highs to draw on for inspiration.

 

Let's hope they never make a machine that can write meaningfull tunes, I'll be out of a job!!

 

 

Britney Spears is probably a robot-cyborg, that's why her music sucks!

[alt_f13]

Let's hope they never make a machine that can write meaningfull tunes' date=' I'll be out of a job!!

[/quote']

 

Yah, this scares the hell out of me too, but give the computer the right tools, and allow it to make statistical choices based on a set of guidelines...

 

Then again, this could apply to fund allotment in government applications. It just depends on how much we, as the controllers, are willing to allow it.

 

I think music touches the soul, not the mind.An AI , no matter how high the level is, is still a soulless machine.

 

Music has nothing to do with 'the soul'; it merely exercises the part of our brain associated with speech in a way similar to how math problems, movies and playing football exercise other parts of our brain and give us pleasure. Yes, music appeals to emotion, but so do fractal images (flowers, trees...) and those are the product of math. Music is nothing more than math and statistics translated into tonality.

 

There's nothing metaphysical about it.

 

[edit]

 

And the first person that mentions God in the making of the flowers and the trees.... I swear....

[Paracat]

And the first person that mentions God in the making of the flowers and the trees.... I swear....

 

why...are you afraid of the truth:-p

[alt_f13]

Truth by whose definition, someone who studies actual data to create theories that can be tested by creating observable predictions or experiments, or someone that would believe in something, merely because that something calls itself true?

 

If it's that latter that you are referring to, you can keep it, and I wouldn't be afraid of that... I'd be afraid of those that believe it, because those are the ones willing to kill and die for their "truth."

[mooeypoo]

The "Twelve Tone Technique" (Dodecaphony) is a type of music that is actually based almost solely on mathematics.

 

When I was in my theory classes of my music major (yes, I played the trumpet.. so.. this one time.. in band camp...) we had a huge argument whether or not this should actually be concidered music, since it has so many rules it is quite hard to use free talent.

 

This argument lasted for a while, and was unresolved

 

still is quite nice to read about.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve-tone_technique

 

~moo

[mooeypoo]

BTW..

 

It sounds utterly disharmonic and crappy.

At least the ones I found (or tried to write.. though got a good grade on my own dodecaphonic composition.. dont ask me how.. i think the teacher just wanted it to end)

 

But.. uhm.. yes. I'll go back to my band camp

 

~moo