Phantom Itch!

[YT2095]

have you ever had an itch, gave it a quick rub/scratch only to find it`s Still there?

Unlike an ordinary itch where you Hit-The-Spot instantly and it`s gone, these are really Odd!

and after some considerable minutes it`s STILL THERE! so you you wriggle about a bit and find that the itch that you Thought was on you thigh or elbow, was Actualy in reality on your ankle or shoulder or even your Back!

 

somewhere along the line the signal gets mixed up, and the irritation is not in the place the brain "sees" it.

 

I`m 100% sure I`m not the only one this happens too as I`ve asked others and they get the same at times.

 

so what`s Actualy going on here?

[Phi for All]

I've definitely had this happen, and I've also pinched or scratched somewhere only to make it tingle or itch somewhere else. I wonder if that ties in with how accupuncture and accupressure use one point in the body to affect another point.

[5614]

so what`s Actualy going on here?

From personal experience I can safely say I have absolutely no idea! Although I know what you mean, do get it and it is very annoying!

[YT2095]

interesting you should mention that too, I occasionly see a little raised area on the top of my arm for instance (not Tattoos) and proceed to "Examine" it, then I get like a coresponding "Spike" sensation on my back or my leg or something, as if touching the ending of a "cross-wired" nerve, frequently I get fascinated by this and end up drawing blood too eventualy (not a good idea).

 

as for Acupuncture, I`m not sure, but it`s not outside the realms of possibilty!

[Kedas]

I`m 100% sure I`m not the only one this happens too as I`ve asked others and they get the same at times.

I'm also sure you are not the only crazy person.

 

I found there was in some case a link between the two points.

In many cases you can make those two places touch each other. (by bending)

This is most likely because the reason for the itch is easily shared by those two places.

 

It is maybe possible that the itch is there on two places but only one is noticed by the brain until that itch is gone.

 

And if all of this is wrong then you are just crazy

[YT2095]

well I`m perfectly fine with being called "Crazy" after enough times it becomes somewhat commonplace anyway

 

as for one part being able to touch another though??? I`m not in agreement with, an "Itch" on me Elbow corresponding to one on my Back may present certain problems in reaching it! (surgery excluded).

[Law]

not to scare u or anything but i saw somthing on TV just like that and it was parasites under his skin the name of them escapes me but they looked like worms almost but he couldnt see them

[Nevermore]

not to scare u or anything but i saw somthing on TV just like that and it was parasites under his skin the name of them escapes me but they looked like worms almost but he couldnt see them

That must be it! Yt, have you been kissing aliens?!?

[Royston]

How strange, I've just been experiencing a phantom itch then I viewed this thread.

 

It's on the underside of my knee, above the carf muscle. However the itch feels as though it's inside my leg, rather than on the surface of my skin. It also feels as though it's moving around a point, rather than on a specific point.

 

Nevertheless it makes me want to scratch the area under my knee.

[YT2095]

well I`m aware that a Nerve will actualy control AN area, the size of this area dependonds upon Where on the body it`s situated, for instance you`ll have nerves more densly packed on your lips, palms and soles of the feet (to name a few) and Less densly packed say on your Leg or the arm.

there is a graphic display of the proportions done to scale at equal spacing called the Homunculus(sp?) that illustrates this.

but the "Cross wiring" effect isn`t exactly clear though?

 

here`s a neat test to try, get 2 sharp(ish) pencils, and a friend, put your arm out and don`t look, get your friend to put the points of Both pencils on your arm, gradualy altering the distance between each pencil before he makes contact, you then tell him if you feel One or Two pencils touching you.

you`ll find that at a certain spacing you`ll only feel ONE point, but infact there are 2 points touching you.

 

experiment with this, it`s interesting

 

edit: here, I just found this check it out: http://staff.washington.edu/chudler/flash/hom.html

[Royston]

well I`m aware that a Nerve will actualy control AN area' date=' the size of this area dependonds upon Where on the body it`s situated, for instance you`ll have nerves more densly packed on your lips, palms and soles of the feet (to name a few) and Less densly packed say on your Leg or the arm.

there is a graphic display of the proportions done to scale at equal spacing called the Homunculus(sp?) that illustrates this.

but the "Cross wiring" effect isn`t exactly clear though?[/quote']

 

That would explain why you get pin prick type itches / sensations on your lips, soles of your feet et.c I like the link, luckily are bodies shape isn't proportianal to the density of our nerves.

 

Errr, not sure how to put this, does anyone get that sharp needle like pain around their rear exit passage...it never lasts that long, but it really makes you squirm. I know quite a lot of people that said they've had it a few times, but I've never known why in that particular spot, and what's the cause. Is it just because it's quite sensitive around that area ?

 

I think I'm tempting fate with that question.

 

I really seem to be lowering the tone today.

[YT2095]

I`ve personaly never has a Prick(ing) sensation around that area, but it Could any number of causes (some of which I`ll not go into but involve Pubic hair), certain Foods don`t quite digest as you`de like them to either, and can scrape a little, piles healing will itch and have a similar needle feel at times, if it`s not a Sharp and strong pain that lasts quite some time you can rule out inflamed prostate.

 

so it`s probably just one of those things, I shouldn`t worry about it

[Phi for All]

Errr, not sure how to put this, does anyone get that sharp needle like pain around their rear exit passage...it never lasts that long, but it really makes you squirm.

Only after having a Velcro-weed vindaloo.

[Royston]

so it`s probably just one of those things, I shouldn`t worry about it

 

Not worried about it at all...it's akin to hitting your funny bone (one of those stupid kind of pains), I know quite a few people that know exactly what I'm talking about, women included. It really makes you want to wiggle your bum around in an attempt to get rid of it. I'll see if I can find anything on it.

 

Sorry for going slightly off topic.

[Royston]

Only after having a Velcro-weed[/url'] vindaloo.

 

LOL, I don't even want to go in to the problems a velcro-vindaloo would cause.

[Kedas]

An other theory

 

We know the position of what we feel by assocation.

That kind of feeling corresponds to that location.

touch/feeling, your senses and location are learned and stored.

 

But what if there is something wrong with this data because it was wrongly learned.

reasons for bad assocation/learning

- Wrong learning due to bad functioning of the brain (tired,drug...)

- And the difficult learnings like when two places touch each other what is the location of that feeling.

[peledan]

How strange, I've just been experiencing a phantom itch then I viewed this thread.

 

It's on the underside of my knee, above the carf muscle. However the itch feels as though it's inside my leg, rather than on the surface of my skin. It also feels as though it's moving around a point, rather than on a specific point.

 

Nevertheless it makes me want to scratch the area under my knee.

 

Hi snail,

I'm having the EXACT same symptom as you described, even at the same place. It started about a month ago, and itches about once a day.

Do you still have it?

[spooky]

Maybe its like yawning and if you talk about it, it make you aware of it and want to yawn?

 

or maybe its an overload for the receptors of your body? I cant remember the details fully but its some kinda thing that blocks too many messages going through at once...(like with your elbow)...maybe theres some sort of thing with that?

 

what kind of places are you guys in when this happens? sitting or standing for long periods of time?

 

here`s a neat test to try, get 2 sharp(ish) pencils, and a friend, put your arm out and don`t look, get your friend to put the points of Both pencils on your arm, gradually altering the distance between each pencil before he makes contact, you then tell him if you feel One or Two pencils touching you.

you`ll find that at a certain spacing you`ll only feel ONE point, but infact there are 2 points touching you.

 

Done this ^.^ but to eliminate some of the human factors, we used a ruler and toothpicks. Taping the tooth picks to the ruler.

 

This was all done at school, we were testing the sensitivity of the inside and outside of our forearms...well lets just say it was a chance to inflict pain on each other...cause we were using cold and hold probes on our arms.

[Glider]

It's down to convergence. There are 31 pairs of spinal nerves. These spinal nerves contain both afferent (sensory) & efferent (motor) nerves which split into the dorsal & ventral roots (respectively) as they enter/leave the vertebra.

 

Each pair of spinal nerves innervate a limited area of the body called a dermatome (see image: from Kalat, 1992). The equivalent segmentation is also found in the motor system (muscles). These are called myotomes. This pattern of innervation is left over from when we were segmented worms.

 

Anyway, long story short, the afferent nerves converge on their way to the brain. They enter the dorsal horn of the spinal cord and converge on projection neurons. These send information up the spine to the thalamus where they converge further.

 

Occasionally, hyperstimulation of one point in a dermatome can trigger a convergent neurone in such a way that the brain interprets the signal as coming from another area served by the same convergent neurone.

 

A similar phenomenon is responsible for referred pain. In this case, stimulation of deeper nerves can result in sensation apparently from surface nerves in the same dermatome. The brain is unused to recieving sensory information from internal organs (they are innervated, but comparitively poorly). So, when some internal region gets irritated (say, the diaphragm), the brain interprets the signal as having come from an area of skin innervated by the same convergent neuron becuase generally, the source of the signal is more commonly skin and those pathways are more strongly reinforced.

 

In the case of diaphragmatic irritation, the sensation appears to come from the point of the shoulder. Another example is the sharp pain in the left arm and wrist during a heart attack, although nothing happens in those areas to cause the pain, but the brain is unused to recieving sensory information from the heart. Another example is lumbar/hip pain (say, an arthritic hip) can result in pain being located at the front of the knee (and not in the hip).

[Royston]

Do you still have it?

 

Thankfully no...this thread was started over a year ago

 

I actually can't remember the last time I felt that sensation...perhaps I've broken my spine and I'm blissfully unaware.

[witsend]

Seems like Glider you know a lot about our body, maybe you can help me out with this:

Over a year ago, my ex-fiance and I started to feel like bugs crawling on our body. We first thought we had ticks, fleas, bed bugs etc etc. But we checked everything we could with doctors, onlilne...but nothing came up. Then we thought back the timing and remember our landlord cleaned the carpet stain with some chemicals so maybe we are allergic to that. But the weird thing is: it's been a year and we have gone our separate ways, we still feel it occasionally. And the last time it happened to me was when I vistied my folks in Asia and I was using my mom's computer. I started to feel those "phantom bugs" again! And now that I had those sensation from my folks' place, I start feeling it again at my place (I am living on my own now). No one ever visited us feels those bugs. So it's not really bugs that will infest other people either. We are totally at our witsend not knowing how we can stop this suffering. Any ideas? It seems the common denominators are: using computer for a while, sitting on a leather chair, under the chair it's dark. But once I have it from the desk, I sometimes feel it too when I am sitting on my couch; even in my bed. But when I am out and about, I don't feel anything. Neither does he. If we are carrying the bugs with us, how come we dont' feel it outside of home? and how come those bugs don't crawl on other people? We really dont' think it's bugs. We just have no idea what it is. Could you help?

[Glider]

I know a little about the normal functioning of the body (as opposed to clinical pathology), but I'm afraid I know nowhere near enough to be able to make diagnoses, especially on-line. The only thing I can suggest is that you make an appointment (perhaps through your doctor) to see a dermatologist.

 

It's possible that you may have developed a sensitivity to something in the environment through exposure to a sensitising agent. However, I'm not sure carpet stain remover qualifies.

 

There are some chemicals which release vapours that can sensitize a person, who may then go on to develop an allergy to some innocuous element in their environment (some anti-rot wood treatments contain such chemicals). However, the use of those substances is usually controlled and people have to move out for 48 hours if it's being used in their homes, so as I say, it's unlikely to be a domestic carpet cleaner, although not impossible. It depends what chemicals your landlord used.

 

In any event, a dermatologist could provide you with a battery test for allergens to find out if you have developed a particular sensitivity.

 

Sorry I can't be of more help.